Beck Water

What time was it before it got flexed?

Could be. I can't find any info on who's behind the "@Billsreport" account though. So no info on credibility/reliability.

If we want to look at just Beane's 1st rounds, we have Guys who worked out (they are good to great) - let's call that 5 Allen Edmunds Oliver (traded for Diggs) Rousseau Kincaid Guys who can't pay Elam Coleman (apparently - though it's technically early) Skipping over the Diggs trade and giving Hairston a verdict of "too soon", that gives Beane 5/7 good, 2/7 bad or 71% "hit" rate which is better than average. They aren't all studs, of course, but what GM drafts "all studs" in the first round?

Thanks. I think I understood the gist of the message, I just couldn't parse "was not take over well" If he didn't think it was a big deal to miss a meeting, wouldn't you think he'd be angry about being benched, not dancing around on the sidelines?

==> sarcasm: What, you mean Dawkins telling us fans the "straight talk" was given and taken well by Keon was "sugar coating" what happened? Seriously, I don't know what this means: "His reaction to being a scratch VS The Bucs was not take over well" Josh said similar things about Shavers post game, that he "does things the right way" - which is always interesting as it does imply someone else may NOT be "doing things the right way".

FWIW, I agree with @Buffalo716 that Beane's track record is very good drafting in the middle/late rounds. The overall league'hit rate' there is like 15-20%, lower in the 6th and 7th. Beane consistently finds guys who can ball - both guys who can start, like Milano, Benford, Shakir - and guys who can make the roster as backups/ST. A lot of the guys we don't keep, wind up on other teams. For the season, Kincaid's snaps are 63%, 57%, and this season 43% of the snaps. The lower % of snaps are due to leaving a game due to injury, and then working his way back in after missing games due to injury. Seriously? Yikes.

I think the bottom line is production. If Shavers continues to "go off" and Gabe Davis is truly healed from his knee injury and able to contribute, that gives Josh two targets he trusts, who seem to be giving good effort to run good routes and be in the right place at the right time. Gabe will be "QB friendly" when the play breaks down. As long as that happens, Keon may find himself on the outside looking in.

I agree with you that (what I perceive as) Beane's late 1st round draft strategy (go for high ceiling guys who need development) is problematic.

I don't know if it's an "internet lie", but it was definitely PR. Like Allen was watching college ball or maybe some scouting film and he saw some Coleman highlight catches and said "that would be nice to have on the team" so then after the draft it becomes the Grease song "You're the one that I want...ooh ooh ooh honey!"

Well gosh and I heard here he was looking good in Dallas back in pre-season Look, you're not wrong, but every GM whiffs on some. The overall hit rate in the bottom 3rd of the 1st/top of the 2nd is something like 30% And that's 30% you get a guy who can ball capably, not you get a freakazoid

Hardman only played 4 offensive snaps. Moore has been playing for Samuel.

You must be the Life of the Party

OMG Basham. Let the record show that, even though he's still in the league, he did NOT go on my list of "players the Bills drafted, no longer on the team, who are remotely any good". Creed Humphrey was drafted 2 slots later.

I think you're exactly right on this.

LOL don't you take that kind of thing with a giant salt shaker and a great deal of skepticism? It's PR, baby! Allen is not making player personnel decisions. He may be texting Beane game clips "look at that catch!" or some such, probably about multiple players. Beane was facing scrutiny for taking on $30M dead cap to NOT have Diggs on the team, and taking some heat for trading down rather than up in a WR-rich class to draft this guy Keon who had minimal experience as a WR, and for not doubling down at WR. So after drafting Keon, it's the Bills PR team job to present him to the fans in a favorable light. Make him seem like a likeable dude buying winter coats off season at Macy's. Make him seem like a player our star QB really wanted to see on our team. Etc Etc.

I don't think he came into the season indifferent, but he's had some struggles since the Baltimore game and has NOT been living up to the "contested catch" billing. If he has issues with ADHD, he needs to work with the team's sports psychologist and get set up with cognitive behavioral therapy or whatever he needs to learn coping skills.

Exact-a-Mundo. Show up, work hard, don't take plays off, and give it all he's got, and no one will be slagging on Keon.

Hi, have you acknowledged that Harrison Phillips doesn't play in the CFL or (until this season) for the NY Jets yet? Let's review. You made a contention: "There hasn't been one player that they drafted that is no longer on this team that is remotely any good, outside of Edmunds" One would think that the qualification "remotely any good" would include players who have earned starting roles on good teams, or who have started consistently (because a team that is trying to improve will surely try to upgrade if their starter is not "remotely any good". But you took your little goal posts and declared that what you really meant was "stud difference makers" and I'm "reaching extremely hard" because I didn't translate what you actually wrote into what you later declared you meant. News flash: a team that lets a lot of actual stud, game changing difference maker players instead of re-signing them is a team with bad talent e v a l. So we would not expect that Bills to let go of a large number of actual stud, game changing difference makers.

Then why are they still on NFL teams, getting playing time? The OP contention that my post was intended to refute: "There hasn't been one player that they drafted that is no longer on this team that is remotely any good, outside of Edmunds" Try to keep up - There is a huge influx of new cheap guys into the league every draft. If a guy is not "remotely any good", teams will choose the cheap fresh blood who might potentially develop, over vets who are "not any good". Do you really want to argue that point? This is especially true of late rounders/UDFA. Therefore, if a guy is looking for a hat, and teams keep signing him, we can assume they think he is at least "remotely any good". Also try to keep up - you can exclude them. You can exclude ST players. And the contention that "There hasn't been one player that they drafted that is no longer on this team that is remotely any good, outside of Edmunds" is still disproven because it only takes one more player. Even the OP admits Teller is a stud and I think he just acknowledged that Harrison Phillips has not spent 4 years playing for the Jets and was in fact a full season starting DT 3 years on two very good Vikes teams (and one that was missing a QB). Q E D.

I agree on all points. In this free agency era, and when the 5th round option has to be picked up (and is fully guaranteed) after the player's 3rd season - waiting 3 years for a guy to develop just before his last year under contract (for 2nd round on) or just before we have to pick up the fully guaranteed big bucks, is a luxury we really can't afford.

Beg pardon, but where are you hearing that? In the presser I heard, McDermott seemed very carefully ambiguous on both points

What Dion said (or did not say) is factual. The difference between false start and Offside is factual. The complete inappropriateness of your suggestion that a 2nd year player who was just a healthy scratch for disciplinary reasons, taking the mic to call out an 9 year vet for a couple of pre-snap penalties (out of 56 snaps) is really not reasonable matter for disagreement. Diagnosis complete: you're a troll. *plonk*

So I had to stop and think about this. Beane has a pattern of trying to compensate (or overcompensate) for drafting late in the 1st, by taking "high ceiling low floor" guys. They try to take guys who they assess as having the "want to" and the "work ethic" to take coaching and work in the off season to fill in the gaps in their game and build themselves up. Rousseau would be one example of this from Beane. He only had a single season of college football when he was drafted, very limited college football experience. Seems to me it took him about 3 seasons to really come on. I pegged Coleman as similar: only one season at Florida State, really not a lot of experience playing at a top college level. Coming out, concerns about his route-running skills, his release and his explosiveness. One of Beane's projects. So it wouldn't have surprised me for him to take about 3 seasons to really come on. But in order to do that, he has to have the "want to". He has to perceive a need to develop his skills and work hard. Plenty of immature wideouts have been incredible in the league *if they came in to the league with those skills*. Coleman came into the league as a "work in progress", one of Beane's draft pattern of high-ceiling, low floor shots on goal. I think he could become great because he has enough of the physical package, but he has to be clear-headed enough to see where he needs to add pieces and go out and work on adding those pieces (unlike sheer speed, release skills and explosiveness can be trained).

Ray Ray McCloud? As a disciplinary thing? I don't remember this. Looping back, I thought that too much was being made of Keon dancing on the sideline, but I finally listened to Ocho and Shannon Sharpe on the topic. Ocho pretty clearly didn't want to say anything but his reaction to Keon dancing was "something ain't right." Since that's two guys who've been there at a high level, I got to defer.

Then just like Coleman, you'll take the consequences. If you can't even acknowledge that you're way off in your interpretation given a transcript, you're either Coleman's mommy or a troll.