Bob in STL

Once your cut your cut. No level of intensity on the cutting. Just cut or not cut. Maybe the news wire report can put it in BOLD and say they were cut, not waived?

^ this is the best post in the thread ^ Troup had a good rookie season. Better than his peers in the draft draft. It is typical for a DL to take awhile to develop and play at a higher level. There is tons of evidence out there to prove it. It is not like Troup was a blue chip prospect from a big school that was plugged into a top notch defense. That would be Mr. Cody who by the way was so fat and out of shape he could not get on the field. Troup will be a very good player for us. Carrington is more of a project than Troup. Last years NFL draft class "seems to be" weak? Yet for the Bills this may be a decent draft. We have had way too many poor drafts to endure another bad one. I will agree that both Troup and Carrington were "need picks" driven by coaches the foolish plan to switch to the 3-4 without knowing what little they had in the front seven.

Yes. Jets won. Fair and square.

Great intro ... This story wins for being the most authentic Buffalo. You can fill in the blank with anything after that. Cox would have died in the parking lot that day. No doubt.

To answer your question, the last time we traded down was 2001. The Bills traded their first-round selection (14th overall, used to select Kenyatta Walker) to Tampa Bay for their first-round selection (21st overall, used to select Nate Clements). They then traded their newly acquired second-round selection (51st overall, used to select Paul Toviessi) to Denver for their second-round selection (58th overall, used to select Travis Henry) and their fourth-round selection (110th overall, used to select Brandon Spoon). The Bills also had a 46th pick in the 2nd and selected Aaron Schoebel. Of the five players - Walker (14- TB), Clements (21-Buf), Schoebel (46-Buf), Toviessi (51-Denver), and Henry (58-Buf) all five of the Buffalo players played in a Pro Bowl. Walker lasted 6 seasons and never was able to be the solid LT that Tampa Bay was looking for. Clements played for 5 years in Buffalo and was a Pro Bowler in 2004. In 2007 Clements became the highest paid defensive player in NFL history after signing an eight-year, $80 million with $22 million guaranteed deal with the San Francisco 49ers. He had many injuries and never played to the level he did as Bill. Schoebel played his entire career with the Bills, retiring in 2010. He made Pro Bowls in 06 and 07. he is one of the all time leaders in games played for a defensive linemen and also in sacks. Toviessi was injured as a rookie and never played a down in the NFL Henry made the Pro Bowl as a Bill in 2002. He was traded to the Titans in 2005 for a 3rd round pick (lost his job to McGahee in 2004) and also played for the Broncos. He never reached the same level as his early days with the Bills. He also had significant off field issues.

All NFL teams are businesses. All good businesses have business models. If you want to talk to a good business man then Ralph is your man. He is been there longer and has made much money. Your statement on his wanting to win is an opinion. Your "analysis" ignores historical data which shows he had two AFL championships and then the 4 straight AFC titles. I believe that he wants to win; he is just not very good at achieving that "business goal".

Last year we had ZERO cheap veterans that can in and were servicable. Cheap and filled a slot -yes, they did do hat. Cornel Grenn was worse at RT than an UDFA. Andra Davis actually made Poz look good in pass coverage. Dwan Edwards was ok, maybe serviceable, but not good enough to pressure a QB. Torbor and Adeleye - part of the worst LB core maybe in the history of the team. Sad thing is that we are far under the old cap. The rebuild will take much longer without using Free Agency to fill a few holes. Remember that the Pats* had a lot of tier 2 free agents the year the stole the Super Bowl from the Rams. OK - They also had a strong base of talent that was built throught the draft but still, the Bills need to get seriuos about improving this moribund franchise. That means take advantage of ALL ways to improve the team. That is what Buddy said. He said they will always be looking to improve the talent ... I guess to him that means raiding other teams practice squads and scouring the waiver wires. I sure hopes he doesn't sleep through another free agency. Bring in a decent veteran RT, a TE that can play, and one solid LB/DL and then we have some flexibility to draft the BPA at draft slot #3. This is football, not rocket science.

The Bills have had been in chaos since John Butler left. Three GMs and 5 coaches later we are still looking for a QB and we have less talent than we had 10 year ago. The Patriots have endured changes by being so sucessful. The have impressed me by grooming replacement coaches and front office people, almost all from within. They have drafted wisely and used free agency to perfection. Their ability to unload players and stockpile draft picks is unmatched. Sure, drafting Brady at 6 was luck but with all the continuous smart moves they make it should not surprise us that that they will find players in any round. At the top of it is Belichek. He seems to run everything and no one in the league plans better or has the attention to detail that he has.

These are all valid points. Everyone knows Fitz is not as accurate as the top QBs. You don't need to analyze stats to see that. His is also constantly under pressure and threw to a very young corp of receivers. By the last 3 or 4 games he had very little to work with. He played better in mid season when we had Evans and Roscoe and Stevie. That should not surprise anyone.

This "platter of BS" was not served up by OBD. Read the original link.

I recall several experts in the media blastig Buffalo for their gm selection process. Whaley was one of the bright young guns that was mentioned as worthy of an interview. Glad we have him.

Unfortunately you are probably correct. I just hope Buddy doesn't brag about it this time. Still, I think they need to look at and address improvements at OT, LB and TE. They cannot fix everything in this draft. Look at the production we got from Troup and Carrington. Not very much until the end of the season. Moats and Coleman would not have even played if it were not for injuries. We need to bring in a few veterans at the right price.

Well John McCargo, Aaron Maybin and Leodis McKelvin do not look anything close to Bruce Smnith, Cornelius Bennett or Nate Odomes. They are not as good as Mike Lodish, Marvcus Patton or Kirby Jackson. We really need to draft defense.

The players that Fewell had were at least drafted for the defense he was running. Edwards was asked to run a 3-4 without the right personel. When they adjusted and used more 4-3 fronts they improved some, at least for a short stretch. The Bills were really hurting at LB this year. Other than Poz, none of the LBs that finished the season were starters in the first game. That said, I think most would agree that Fewell did an outstanding job and that Edwards has a long way to go to get to Fewell's level as a DC. I just don't see Chan dumping Edwards and I sure don't see Ralph paying for a big name DC.

Agree. First of all Chan does not strike me as a guy who will bring in a DC and fore him in one year, especially with the lack of talent we have on defense. Next, a top notch DC in the NFL probably makes as much or more than what Ralph is paying Chan.

Ouch. That hurt bkc. So Brett Favre is gettting sued for being, well uhm, Brett Favre. I am sure these ladies are doing it to enhance women journalists all across the land. Two full years of pain and suffering to cash in on. Brett deserves it.

I usually ignore the "Kill Modrak" posts but this one needs help. Flowers was drafted by John Butler, Modrak did nto even work for the Bills at the time. Clements was drafted by Donahoe and he was a good player. Evans is also a good player. Williams, McGahee, Evans, Losman and Parish - all Donahoe picks (Modrak worked for Donahoe) After Donahoe came the Levy era came and a draft by committee format. The "inner circle", as they were called, did the drafting and they consisted of Levy, Jauron, Brandon and Wilson. They drafted Whitner, McCargo, Lynch and McKelvin. All of these picks are suspect IMO. The inner circle did not include Modrak until the next draft which was 2009 - Maybin and Wood. Modrak has gone on record as lobbying for Cushing, not Maybin with the first pick. Jauron has been blamed for the Maybin pick. The Nix era, starting in 2010, drafted Spiller. To calll Spiller a terrible pick may be premature at this time. Bottom line is that three GMs - Donahoe, Levy and Nix, have all kept modrak in place. Wilson has allowed it. The Bills first round draft performance has been abymsal. Modrak should get some of the blame but not all. Wilson and the GM's are even more at fault.

We only need 7 more players to improve our front 7! It hurts but it's funny too. I think that Williams, Moats, Troup and Carrington are all in the mix as rotational players.

+ 1. But not sure we can count on Merriman.

Improving will take replacing todays bad players with better players. Sure, go ahead and sign these four but then please bring in three better players because that is the only way to improve is to improve. It been so bad for so long that Buffalo fans actually think that Batten (never played in the NFL), Merriman (injured and highly questionable), Poz (cannot cover and is average at best) and, Moats (still a work inprocess) is actually a good quartet? I expect to see an OLB and a ILB drafted in the first 4 rounds. I also hope we bring in some help via free agency.

Just what did you see in Moats and Carrington to predict dominance? Even Kyle Williams, while a very good player, is not dominant.

I have to agree as well. Keep tham but don't overpay and don't hesitate to replace them with better players. We cannot keep filling the same holes over anbd over. Especially when we will not spend money in free agency. The Bills are the poster child for UDFAs and others teams practice squad players.

Having a hard time finding any correlation here? Beside that, Nix was a scout for the Chargers, not the GM. Butler ran that draft and the team. Butler built the Chargers in the early days, and was followed by AJ Smith. Not to discount Nix's ability as a scout but the man has never been in charge of football operations at the NFL level. We also do not know if he has a plan. He is a good football scout that Wilson knows and is comfortable with. That is it so far.

The majority of the top QBs are in the Manning/Brady mold and Newton is not that. Newton is a risk but the upside is collosal. I will leave that pick to the experts but I think Fairley is a beast on the DL and could see him contributing right away and being an impact player down the road.

Can't believe you guys are predicting right now? I prefer to wait and see what we do in free agency and in the draft. If we can get a pass rusher and some serious help against the run we will improve.