FireChans

I just posted advanced stats that showed he was the most accurate of his career in 2023. You just don’t like them lol

It's not PFF. It's PFR. Like I said, if you are going to say Mahomes is worse because his numbers are worse, was Tom Brady regressing in 2019 and then suddenly got way better in 2020? It's just not a valid argument to me. If Josh's numbers take a sizable hit this season because he's throwing to plumbers and mailmen, I will not necessarily say he's regressing. It sounds like you will though.

The evidence is on the field. I have no way of demonstrating that besides telling you to watch Mahomes close his eyes and chuck it to Tyreek 10 yards behind the defenders 5 years ago vs watch Mahomes run the offense today. Stats have to be invoked to a certain degree? How much is the degree? If Josh’s production drops 25%, is that enough to say he’s a worse QB? Here’s some stats for you, if you’re so inclined. Mahomes bad throw % in 2023 was the best of his career. His on target throw % was the highest of his career. He had the highest rate of drops by his receiving group of his career. Josh’s on target throw % in 2023 was worse than 2020. His bad throw % was the best of his career. Mahomes bad throw % and on target % were both better than Josh’s in 2023 and 2020.

So if Josh’s production takes a dip this year because he has no WR’s to throw to, he’s a worse QB? I don’t agree with that.

Imo, he has gotten much better at playing within the system. When Mahomes first came on the scene, he was able to play outside of structure and make teams pay for giving him big plays down field. Around 2021, teams basically forced him to play in the system. They switched to majority deep shell coverage, and made him be patient (not dissimilar to what they have done with Josh). Mahomes initially struggled, culminating in getting CRUSHED by the Titans in October. Then, of course, they get rid of Hill, Kelce gets old and he has to pick his spots much more carefully. And he has.

Luckily, no one ever accused Buffalo of being a big city. Come on down young man!

Imo, they went for the Brady NE model after Allen ascended in 2020 and Gabe looked like he was the next big thing at WR in 2021. They went bargain bin hunting for bandaids around Allen because he has the ability to make chicken salad out of chicken *****, and tried to build up the defense. Honestly, it’s not the worst plan. If a couple of our DL guys had actually become the elite players we hoped they would, we may have been a SB team in the last 2 years. I do and did see the vision. Let Allen carry the offense, scramble around and make a couple monster plays that only he can make, and rely on an elite defense to finish the job. Hell, that’s basically how the Chiefs won this year. But, of course, the bandaids proved to be bandaids and the defensive players ended up being closer to JAGs than stars, and of course, Diggs became a problem. So now we have minimal offensive investments and our defensive investments were a waste. It’s time for a philosophy shift. Build up Allen and the O, and let McD earn his contract by coaching up some JAGs into a competent defense.

Window for trading for Davante is long gone.

Stafford hugely cut down his boneheaded INT’s without Megatron. Steph was on the field still. imo, you aren’t allowed to be mad at the “Allen needs Diggs to be great” take if you had the “let’s see how Mahomes does without Hill” take. Don’t make me search ur history @Beck Water

The most supportive thing we can do is support him to continue improving and working on his game to achieve the ultimate goal, isn’t it?

My point was not a statistical one. I asked if anyone thought he was “better as a passer,” earlier upthread compared to 2020. So I will ask you again. Do you think Josh Allen has gotten better as a passer since 2020? I think numbers can be very dependent on the talent level of your team. I could easily forsee a situation where Allen is a better QB in 2024 but it’s not reflected in his numbers because he no longer has the elite #1 WR he has had in seasons past. There are many facets of a QB’s game, and lots of things they can tighten up on over the course of their careers. Brady is a perfect example. Did he regress in 2019 and turn back into an elite player in 2020? Or was he the same guy with a complete overhaul in talent around him?

Tbf, we have never seen Allen play at an elite level without Diggs on the roster. There were lots of Bills fans that thought Mahomes was gonna turn into a pumpkin when the Chiefs traded away Hill. I think both arguments are insane, personally. Allen is gonna be elite with or without Diggs, even though he greatly benefitted from Diggs and making the jump 4 years ago.

Listing camp bodies, two fifth round picks and the 33rd highest paid WR in the league doesn’t support your point as much as you think.

Backup OG Edwards on this list is the piece de resistance lmao Would you call ignoring the WR position while the market has exploded for 4 years straight, sharp?

Bass-Man

He was doomed to suck after being called "Bass-o-matic." Just an absolutely pitiful nickname. Deplorable.

I am shocked that someone thinks that Mahomes and Allen are worse QB's today than they were 4-5 years ago because they haven't had better statistical outputs than their best seasons (2018 and 2020, respectively) Wild take, but I guess you're entitled to your opinion.

I do not agree with this. They won 7 games two years in a row with bottom of the barrel QB play. If Rodgers manages to be a top 20 QB, and they stay healthy, I think they are a WC team.

Do you think Mahomes has regressed since 2018? I mean, the stats say he has, right? That’s an inarguable fact?

Probably Legette or Worthy. I like Ladd but I see him as a Shakir plus 2/3.

Watching him play backs it up.

The prospects available are what give the picks their value. Getting a first round prospect WR with pick 28 and borderline first round prospect WR with pick 60 in 2024 and likely pick 59 in 2025 is good value. Who cares if it’s technically “worth” a 3rd rounder because of a chart?

The cops ran Marshawn out of town by arresting him. They are currently running Rashee Rice out of town in KC.

I think Mahomes has improved since 2018, personally. He had that weird stretch of 2021 where teams forced him to be disciplined and play more in the system and take easy throws, and he struggled for awhile before coming out the other side.

I hope beane is reading your posts my dude. We can get a guy who would be borderline first round WR in 2025 in the mid second this year. Imo, that’s tremendous value for a 2025 pick 50-60.