Beck Water

Initially, Josh said eventually it would get to a point where he wouldn't have to worry about it any more. More recently, he said it was something they would have to manage for the forseeable future My concern is that it has to do with a hard helmet he took to his elbow during a run. He's been wearing a brace to protect his elbow. This week and I think last week he was not wearing the brace.

I don't know of such a site, but it's not hard to pull them out of the box scores on Pro-football-reference. Do it on a computer or other program where you can search, and search for "fumbles" and "aborted"

The big difference between this year and last, are fumbles on the QB-C exchange. There have been 4 of these, either while Morse has been out, or when he's returned with an elbow injury. One resulted in a TD for the opponent Breakdown: QB-C exchange (aka aborted snap) 4 Strip sack 6 Run 2 One of the fumbles on a run resulted in a TD for us - Josh picked it up and went on to score. One of the aborted snaps, as we all know, resulted in a TD for Minn. A couple of the strip sacks were a result of a whiffed block, not necessarily by an OLman. But at least half are Josh trying to extend plays.

He took a pretty hard helmet hit right on his elbow during one of his runs Might have been a bad move to take the brace off just yet

I don't think that at all. It's one thing to be able to run and even do a ladder agility drill. It's another thing to have the muscle built back up to where he can cut and stop without possible re-injury It's possible in theory but, at the time he was first injured there were some articles about similar injuries where the WR came back quickly and was not able to be as effective Pretty sure I read all about how Hamlin totally sucks and is a liability, elsewhere on this site

LOL did you read the article? The study is comparing games played at or below 50 degrees F vs games played at 70 F

An infinite # of times when said people are functionally trolls who are here to stir *****....... It has nothing to do with living in Amherst. I used to live right down the street from SUNY Amherst and I understood lake effect snow.

Since the NFL doesn't GAF about player safety from heat stroke (as witness the sideline in Miami) what makes you think they will GAF about dangerous wind-chill?

Actually I think only 1 of our 6 losses last year was a blowout (Colts game). The rest were one score games, 2 were games a FG would have tied. Apparently mentioning the Devil's Lettuce is an excellent way to ensure that it becomes the topic of discussion, and your football thoughts flitter away with little remark

Agree completely Exactly. The Bills punted 5 times and had a strip-sack fumble where Josh was trying to extend the play. We ended the game with an absolutely BRILLIANT ~6 minute, 15 play drive. But get points on even 1 or 2 of those drives that ended in punts, and we're just eating clock on that last drive, not depending upon it to win. No one said anything about "without moving".

Dude! Warner understands man zero. Do you seriously think you see things on film that a HOF QB is missing? Really? His point is - there isn't a free blitzer, there's a spy. You have a point that our blocking is not bulletproof, but they were good enough to give Allen time for a quick shot all game. "Manipulate the spy and take the quick shot to the RB" is a realistic option with the blocking time our guys are able to give. Rolling right out of the pocket to give the spy a clear path at the QB has its own risks.

If you're talking about the first play Warner diagrams, which was the Bills 2nd drive, it's 1st and 10 to McKenzie and that's Diggs at the sticks. Warner's point is that by the time Allen manipulates the CB with his eyes to come up on Diggs and open McKenzie, the safety has closed. You're also I think missing Warner's point about Allen moving right. His point is that because there's a guy spying Allen, when Allen rolls right unnecessarily (protection is good), he takes the spy right into Singletary's path and cancels what would otherwise be an easy throw over the middle of the field with lots of space for Singletary to get the touch. Count noses: Warner is correct, there is absolutely NOBODY HOME who could prevent it, IF Allen stays in the pocket and maybe even looks left a little to freeze the spy. It's great Allen completes the "dime" to Morris, and it's 1st and 10 so as long as Allen doesn't throw a pick we have 2 more shots if he doesn't. But it's no way poor analysis by Warner. We complain all the time about our drives in the red zone stalling out and having to settle for FG. Warner is correctly pointing out the easy shot the play is designed to scheme open against that defense, and how Allen is taking that very easy shot away from himself by rolling to the R when he doesn't have to. You don't have to agree with Warner all the time (I don't), but I'm surprised you can't even be open minded enough to give him a full listen. He 100% Knows His Ball. He watches Josh Allen a lot - I would say at this point he's even somewhat fascinated with Allen because of Josh's abilities to do things he knows he couldn't have done. But that doesn't mean he doesn't see different choices Allen could make that would be easier and sometimes higher % thus better.

This is not doing Warner credit as a QB. No, he was not a running QB, and yes, he was coached to stay in the pocket, but he was one of those "teflon" guys we saw like a younger Tom Brady or Drew Brees - he had that uncanny body sense of where defenders were and could just take a step and make the defender miss or duck and let the defender sail over him then make the throw. In addition, how to read defensive coverages post-snap and identify the best option has not changed. It's not a "style of play" thing, it's seeing the leverage, understanding what the defense is giving you, and taking it. Look. Here's the series from the very first play Warner breaks down (click to enlarge). We converted 2 1st Downs, then Punted. Miami then proceeded to go on a 14 play drive, including a 4th down conversion, ending in a FG. The play Warner breaks down is 1st and 10 incomplete to McKenzie. Allen is going for the "kill shot" to the WR running the deep over route, who happens to be McKenzie on this play. But the CB is initially dropping to cover the over route McKenzie is running, and there's a safety back there as well who closes by the time Allen pulls the trigger. (Eventually, Allen gets the CB to bite and move forward to cover Diggs and open up the deep route to McK, but by then the safety has closed) Allen he has three, count them, THREE, receivers who are wide open early in the play, including 2 underneath guys who could gain some yards, and Diggs, who is our BEST receiver no question, open as ***** and past the 1st down marker. McKenzie is the "kill shot" if Allen completes the throw, but he's actually the best covered of the WR. Allen throws to him, the pass is broken up by the corner we see dropping back to take it away. Allen hits Diggs on time instead, we get a first down and maybe some more, we keep moving the ball down the field and at least wind up with points. He isn't "coaching Josh down", he is pointing out that Josh has options to sustain drives that he's not taking. It's the difference between NEEDING that drive at the end of the game (and the DPI that might not be called) to win, vs. going into the 4th with a comfortable lead. People complain that Dorsey isn't "scheming guys open" or they "see no evidence" that there are open guys underneath that Allen isn't hitting. Here are 3 WR schemed open including Diggs, and Allen is choosing the least open guy. People complain that the OL isn't giving Allen enough pass protection. Well, Allen has more than enough pocket time to throw to Diggs, he's asking more of his OL so that he can wait for a deeper option. The OL would look a lot better in pass pro, too, if Allen would take some of these easier shots. Moreover, the tape is out - it doesn't matter that's McKenzie back there. It could be Davis, it could be Diggs. Allen will almost always choose his deepest option if he thinks there's a chance, and teams know it and cheat their coverage that way which is why the deep options aren't working as well as they did earlier in the season (and why we keep stalling out and punting early in games). It's why you see Singletary and Knox with enough green around them to plant a ***** Christmas Tree farm, and why you see Diggs, one of the best and most scary receivers in the league, with so much space around him. This is really Football 101 and critiquing Warner as an old fuddy-duddy whose football time has passed when he points this out misses the fair, IMHO. Last but not least, why on earth would you choose the judgement of that bloviating never-was Rex Ryan, over a 2x 1st team all-pro with 3 SB appearances and a SB ring?

So, I've been watching Warner's breakdowns of Allen since he came into the league (Allen that is) and I think you're missing his points here. He says right up front, he calls Allen the human "GCP" (Game Changing Play) because he can do just that at any time. He acknowledges that as a player, he did not have the ability to do that, so he had to win the game mentally by reading the defense and taking the easy throws. (He also didn't have Allen's ability to evade defenders). He states that what he's doing, is breaking down the film from that POV, what easy options are the offensive plays designed to open up? The easy option is always to stay in the pocket and take the throw if there is a pocket, and a QB who is running is open to that defender he's not aware of plastering him for a strip sack, not that that ever happens to Allen - Oh, Wait. So basically, you're objecting to Warner doing exactly what he says he's going to do, up front at the beginning. You're incorrect that Warner doesn't like Allen's style. Over time, Warner's breakdowns of Allen have changed DRAMATICALLY as he recognizes that Allen has the physical abilities to do all sorts of things he couldn't do himself, and make them work. He's actually kind of in awe of Allen, now, I think. But he also has a valid point that if Allen doesn't remain aware of his "Easy!" buttons and train himself mentally to take them at times, he can find himself struggling and throwing picks when the defensive coverage is better than usual, or the pass rush is fiercer than usual, or the weather sucks more than usual. We have seen this when the offense has struggled as Allen has been working his way back from his elbow injury and trying to tone down his picks. Yes, I've appreciated that in Warner's analysis of what's gone wrong with Denver's offense - he critiques the WR route running as well. I can see that in some of the routes Gabe Davis and McKenzie are running, they are NOT supposed to be where they end up, but I haven't been able to sort out what's going wrong. Anyway, I think there's a lot of value here especially for people who are worried about Dorsey's play design and play calling. The point is that the play design is opening options. Sometimes the options are there and Allen isn't taking them; sometimes the play design is sound but the execution is flawed.

Thanks! Warner has improved these a lot and they're now much easier to follow. Great breakdown.

Ah, OK, thanks for the clarification on both points. The Bills started the season with an even lower utilization of Diggs. I think they were hoping to give him breathers to keep him healthier into the playoffs. If a guy is playing winded, he may be less nimble and able to protect himself.

You guys do see that this thread is more than a year old?

I do not want to see even a healthy Klein attempting to chase down and tackle Fields. Milano please.

Someone posted under the pics that they're from 2016

LOL no problem. I think Cover1 did a post-game analysis on Youtube. Might have been a good one in TBN; Joe B's postgame mostly talks about how great Milano was but not much about the how and why of what the Bills did. I'll keep looking myself, because I seem to recall that Frazier did throw some wrinkles into his normal 4-2-5 The thing that's stood out to me when I've heard opponents talking about Justin Fields is, they all talk about how fast he is, including guys who have played Lamar Jackson regularly.

So you might be interested in reading up on some of the stuff written about how the Bills defended the Ravens earlier this season. The thing about putting AJ Klein on the field is you're typically taking a faster guy off of it. In 2020, SF was Milano's first game back from IR and they had him on a snap count I think. So no alternative. Typically Milano is one of our best defensive players (esp. with Von Miller hurt) and I don't think it would serve the Bills well to take him off the field. Interesting question with Justin Fields: where does he usually get his yards? My impression is he gets to the edge and heads up field, not much up the middle. I think Montgomery runs between the tackles, though, so it's not as though you can abandon covering the middle of the field.

Didn't want to start a new thread for this. Nice film piece from Cover1 breaking down Dawson Knox game against the Dolphins.

Diggs overall on the season to date, 78% of the snaps. That's lower than last year or 2020, when he was on the field 89%. Varies game by game from 64% to 95%. Varies. Justin Jefferson on the field, 96% of the snaps. Career high, previously 82%, 89% Tyreek Hill 76% of the snaps A. St Brown 78% Davante Adams 96%, prev with GB 85% Michael Pittman 94%, prev 78%, 88% It varies and obviously some of the top guys are on the field more, but some about the same amount.

Question: how do you tell it's him taking himself off the field, and not a signal from sideline or a word from another player as substitutions are made? Diggs was the field almost every play. 86% of the snaps vs. the Dolphins. He was not on the field for a whole 11 snaps out of 78 snaps. I don't think those 11 snaps were "numerous times after receptions". I think for the most part, they're dictated by the play and the personnel package it requires - for example a heavier set with 1 RB 2 TE or 2 RB 1 TE, where we only have 2 WR on the field (even then, the 2 WR may include Diggs more often than not). But sometimes they want Davis and a slot or gadget guy, or (when he was active) Davis and Shakir. I would love to have a source for the personnel sets the Bills use but I'm too cheap to pay for SIS or the like.

Well played, Sir! Well played!