VW82

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Fair points. The issue is that some of that turmoil is of McD's own making. Good for him if he/Bills can find their way out of it, but it would nice to have a coach that doesn't put you in that position in the first place. I think that's where the 'first coach to be fired' stuff is coming from.

Yeah feels like contracts haven't been taken into account here, but I will say that the current circus surrounding the team (Peterman and Leslie Frazier getting benched right out of the gate, Davis quitting the team in the middle of a game, veiled shots by ex-Bills) does give off a smell of a coach losing control, and that's usually a sign that things might be coming to an end. That said, it really seemed like McD built up some equity last year, and it's still early. Maybe Allen and Edmunds start to show signs of stardom this year. If that happens, no one will be talking about a coaching change. Losing sucks and it will always bring the wolves out.

Love the all 22 but this yardsperpass guy is clueless unfortunately. No that was not a miscommunication, he was hot. Allen has to adjust the protection for that. Also, the read was to keep on that 3rd and 2 read option. One guy to beat for a first down. Instead RB got sent into the heart of the defense. Allen needs some time in the film room with the read option stuff. Feels like he's messing that play up a lot.

Here's Daboll referencing Allen and Peterman holding the ball too long and struggling to diagnose the rush pre-snap. “More than half of those sacks aren’t the offensive line,” Daboll said, referencing to quarterbacks Josh Allen and Nathan Peterman holding onto the ball too long during the first two weeks of the season. “We can do a good job with setting the table, getting things set to where we need to get them set to. Those guys have protected inside out for the most part in pass protection. There have been some free runners that you guys have seen. It’s not all on the line, no question about it.” I'm a broken record at this point, but even the OC is publicly acknowledging it. Let's stop blaming the o-line for everything.

If you already have the right core of guys / culture in place you can take on talented non-leaders or problem players and generally fit them in without disrupting your locker room (see Patriots with Moss and now Gordon, or any of those good to great teams you listed). We didn't have that situation. We had a team full of talented losers with leaders who for the most part couldn't really get it done on the field anymore. It's way more important to establish your leadership and build out from that or you're not going anywhere in the NFL. The whole point of trading all those guys was to get enough draft capital to find new leadership. It's possible McBeane screws this rebuild up but it needed to happen if we want to become a perennial playoff team IMO. Last year we mostly just got lucky with an unsustainable TOV margin and an easy schedule.

Nice try. Go back and read the OP. This team had limited options because of our cap situation and our aging core. Bills needed to rebuild in the worst way. Take issue with the execution of that - I surely have - but if you're advocating that we should have tried to keep all those guys, you're not looking the facts that McD was facing when he took over. We were always going to have to trade or walk away from some of our big money, bad culture guys because of the cap situation, and we needed new leadership.

No they were non-leaders. McD made it pretty clear his priority was re-establishing the culture in the locker room. You don't do that by paying all the bad culture guys or non-leaders, especially if you need to go find new leaders because your old ones are getting too old. Our core was Kyle, EWood, Shady, Lorenzo, Hughes, and TT, and Bills decided they needed to move on from TT. What was the alternative? Pay all our malcontents and lock us into 7-9 for the next five years? That doesn't make any sense.

Yeah I think he's particularly raw with the pre-snap stuff, even for a rookie. Having Daboll in his ear to diagnose LOS might help short-term but Allen probably needs to learn by doing and making mistakes. It's a tough line to walk but he'll get better. Other than that, he just needs to work on his accuracy and consistency. Some of those throws were tough.

Did you even read the OP? This wasn't about getting rid of Whaley's guys. It was about fixing our cap and getting into a position to where we could use added draft capital to find new leadership because the old guard (Kyle, EWood, Lorenzo, Shady, etc.) was mostly just old. Feel free to take issue with the players they've chosen to bring in but trading or letting walk guys like Dareus, Glenn, Sammy, etc. was the right move.

I think three of the five sacks rest squarely on Allen as well as some of the other QB pressures. He just doesn't understand what's happening pre-snap, and so he doesn't know which adjustments to make with the protections. 100% agree on the mental toughness though. I've been pretty vocal about what a disservice McD is doing throwing him to the wolves before he's ready. Two plays stood out though: the long pass to Clay on the first half FG drive after those two ugly missed throws and dropped INT, and the garbage time drive after that second INT. Peterman's biggest issue is that he let things snowball. Allen messes up but then he bounces back. That takes mental toughness.

Excellent post. It's amazing to me how anyone could see this breakdown and still question McBeane's decision to rebuild. I get the frustration with the execution of it but it NEEDED to happen. Our cap situation was F'd. We had no choice.

For real though I can't remember seeing White get beat and for the second straight game Lorenzo made a bunch of plays. Jerry Hughes was effective at times too. Feels like those two guys are the only ones who ever get into the backfield and they have a combined age of 75.

Because McD is a DBs coach and that was the only part of the roster he completely overhauled. I'm fairly certain I also read some stuff on Poyer and Hyde crediting him for bringing them in. Edit: it would seem very odd that he would take Whaley's cue in his area of expertise.

Pretty sure all the DBs (Hyde, Poyer, Gaines) were McD's guys, and Matthews came from Philly so he had a McD connection there too. Don't think Whaley had much to do with it tbh. His scouting department definitely had a lot of intel which they likely used, especially in the draft but McD likely made the final calls as you suggested.

Yeah all of McBeane's 2018 off season moves are enough to give you serious pause. Yet McD did such a nice job the previous off season. Hard to know what to think. My guard is way up though.

It wasn't a remodel though. They slapped a coat of paint on it and put the for sale sign up. But you're suggesting they should have traded away the master bedroom and sold all the shingles too. You still have to field a team out there. Like I said in another post, McBeane did a nice job accumulating draft capital to go out and find their future captains. I think they might have misfired on Allen and Edmunds, and got fleeced in the process. Plan was a good one, execution maybe not. We'll see.

McD traded half the roster, and you think they should have traded the other half too? The reason they didn't trade Wood, Shady, Hughes, Kyle, and Lorenzo is because those guys were the real leaders in the locker room. McD needed them for culture reasons, if not their actual play on the field. You can't rebuild the whole team overnight.

Tried to answer this in a different thread, and I'll try again here. Basically there were three main issues with the Whaley era Bills: 1. we were talent collectors, not team builders; 2. We paid the wrong guys and our cap situation was F'd, so there was always going to be a hard ceiling as a pseudo playoff contender; 3. The real leaders of the team (Kyle, EWood, Lorenzo, Shady) were all getting old and on their way out so we needed to find new ones to rebuild around. When McD took over, his first priority was to get value for guys who were in line to get paid or had already been paid but weren't the team leaders you need from your big money guys. So Darius, Sammy, Woods, etc., all got sent packing. Same with guys like Ragland who didn't fit their system. Letting some of those guys go looks tough in hindsight (i.e. Woods) but this was all done in an effort to create enough draft capital and room to go out and get our new captains to establish the culture McD wants in the locker room. Enter Allen and Edmunds. You can rag on the extent of the exodus, or the laughable reliance on Carolina retreads, or using so much draft capital on two guys, or even the guys themselves, but the rebuild needed to happen. If Allen and Edmunds prove to be the leaders McD thinks they are, then it'll be worth it.

Yeah I was really impressed with McD last year. He won a lot of leeway with me, but he's also definitely given some of it back this year. I'm sorry but if you're one bad half from permanently pulling your QB then you should have had a third guy on the roster. And if your response is "well they tried and McCarron sucked" then you have some major pro personnel department issues. Same argument with Fraser. It's not like McD didn't have a whole year working with the guy last year to figure out if he was the right guy to call plays. Now we're two games in and his knees have been cut out from under him. Again, I'm glad McD isn't afraid to admit his mistakes (at least privately. Ha.) but it's still fair to question the initial decisions. He's left himself open for criticism IMO.

The protection stuff in this game was more on Allen than the o-line. They got beat one on one at times, but a lot of it was Allen failing to recognize overloads pre-snap and adjusting, or not seeing the delayed blitz and getting the ball out to his hot reads. Lots for both of those guys to learn from this game.

Sure give McD credit for knowing when to pull the plug but it's also more than fair to question his decisions to have Peterman and Fraser in those roles in the first place given their performance. McD is above Beane in the pecking order. He's at least approving roster decisions if not making them in the first place. You can't umbrella every mistake this regime makes by just saying they're rebuilding.

He had his play calling duties revoked by the HC. What would you call it? D looked better because McD is a solid DC and our offense finally showed a little life on the TD drive early in the 3rd which gave them hope. Either way, it's not a good look when your coach has to do that. The fact he made that change coupled with the Peterman backfire so early in the season suggests there might be issues with his decision making when it comes to who to trust. Davis quitting is ridiculous and shows they probably didn't do their homework on the guy.