Seoulofstone

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2883678-2020-nfl-draft-top-sleepers-still-flying-under-the-radar-with-a-month-to-go https://247sports.com/LongFormArticle/NFL-Draft-2020-sleepers-KJ-Hill-John-Reid-Jonah-Jackson-Ohio-State-145387553/

I was going to predict that Shenault falls to the third! I think his injury history with lack of medicals and visits will put teams off. I mean Metcalf almost dropped to the third last year.

I think you're very much in the majority but I believe people find it easy to dislike Cam and put down his QB play. Even counting a good (not great) D led by DC McD, he got that team to the SB with a no-name receiving core an average OL and a 15-1 record. Just 2 years ago he took over a game in Baltimore giving them a beating. He routinely had 300 yard games and dragged the Panthers over the line. He was a very good franchise QB not in the traditional mold. Funnily, a good equivalent when it comes to putting him down and not accepting his actual achievements is Josh Allen. Of course Newton's persona is much more of a liability than Josh. The problem here is not just last season. The previous season he missed the last 8 games. Then he made a youtube video where he basically admitted that he lied to staff about how much paIn he was in going into the season. He's destroyed his own credibility.

The way they handled it he was always going to be cut. Deluded Panthers fans were still telling themselves yesterday that he was worth a 3rd. His next problem is does he see himself as starter. Because nobody will want the drama he brings, the threat to a current QB, the injury risk or the price tag. Can he accept back up money? I don't think his ego will accept that fall from grace. I think he will retire.

Sorry, what were they pissed about? Cam being injured?

Its funny that they may get more for Kyle Allen than Cam. A 5th is what Calais Campbell cost. Kyle Allen wasn't liked by many of the Panthers fanbase because he wasn't Newton. I must say this seems a bit unfair to me. In late November in the New Orleans Superdome he brought back the Panthers from 14-0 and 31-18 deficits throwing 3 TDs and 0 interceptions. By no means a terrible QB (though he did have terrible games too). I would rate him worth a 5th, which dare I remind you was the round Peterman was drafted in.

I agree with your top 3. I think there is reason to be wary of Diggs but he is a very good player. I wanted a young guy in the rotation though. Butler could have been good value but they overpaid for a reclamation project. I really like what I read about Jefferson. Norman like Diggs could surprise or be a liability. Its interesting that people are low on Klein. He transformed the NO D when he went there having been stuck behind Kuechly, Davis and Thompson at Carolina. For me, Addison, Jeffersen, Diggs, Klein, Norman, Matakevich. Butler, Jones.

You don't think that a guy who got 40 sacks in his last 4 seasons is good value at 10 mill? Is that because you don't like the player, or his age, or that you are disappointed he isn't the guy you wanted?

Sorry I was referring to Carolina not Buffalo regarding the comp picks. In the thread that's why some wanted Butler back. I hadn't expected any comps for Buffalo with all that cap space available. They usually come when you're tight to the cap.

Fans have their favorites. I'm not going to defend the opinions of one guy I don't know. Carolina ended the season with the 7th worst run D in the history of the NFL. How did that 340 lb run stuffer do? Its just my opinion as someone who watched the games. Its fine if you dislike it as someone who didn't. As a whole the D got very high sack numbers but they were a bad D.

Yeah. Recency bias. Also some wanted him back (at a lot less) because they are ruining the comp picks signing scrubs.

That's true. He wasn't played partly because RR prioritized vets. But he was a first rounder he had chances on a good D and found himself behind Kyle Love. He just didn't look interested. Its completely fair to say he may be different here. But that contract doesn't reflect his career in the NFL up til now.

Before 2019 you could have got this guy for a late round pick. He couldn't break the rotation. Panthers fans would have died laughing if you told them he would get close to 9 mill total contract never mind guarantees only.

https://www.carolinahuddle.com/boards/topic/162837-vern-to-carolina-north/

Yes. He struggled to get snaps. He was pushed off the ball, just looked to be lacking desire and effort. If you look at his build you can see why he was a 1st rounder. Bearing in mind he got a ton of snaps in the second half of last season when Short and Poe were injured and the Panthers had historically bad run D. On a team with no DTs Carolina didn't want to keep him. That should tell you something. However clearly McB like him and they know what they want. Just telling you what people think of him here in Carolina.

I'm not talking about you specifically. The general knock on star is his stats. So I am agreeing with you. I brought up Vernons sacks to illustrate that he got play time and affected the box score more than you might expect this year for a guy who was a prime candidate for being cut outright. I am not trying to say that it describes who he is as a player. Rather that it's a false impression. Bottom line, for me he shouldn't come close to that contract based on what I've seen of him.

I didn't. But Shaq was improving. Not sure the same could be said of Vernon. He wasn't popular down here. I think it's a big overpay .

I agree, but weirdly that's the exact knock on star isn't it? I've watched him these last 4 years and his play has been poor. He was a cut candidate until this past season and still played with lethargy

That's a bad signing. He was abysmal for 3 years then got 5 sacks in his contract year. Former first round pick. Maybe McD can get more effort from him.

Or he may retire. Same problem as Tua. He can't prove fitness with a workout because of coronavirus limitations. Cam is rich and has many interests. No fanbase in football wants him.

Oof Mariota and Witten. Doesn't exactly scream Vegas! At least they got Littleton.

It's fun to imagine, but Kuechly has been a pale shadow of what he was the past two years. He can still read what the offense is doing better than anyone in the game, but, noticeably slower and shy of contact since the concussions Its best for everyone that he's done

Stupid fact- If Brissett went to Atlanta all 4 NFC South teams would have quarterbacks who's names begin with the letters Br. I'm bored

No if you guarantee his production from the past two years it's an A. Even then if he's talking smack and being a cancer it's going to detract from the strong culture developed. Not an insurmountable problem, and that's probably how. McB see it but that would still bring it down to a B. He could underwhelm or not find chemistry with JA. That would be a C/D Or he could refuse to play that would be an F I hope I am wrong. This would make me very happy.

C I actually think the price reflects his value in terms of production. I know that Vikes stated they didn't want to give him away but I feel like they were running out of options so they will feel like it was the right price but maybe the Bills could have got him cheap. Of course they would have had to wait for that and I see the wisdom in filling a need now. The curve ball here is if Diggs turns into a prima Donna and immediately starts demanding a new contract. Then it goes from wow Raiders got a steal for AB to man the Steelers fleeced Mayock. Some people are saying it was a Cousins issue not a contract issue. We will see. So really my grade reflects my lack of faith that he's just going to play happily under this contract. I do think the sweet spot for the big 3 is 10-15 and the Bills couldn't get there. The next wave are top of the second value for me-Mims Jefferson Higgins and the Bills would only have been able to get them at value if they traded back or forwards which is never guaranteed. I do see why they made this deal.