newcam2012

It's not. I never said it was.

It wasn't Kincaid's fault at all. It was on Josh to continue taking what the Jets were giving him. I thought he did a good job of that in the first half. Obviously, the rails come off in the second half. I'm just merely pointing the Bills pass catchers were plenty open for very short passes. I think it was the Jets strategy to somewhat give Allen those short throws. Force him to get frustrated and make mistakes. So in essence, I'm asking how effective were Knox and Kincaid if they Jets were playing soft on them?

Lack of understanding? Really? Do you know that the Jets were basically giving or daring the Bills to throw short passes all day? That includes short passes to Knox and Kincaid. Do you understand that? I'm sure the Jets were satisfied with the results of the Bills TE results.

I acknowledged that the Jets defense is very good. So I did put it in proper perspective. Didn't you think LaPorta looked good vs the Chiefs? Based on your theory, how should Kincaid do vs the Raiders? Any predictions? I say 5 catches for 68 yards and a TD. Excellent day. I believe he will be more featured because Knox will be used to help out Brown vs Crosby.

Me too. I talk plenty positives as well. Especially, in the live game time threads. I recognize Bills players good plays.

Vice versa. How was I negative? What did I say that was inaccurate about Kincaid? Let's gets some supporting evidence please?

Your example of Chase and Moore are terrible. Chase is a proven commodity and Elijah more has played 29 games. It's not even in the same stratosphere as what I was saying. I compared Kincaid to LaPorta and Musgrave who have all played 1 game. Do the math. Did you see where I agreed with the previous poster's positive statements? Did you see where I said Kincaid didn't play bad? I guess that didn't fit your narrative. I guess I have a difficult time accepting and listening to all the Kincaid hype. It's been a constant theme on this forum from pretty much day one. Look I want the guy to be better than Kelce. However, I need to see something on the field. The Jets game was encouraging but far from awe inspiring either. The other tight ends drafted behind him looked as good or better than him. Not saying Kincaid won't be the better pro. Not saying he won't be an all pro. Not saying he won't be elite. I'm saying let the guy prove it on the field. Let's see what kind of positive impact he can have. I don't see all the hype after the Jet performance. Yes it's one game vs a tough Jet D. I get that. There were things to like that Kincaid did. And no I'm not getting all worked up after one game. That's your incorrect interpretation. You want to talk about being logical but then you make the illogical conclusions and judgements. Got it!

I can take a cue. Thanks. No offense taken. Time to button up.

You definitely misread what I said. I am not in the camp that Allen sucks. Without Allen this team isn't a playoff team. Or at best a fringe playoff team. 100% he has carried the team. Allen is a top 5 QB and probably a top 3 QB in the entire NFL. He is likely the most physically gifted of everyone. However, I think it's ok to question your franchise QB. I think a QB can always get better and improve. That's where I believe the Allen topic becomes relevant. How much has he improved from a couple of years ago? Are the turnovers still an issue! Has he improved in reading defenses? Accuracy? Leadership? Playoff wins? I don't have all the answers and frankly lots of answers I don't know. As a fan, without digging too deep I feel like sometimes we see too much of the bad Allen. Sometimes I joke with my son and say I hope we get the great Allen today. His ceiling is super high but that floor is low for a franchise QB. Granted all QBs have bad games. But the Jets game was something worse then a bad game. It looked like a rookie version of Allen. Happy feet, eyes all over the place, missing his reads, playing hero ball, panicked, and being worst than reckless. It was hard to watch. I fully expect Allen to bounce back and play well. He will lead the team to many wins. He will be the main reason why the Bills win. Make no mistake about it. The team only goes as far as Allen takes it. I fully believe that. He has to play at a high level against quality teams. I'm one happy fan to have Allen in a Bills uniform. He doesn't suck but he surely can play sucky. When he dies he isn't immune to criticism. The Bill lost in Monday because of Josh. It's really that simple. He gave the gave away.

I get that but you have to be somewhat concerned about all of his turnovers. It's more than a one off. Also, Allen is 0-5 in OT games as a Bill QB. I'm not sure exactly what that means. Elite franchise QBs have to be clutch and win OT games. This far, it appears Allen hasn't got it done. Is he really that clutch when the game is on the line? I always thought he was.

"He who laughs last laughs the loudest."

I agree Scott but I wasn't talking about this single play. I was talking in general terms. I'm a big Allen fan but I'm starting to question his vision a little bite. I don't think all the turnovers are from trying to play hero ball. I think he might be have no trouble processing certain zone coverages. Maybe I'm wrong here but I'm starting to get that impression. Another poster talked about how he is slower to process defenses than other elite QBs.

Maybe someone with more knowledge can explain why the Bills didn't use the slot WRs more. I thought that was the best way to attack the Jet D. I expected to see a lot of quick short slants and crossing patterns.

Want til you see Max Crosby take him to the woodshed. Bills better have a plan to help out Brown. If not Crosby might have 5 sacks.

I think there are two issues in play. 1. Allen doesn't trust his oline and feels a need to bail out of the pocket early and play scramble football. 2. I think Allen is having difficulty quickly reading defenses.

Mahomes only needed Kelce and one leg.

I reread what you said and my responses to it. I was wrong and took what you said out of context. I apologize for me immaturity. I lashed out on you without provacation. One again, I do apologize.

The juices have been flowing ever since he was drafted to be honest. Looking back and rereading the posts you are correct. I owe NewEra an apology. I will do so.

I don't disagree with any of this. I'm not saying Kincaid looked bad. I'm just saying his role, results, and stats were nothing to indicate he's the next Kelce. It was acceptable for his first game. He can improve and hopefully get more involved in the game plan. Or he can be non significant and largely a non significant factor like he was vs the Jets. I'd give Kincaid an overall B to B minus grade for his first game. D grade for stats and results. Take a look at the LaPorta's and Musgrave's first games. They were statistically better than Kincaid's. Just something to think about. Watching the Chiefs game and I specifically remember LaPorta making some nice plays. He stood out to me way more than Kincaid. Ask yourself why? Is he better than Kincaid? Nope and nope and nope. It's offensive coaching, schemes, and play calling. I have serious doubts Dorsey can utilize Kincaid to the best of his ability. Josh is a whole nother story too. In my humble opinion Bills fans are largely looking for anything good to get excited by Kincaid. The Jets game is a great example of this.

New era is drooling. It's not hard to be better or more reliable than Davis. That's not saying much. I never implied he won't. All I'm saying is Bills fans are so quick to declare new draft picks as gold. It's a pretty common theme. IMHO, if anyone deserves some accolades early it's Torrence. He really held up well vs the tough Jets Dline.

You should be a little more realistic with what you see. You might not sound so foolish. Bottom line in 4-4 26 yards. Go ahead and tell yourself lies. He's the WR I really wanted even though he's small. He looks the part so far. He's exactly the type of WR the Bills needed. Not a TE who they are basically using as a WR. I don't blame Beane because the draft didn't materialize where they could grab a WR of value. They got the best TE in the board but others like LaPorta and Musgrave were highly rated. Both of them look good after their first game.

What good are they if they don't get targeted? Something has to change because what happened didn't work. Ever think the Bills were playing soft on the Bills TEs and basically giving up the 4 yards a catch? Ever think the route running by both TEs wasn't anything special because the Jets are softer in the middle? Ever think the Jets weren't worried about shutting down Knox and Kincaid? Whatever you think the TE play statistically had little effect on the game. The Jets seemingly were not worried about Kincaid. He was an afterthought by the Jets and Allen. I think any team will happy with limiting a TE to 4-4 and 26 yards. Yet Bills fans are so encouraged by that performance. IMHO, it's fans hoping for the best. Nothing more than that. I'll wait for some real production, game changing plays, big first downs, and TDs before I anoint Kincaid the next coming. Hopefully, he has a great game vs the Raiders.

I'm not denying that. I'm just amazed at how some are salivating over Kincaid's first game. I'm mean let's get real! It wasn't special or memorable. It was average and ok. Good at best. Four catches and 26 yards and some fans are doing backflips and somersaults.

Ok if you say so. He looked average to me. He looked insignificant to me. He wasn't a weapon. He basically did nothing to impact the game. The stats back that up. Him getting open could mean the Jets didn't consider him a threat. I'd disregard offensive players too if they aren't targeted. If he was to become a threat maybe he doesn't get as open. Look I think he has a lot of potential. He might be very good. But the Jet performance and impact was minimal.

Agree but there's no way you can declare Kincaid had an elite performance. He wasn't impactful no matter who is to blame . That's really the bottom line. He caught 4 balls for 26 yards. LaPorta and Musgrave had better games statistically. Seems like some Bills fans want to wish Kincaid as elite . Let's wait and see because the Jets game was just average.