CosmicBills

It is not an atrocious deal when you consider the QBs available in FA this coming season and the QBs in the draft. There are none that have the potential that JP does. Zero. To give up 2 picks and address your teams biggest weakness (as percieved by some) is nothing. If JP turns out to be a probowler would you still consider this an awful trade?

Dax, I'm still waiting for your list. I'm not picking a fight or saying you are wrong, just curious as to who you would put and where Manning ranks.

So, let's just get this straight. You say the trade for Drew was a "huge error". But you fault TD for trying to rectify it by making a move to get the best possible QB available in the draft for the cost of only 2 picks? So how would you suggest he fix the QB problem one without getting a new QB? You're getting him both ways. You can't do that and be fair. Come on, use your head a little before making claims like that.

Another good point. But two qualities trancend throughout eras: Leadership and Clutch. Everyone on that list has both of those qualities. Manning certainly has leadership, but so far he is not clutch.

Of course. You are absolutely right. I personally like Manning a lot. I think he is a true professional and (seems to be at least) a genuine nice guy. And I root for him to do well (and have done so since his days back in Tenn). But he always comes up short in the big games. He has since college. I think it's a mental hurdle that he has impossed on himself. That's why I don't agree with the Elway compairson. Elway always came up in the big games...even when his team lost. When Manning has played in the big games his team has given him a chance and he just comes up short.

No he's not. And that is his biggest weakness. Manning has never been able to win with the big game. He out-thinks himself. That's his flaw. He can prove me wrong with a SB ring. And I am cheering for him to do so.

Brady won 2 superbowls with less talent on offense than Manning has ever had. His numbers are impressive but more so is his clutch performances in big games. You have to give him honorable mention. Especially if he wins another one.

Unless he can show me he can win a big game, he won't make that spot: Top 5 (in no particular order): Elway Montana Farve Johnny U Bradshaw Honorable Mention: Kelly Young Namath Aikman Brady/Marino So that's 10 people I have ahead of him as a QB. To be a QB you have to win big games and lead your team. Manning is not yet in any of these people's leagues in that regard. If he can win a SB then he will get in the top 10, if he can win 2 then he will be in the top 5 for sure. Tell me anyone of those 5 or 10 people you would put Manning above and tell me why.

Greatest passer? Probably. Greatest QB? No. Not even in the top 5 all time.

The other thing I would throw into your post (which I agree alot with) is that a big reason the turn around is taking so long is because TD missed on Drew slightly. He expected (and so did I for one) Drew to come in and be the probowler he was in NE from the start. He didn't forsee a decline in Drew's performance. This misjudgment, coupled with the poor offensive staff of Killdrive's, forced TD to go back to the drawing board at the QB position earlier than TD had expected. He obvioulsy didn't expect Drew to be the long term solution at QB, but he did expect a couple playoff runs from him. Now, with a better offensive system in place, Drew has been decent to good for parts of this year. But a big upcoming hurdle this team will have to clear to reach the championship level you is how to handle JP without falling into another another "rebuilding" year. Of course, if Drew continues to play as well as he has down this current stretch, the Bills should be in great shape heading into 2005 and a run at the Super Bowl isn't out of the question. But then you have to wonder...what happens in 2006? Say the Bills make it deep into the playoffs in 2005 with Drew as the starter...do you keep JP on the bench for another year? Or do you do what Cincy did and replace Drew with JP right then and there? And what effect will that have on the team's chemistry? It's an interesting personel decision that will be coming up soon for TD. How he (and MM) handle that situation will be very telling.

You raise good points. I don't think the issue of being "fair" to Henry will enter much into TD's mindset. He is going to be looking for the best possible situation for the club. If that means a second round pick, then by all means I think he would do it. If he can't get a good pick in return, Trav's cap number being what it is will allow TD the flexibility to retain Henry till the end of his contract and give the Bills a top notch backup to Willis. Getting a conditional pick is an excellent idea that I hadn't thought of. I can see TD pulling the trigger on a conditional pick, but the other team would also have to give up a pick in this year's draft no lower than the 3rd round in my opinion. I only say this because in everything I have ever read from TD he has made it clear that he feels having two quality backs is crucial. Now, he may have been saying that to make Trav and Willis feel better about the current situaion, but who knows.

The funny thing is the more JJ gets hurt, the lower his price tag goes. He still hasn't been able to stay healthy at all this year. I think that helps the Bills in terms of negotiating a new contract. Coming into this season I didn't think there was any way JJ would be back. But now...there is a chance. Forget TE, the number one offensive upgraded needed this offseason remains the OL. A new LT, depth and possible a new LG will be needed and sought out. Tucker is great at providing depth, but if TD can find a better LG or LT (assuming JJ leaves) that has to be priority number 1. How do you know Henry will cause issues? I agree that a GM will make an offer for Trav (probably several) but any hopes of getting a second rounder probably went out the window with his injury. The best shot will be Philly (with a low second rounder) but Westbrook has proven himself a capable every down back this year and they might not want to spring for such a trade. Unless someone comes up with a second round offer, I honestly believe TD will keep Trav on the roster as a back up. It's unfair to Travis, but that's the way it is. There is nothing in Travis's past that indicates he will be a problem or distraction so I don't know what you are basing your opinion on. Vincent won't be cut. The cap hit would be too much. If nothing else, his leadership does tons for the young DBs on the roster. And when he comes back he will allow TM to move back to the nickle where he is best. Again, Lindell won't be replaced. They signed him to a huge deal and the cap hit will be too great. He has been fine this season. I agree with you that you cannot develop a QB on the bench. But that doesn't much matter because MM doesn't care. MM will not be interested in developing JP at the cost of the 2005 season. He cares about winning. If Drew and the team go 10-6 or 9-7 this year then there is absolutely no way JP is the opening day starter. Drew would have one more shot at the starting job (and rightfully so) but he would be on a short leash. Another 0-2 start would probably prompt a change. But the fact is that Drew, in MM's mind and anyone who thinks objectivly) will provide the Bills the best shot in 2005. However, if the Bills fall to 8 losses and JP comes in and plays well, then I think they go into camp as equals and whoever has the best camp wins the job. Still, with the remaining schedule I don't see the Bills winning any less than 9 games.

I know going into the season, based on last season's records, the Bills had one of the toughest schedules in the league. I'm not sure where they rank now. However, based on the current W/L the Bills have the second easiest remaining schedule. So 10-6 isn't out of the picture.

He had 610 coming into this game. So I think he is at 726 now with 7 TDs

I agree. I wasn't trying to imply I was dissappointed in WM at all. Just saying that he may never be the speed back that he was in college, no matter what he says. But even if that's the case, he is still going to be a very good back in this league for a very long time

Listening to the pre-game show this morning Murph said he had dinner with John Clayton Saturday night. Apparently during dinner Clayton told Murph that Willis has had the ugliest 100 yard games of any back he had ever seen. :I starred in Brokeback Mountain: Clayton! lol We have to be prepared for the fact that Willis may never get that burst back. He says he is 96 percent and we have to take his word for it, but we should be preparing for the possiblity that he is all the way back right now. Even if that's the case, he is still a damn good back now. I would compair his style to a cross between Gayle Sayers and Terrel Davis. He is very patient, yet strong. The only thing he lacks (at the moment...I hope) is Sayer's speed. But you're right, it's tough to find someone he is akin to.

But it doesn't matter what we think, it matters what MM thinks. You know? If the Bills go 10-6 or 9-7 MM will want to BUILD on this season which means giving Drew another shot (even if it is on a short leash). If he hands the reigns over to JP after going 10-6 he would essentially be starting over and destroying all the momentum that was built in 04. It's a dicey proposition, one which MM won't make I think.

I say this with absolutely nothing more than an amature knowledge of the salary cap: No way Moulds is cut. He will restructure or they will keep him where he is at. From the little I know, the Bills have enough cap left to sign rookies next year and resign either JJ or P-Diddy. Also I read somewhere that the new Television deal will raise the cap by a larger amount than previously expected...giving the Bills even more room to keep E happy.

If the Bills finish 9-7 or 10-6 I won't care much if they don't make the playoffs. To have a winning season after starting 0-4 will be reward enough (for this year) and set things on the right track for 05.

Don't we have 5 games left?

Rumor has it that Holmgren might end up in Miami next year with Shawn Alexander. If that's the case, hopefully this is just a glimpse of what MM has in store for Holmgren next year as well I am with you. I am getting pumped. I don't care about the playoffs at the moment because they are such a reach. I am just amped to see the Bills playing such good football. Everything is falling right for them at the moment. Even (as you pointed out earlier) Big Mike has come on! Trav is a good player and a great Bill. He has handled the situation with class and dignity. I hope the break isn't bad and he can heal up quick. Frankly I hope they do trade him only because he deserves to start somewhere. And I will root for him to succeed...just not when he plays the Bills

Ooooh, I got you now. I didn't realize SD had such a tough stretch ahead. Hmmm...this will be very interesting then. Thanks for the info.

Is a SD win really that bad? It doesn't matter so long as Denver keeps losing right? I mean, someone in the West has to win the division, had SD lost to KC it may have allowed KC to creep back into the wildcard hunt, giving the Bills another team to worry about. Instead, SD took a big step towards securing the West. Let 'em have it. Or am I missing something?

I don't care who the QB is as long as the team is winning. That being said, if the Bills did make the playoffs (which I really think is next to impossible at the moment) and Drew had a terrible game, he would still be the starter next year. Give him another shot with MM's system with a year's expierence under his belt. Besides, if he did lead the Bills to the postseason (even if he lost that playoff game) it would have meant the team went 10-2 down the stretch...that alone is worthy of another shot in my view. Losman will get his chance, but it may not be until 06 given your scenario.

Yup. It's human nature. I feel for him too and I wasn't even there