MasterStrategist

Well I'm not the one just calling him average, now am I. Be glad to discuss the merits of the MLB position, I find it funny your first comment is to question my knowledge. Some original message board stuff right there. Nick Bolton and Denzell Perryman, seriously? Bolton progressed well and finished strong, but was not asked to do what Edmunds does in our defense. He is instinctive for a rookie, but has athletic limitations and isn't going to run lateral/carry the coverage zones like Tremaine does. Perryman is not a gifted coverage linebacker, he would be considered a weak link as a coverage LB by many. Perryman is actually unlikely to resign with Raiders, due to his limitations in that regard. There's 2 you can cross off the list. What redeeming quality do these 2 players possess, that would prompt you to say they would be better in our defensive scheme than Edmunds? I'm sorry you feel more educated around these parts, but Edmunds is not just an average player. He's also not Darius or Fred, but I'd put him in the tier right after. We play some of the most cover 2/cover 4 looks across the league, preventing big plays. It puts a HUGE amount of coverage responsibility on him and Milano. Chiefs much different style, aka why the Nick Bolton comparison is horrible. He's not near the athlete McDermott looks for (maybe Willie Gay, but not Nick). You should try to understand our defensive philosophy, if you disagree with that..so be it. But that is unlikely to change anytime soon. And to your last point, did Milano not regress this season as well? IMO, the defensive line was weak. Corners were slow, once Tre was injured, and forced even more cover 2/cover 4 looks against most opponents...put even more burden on Edmunds and Milano in that respect. Can't look at this in a silo, many factors influenced both of our LB play. And plain/simple, we played some very low quality QBs this season, the high defensive rank was not sustained against high quality competition.

If Edmunds is average (per your words), please list 15 other MLBs that are better than he is..... I would not say he is average, Bills would have no way picked up his 5th yr option if they thought he was just average. He's not in the class of Darius or Fred, but IMO in that next tier...again with a DL that has failed to stop the run for countless seasons and can't get to the QB (sacks, not counting this phantom pressure stat). Playmaking abilities of Milano were also not at the same clip as prior years, to me pointing to either scheme or lack of defensive pressure.

Agree, I think it's hard to say if the problem is player evaluation or development, for the DL. Likely both contributing to the problem. I will be very concerned, if 2 years from now we are still having this conversation. After investing 2 1sts and 2 2nds, in recent years. Rousseau and Basham deserve more time, and I'm encouraged by Ed (just needs to maintain his 2nd half of season level), but this will be a big season for AJ. Thankfully, we have most of the FA DL money issue behind us, except for Star. Frustrating results, you bet, but now we have a mostly clean slate to work with. They have a chance to "retool", as they say, so this upcoming FA/draft will be very critical.

Again, Jerry running 5 yards past the qb is not pressure. PFF/espn or whevever you grabbed that stat, is plain misleading and irrelevant. Point is our front 4 is not physical or talented enough. So we have: Hughes, Addison, Butler, Harry, and Efe all potentially ready to test the open market. That was half our core from last year, not an abundantly talented group. My previous point, Re: Edmunds, is that he and Milano would be much better with a stronger group in front of them.

What I'm saying is we just wasted a ton of money, and got little return on investment on the dline. We invested top 10 money in the dline for consecutive seasons, with no where near that production. I'm saying we need to stop collecting 3-4 B to C grade players to rotate and find some top end talent in the front. Beane and group have done wonders, except for what they paid for on the dline.

Exactly, said this earlier in the thread that our front 4 has a big influence on the type of player that Edmunds (and Milano) can become. For everyone claiming Edmunds needs to go, or we can easily replace him, what about our dline? Newsflash, Edmunds and Milano (or whoever our LBs are) are playing behind a line that featured: Hughes, Oliver, Rousseau, Harry, Addison, Star, and a combination of Efe, Basham, AJ, and Butler. Do we honestly expect any of our LBs to perform well behind a group like that? Milano even had a down season, from his prior work. Certainly a correlation when we see both LBs not make splash plays, to me it points to Dline not performing as well. Point is, get more physical/talented players in our front 4 and watch Edmunds/Milano be a top 5 combination.

From my perspective, he is certainly not on the same tier as the likes of Darius Leonard and Fred Warner (his two closest comps). He could still get there, but each passing year looks unlikely. That's all to say, he is still a very good player, and certainly not a bust. If we'd release him, more than half the league would be reconsidering their MLB situation and putting an offer out for him. Where it gets tricky is his contract vs potential (he is still young), and the fact our front four is just average to below average (IMO). $12-16m per year seems in the range, looking at other MLB contracts (Blake Martinez, Joe Shobert each above 10m per), Dion Jones at $14m per. Leonhard and Warner at $19m per. If we had an above average to very good front four, I truly think he'd make alot more impactful plays. We generate zero pass rush without blitzing and have been just OK, at the DT position (Ed is fine, our 1 DT has been bad the past 2 years...Harry to me is not the answer). Not physical in the front 4, and that's what Indy and SF have, certainly helps Darius and Fred.

Beane and Co have been great building the overall roster, clearly nailed the most important position on the football field and then some. But as far as DL goes: 1. FA grade: D. Butler, Trent Murphy, and Star were horrible "values", huge cap implications. Phillips was a good pickup, and Addison so-so value. otherwise this was an epic failure. 2. Draft: still too early, but in the next season or so, those 4 1st/2nd round picks invested better turn into a top 10 dline. Oliver is turning a corner, IMO much more consistent. But AJ concerns me, as does Boogie, both lack any specific trait to dominate off the edge. Groot, with another offseason and growing into that large frame, I have no doubt he will continue to develop into a very good/consistent player for us. But DE is a tricky spot, takes time to develop counter moves. We are in a sweet spot, per say, of being able to reinvest FA money into this position group again with Butler, Hughes, and Addison off the books. I'd let Harry walk. Draft a 1 tech somewhere in the top 4 rounds, decently deep position this year. And go after a disruptive edge player in FA or via trading picks. 1. This team needs a more "physical/tough identity": I'd look to rebuild the middle of oline and Dline. 2 IOL and 1 tech DT. That's priority #1. 2. Need a consistent pass rush specialist. Either they have faith someone will make a big jump, or go get someone via trade if needed. 3. Wr: need a YAC guy, or at least someone who imposes big play ability. I'd love to get Kirk, but think we use our limited FA money elsewhere. I'd find a speedy slot in FA and a 1st or 2nd rounder, to pair with Diggs and Davis. Hopefully "Speedy" ready for the return role, and maybe Hodgins develops. Cut Beasley, unfortunately he's just lost 1-2 steps. 4. TE2: we desperately need someone, thankful we got by without Knox for a few weeks. But thinnest position on the team. 5. CB2: Tre will likely miss time to start, need a dependable corner to step in. If Levi comes back on a 1 yr deal, great. Otherwise its likely we use our 1st or 2nd rounder on CB, and look to find a bargain FA for depth. Then cut Mongo, Klein, Beasley (mentioned above), and Williams (is their a big cap hit?). Bring back Bates to compete and be depth, along with other backup types that won't break the bank.

Two things: 1. I doubt the original call was to squib. More likely a pooch kick, somewhere in the 5-10 yrd line range. But as it been said, squib kicks can easily backfire if not executed properly. 2. Regardless of the kickoff strategy, the defensive alignment and coverages were HORRENDOUS. Beating a dead horse at this point, but I'd hope McD learns that you never rush 4 in that situation. Better to rush 3, jam the Wrs and put an extra defensive back on the field. This is defensive coaching 101, when trying to protect a small lead with very little time remaining. Somewhere at an upcoming HS coaching conference, this will be used as an example of what "not to do", in this situation.

I guess you missed the first play of the 2nd half

Oh yeah, absolutely. I was just commenting to the poster that said we had a better defense, which is not true.

Our dline dominated just 1 game this yr, against Miami. Every other game they played just average. Got destroyed by Indy, and just don't have a dominant force up front yet.

Our defense is not on the Rams level. But not many are. Our safeties are better, but our front 4 is just not physical enough/can't get pressure.

Solid player, in our scheme, but with limitations. I'd let him walk if he's over $5m, I'd bring him back at that price for 1 yr. He's EJ Gaines 2.0 IMO, can be a good fit in a cover 3 scheme but isn't going to turn and run with big Wrs or be a man guy on quick receivers.

Rams about to turn this into a blowout.

Agree, Cincy has similar overall talent. But their dline is certainly a tier above ours. We were relcutant/hesitant to change our scheme, perhaps bc it worked earlier in the season when Mahomes was being more careless and not taking the check downs. Def coaches need to take a long look in the mirror this offseason and decide what type of defense they want to have to compete for a super bowl.

Disagree. Cincy did run our strategy in the 1st half, then adjusted in the 2nd half. Granted they got some breaks, dropped passes etc. But they mixed it up with blitzing LBs, and running 3 man pass rushes w/spy or delayed Blitzer. They realized at halftime that their defensive strategy just wasn't going to cut it, and followed up by only giving up 3 points in the 2nd half and stopping Mahomes in OT. Way different coaching strategy, not just execution. Will add that they completely shut down Tyreek in the 2nd half...by changing their coverages. At no point, did we adjust like Cincy. instead we played scared to give up the big pass play.

Good grief man, each season is different and a million things happen that can turn the tides. I've been saying Cincy is legit too, but I'd put them, KC, and Buffalo in the top tier. Each has different strengths and could beat the other team 50% of the time on any given Sunday. Way too much being made of Cincy winning today, if you think it has any ramifications on next season. These 3 teams will be battling out for many years, until another talented Qb team (ie Chargers) jump into the mix.

Good job Cincy, 👏 That's why everyone here shouldn't have been acting like this was an auto win, like I said earlier. Bengals have a great mix of playmakers and dline that gives pass heavy teams trouble.

F u Mahomes, great defense by Cincy!

Absolutely, we need a Josh Allen on this defense. Someone who is going to make the big play and bring the leadership needed to take this team to another level. Until then, we will continue relying on the offense and Josh to be A+ to win against top offenses in the playoffs.

3 points in 2nd half...lol

And that's the difference with real defensive coaching.... Jeez, 3 man rush with a spy who would think that could work?!

Really?! Cincy has given up 0 points this half, let me repeat that...0 points. Even if they give up a TD here, that's a remarkable thing to do against Chiefs.

Big difference in our def coaching vs Cincy. They are doing great job mixing it up, unlike our consistent 4 man rush only.