CincyBillsFan

They only rushed 2 guys giving Rogers all the time in the world to make the throw and the WR's to establish their position in the end zone.

How long must we put up with the sheer incompetence of McD at these end of half/end of game pressure situations? How do you not rush FOUR guys to make Rogers uncomfortable? I don't care how this game ends the Bills will never sniff a Super Bowl with McD as head coach.

Accept that they gave up a big gain on 3rd down and then combined with the holding penalty the Bills are starting at their own 10 yard line.

Wrong. Samuel has to run that pattern past the sticks. Didn't you watch the replay? Aikman was pretty clear that #1 has to take that more vertical.

I agree that these things aren't mutually exclusive. But one has lagged far behind the other. And until I see the Bills close the gap between the two I will consider criticisms of Allen to be nit picking in the face of the real problems facing this franchise.

Allen's limitations are not between the ears as you suggested. IMO Allen is limited, like Luck was, by the inability of the Bills organization to surround him with other good to great offensive talent. Further improvements by Allen, either in his physical or cerebral play, will increasingly provide diminishing returns. Kelly enjoyed having TWO HOF WR's at the same time; and a HOF RB whose strength was his pass catching. In addition Kelly enjoyed the benefits of having a HOF, highly disruptive defensive player in Bruce Smith. When Kelly's O was faltering, Smith could take over a game and spark the team in ways that NO Bills defensive player has been able to do during the Allen years. In fact, Mahomes benefits greatly from future HOF DT Chris Jones who like Smith can single handily take over a game.

Disagree. Today I listened to an interview of Matt Hasselbeck and he said that Allen and the Bills reminded him of Andrew Luck and the Colts. Over the last 2 weeks I've heard others say the same thing and I'm starting to agree with them. I watched a lot of NFL games this weekend and I saw that receivers were repeatedly getting wide, and I mean WIDE open. How receivers were catching 5 yard passes and turning them into 40 yard plays. I saw QB's with a lot of time to throw. A LOT OF TIME. When Shakir is not on the field the Bills have the worst WR group in the NFL.

One big problem with the defense the last two games has been how poorly they play at the start of games. The Bills are on the road playing back to back teams likely to win their divisions and they give up FIVE TD's on their opponents first SIX possessions. We would be calling our offense elite if they scored 5 TD's on their first 6 possessions over the last two games. So right off the bat we're in a hole in a hostile environment against very good teams.

On the other hand if the Bills beat the Jets they're sitting pretty in the Division and might not want to give up the store for an older WR in a reloading year where they have a good chance of winning the East and getting a first round playoff game. We might be facing a paradox where a Bills win makes them more attractive to Adams but makes the Bills need of Adams less pressing. While a Bills loss with another game of bad WR play might make them desperate to land Adams.

I'm not sure I've seen this before but a Reddit guy asks a very relevant question - "why are the safeties 25 yards off the ball when the Texans need 5 yards to set up the game winning TD"? McD had to know that the Houston FG kicker had a much better shot at hitting a 60 yard FG then Stroud throwing a 50 yard TD.

We're watching the "Andrew Luck" treatment of Allen in real time. In the season opener the injury was due to Allen's leap to score a TD. A leap BTW which came close to sealing the victory against the Cards. So it was justified. The last two games have seen Allen take brutal hits due to bad play design & the inability to execute properly.

I would prefer the much easier and safer way of stocking the Bills Super Bowl trophy case by getting rid of McD; bringing in the best offensive minded coach available and focus the lions share of draft picks and FA signings on the offense.

I think GoBills808 is kidding and mocking some of the more imaginative Allen takes on these threads. But yes I do think this is what McD would want if he could get it. Like I posted on another tread McD is probably jealous of his friend Tomlin who doesn't have to deal with an elite QB and can structure game plans entirely around the D. And if Shanahan ever got his hands on Allen the Super Bowl wins would fall into his lap. Yep and I bet you thought Andrew Lucks injuries were his fault to. The more I think about it the more worried I am that Allen will pull a Luck and I wouldn't blame him in the least if he did.

I visit a few other fan forums on a regular basis and it just seems to me that there is something different about the criticisms of Allen.

First off if we're now going to scold Allen over dropped INT's then Mahomes is one of the worst QB's out there because he makes a specialty of throwing INT's that are dropped. Hell in almost every game I watch DB's drop INT's. That's why they're DB's and not WR's. Second the problem is that the offense is so reliant on Allen. As Greg Cosell has repeatedly said it is not reasonable nor effective to expect Allen to play Superman every week. The problem, and it's been the same for the last 5 years is that Allen has never been surrounded with an elite or IMO even a great offense. I'm talking about great O line AND great skill players.

I'm not saying it isn't legitimate to criticize Allen in the immediate aftermath of the Texans game for his poor play contributing to the loss. The post game thread is a great place to do it. What I'm talking about is the OBSESSION in criticizing Allen after a poor game. By my count there are SIX threads that either are titled to be openly critical of Allen or were attempts to provide a different perspective on Allen taken over by those heavily criticizing the QB. Why are so many threads and posts obsessing over Allen's poor performance in ONE freaking game? Sorry but it's over the top. I do see one potential top 5 concern for the Bills about Allen going forward. It's that maybe the Bills are doing to him what he Colts did to Andrew Luck. If that has happened and I don't think it has then we should all get ready to welcome back the lost decades.

No it wasn't because my point has never been about single game outcomes but about season long or even multi season long outcomes. My point is that bad games happen to every player and sometimes the team losses a game because of a key player having a bad day and I say so what. My point is that at no time in the last 5 years have I thought that Allen was one of the top 5 or even top 10 problems facing the Bills. He wasn't one of the top 10 issues facing the Bills after his bad game against the Jets, his even worse game against Jacksonville a few years ago or his poor game Sunday. Allen is the NUMBER ONE reason the Bills have made the playoffs the last 5 straight years. The NUMBER ONE reason they have won 4 straight Division titles and the NUMBER ONE reason NFL people view the Bills as a legitimate Super Bowl contender. Do you disagree? If you do I would love to hear who you think fills that role.

I think his eyes are working just fine. He is seeing that on most plays nobody is getting open.

Another thread telling us that Allen was awful, terrible even Peterman like. Just what we need. And bashing Einstein an ardent Allen supporter is just to good to pass up. I like Simms but his review is not the be all end all of what happened on Sunday. I agree that Allen was bad. But not awful as he didn't turn over the ball. But in the end so what? Hell even in games the Bills win and the O looks great folks come on 2BD to trash Allen over 0ne or two bad passes. So going forward what's the biggest issue facing the Bills: * Allen having a bad day. * The WR's having a bad day and not getting much separation. * The dropped passes by Kincaid. * The O line having a bad day. * The D having a bad start to the game putting the Bills in a hole. After all in the last two games the Bills D has surrendered 5 TD's on 6 drives. * The coaches having a bad day. Allen having an off day is not even in the top 5 issues coming out of this game IMO. So why are so many obsessing over it?

In theory you're right. But the issue we all are sort of ignoring is that Allen has played very clean with only 2 TO's in the first 5 games. One fumble took away a FG and the other gave the Ravens the ball well outside the red zone. The question we need to ask is whether or not the obsession on Allen reducing his TO's hasn't done more damage by simultaneously reducing his TD production.If we project current stats to the end of the season (a risky thing to do I know) then Allen is on pace for only 7 TO's and 34 TD's.

But on the road against good teams offenses often start out slow. Most of last season and so far this season the Chiefs offense starts a lot of games slowly and they rely on their D to keep it close until they figure things out. The Chargers game was a great example of this. BTW the Bills scored those 2 FG's within their 2nd drives in both games. The offense then disappears in part because as the D folds and gives up TD drives - 5 TD drives in the opponents first 6 possessions - Allen starts to press and the offense seizes up like an engine without oil. And for the record we fans are deluding ourselves if we believe that the offensive talent as currently presented is explosive and consistently able to generate points. Over the last 6 seasons the Bills have made the strategic choice to favor the D over the O relying on their elite franchise QB to carry the O. And to a degree it's worked as the Bills have enjoyed a prolong period of post merger success 2nd only to the Super Bowl years. And when the O has deviated from the McD definition of complimentary football actions are taken to reign it back in. The current O is structured to play McD ball and Brady is the type of OC that McD wants to enforce the idea that the O will play a certain way. And the desire to cut down on Allen's TO's and keep him healthy only reinforce that the O must play McD ball. The problem though is that the defense, for various reasons, isn't good enough to play McD ball. Melting like ice cream under a hot sun early in games is the worst thing a D can do trying to play McD ball. In game adjustments are fine but once Allen starts pressing in response to his D giving up TD's it's difficult for the O to bounce back. Making matters worse is the sense that a McD offense is not the best thing to run when you have an elite physical freak talent like Allen whose greatest strength is making off schedule plays. It's the same dilemma we've been arguing about since 13 seconds and I see only one solution: either McD moves on or Allen does and I know which one I want to happen.

One common theme that I agree 100% with is the notion that over the last 2 games Allen has pressed and when he presses he messes up his mechanics and can struggle. So why is Allen feeling the need to press early in these games? The answer is simple and IMO a legitimate point of criticism: the Bills D has played poorly the last two weeks allowing teams to jump out to big early leads before Allen & the O can get settled in. On the road it's especially important for the D to start strong. Consider these facts: * The Ravens scored TD's on their first 3 drives to go up 21 - 3 midway through the 2nd quarter. Is it surprising Allen was pressing after only a quarter? * The Texans scored two TD's on their first three drives to take a 14 - 3 1st quarter lead. Again this forces the Bills ad Allen to press on offense. So in addition to Allen having to play great in almost every game for them to win the offense needs to get off to a quick start. If they don't and the D allows the opponent to go up and down the field like a hot knife cutting through butter Allen tries to compensate and presses. And when Allen presses his effectiveness drops significantly.

I would be shocked if Allen hasn't been thoroughly checked out for a concussion by the Bills.

The Chiefs used it last night and it sort of worked.

Watching Rogers this season reminds me of Kelly's last season - he could still make some of his signature throws but overall suffered a rapid decline and was a below average QB. I see the same thing with Rogers who checks it down at the first hint of pressure. And the Jet's offense did not look good against the Titans either. My worry going into this game has always been the Jets D. But I find it hard to believe that they aren't seeing this as Saleh being screwed over.