cle23

If future 1sts are equivalent to 2nds, then the Rams paid more than Washington. The Rams were also trading with a team that already had a franchise QB. Cleveland has needed a franchise QB for 25 years.

Washington gave up 3 1sts and a 2nd to go from 6 to 2. Somehow Buffalo is going from 12 to 1 for nowhere near that?

That's all hypothetical though. There is zero guarantee that Chubb will be there at 6. Darnold at 1, Allen at 2, Mayfield at 3, Chubb at 4, and Barkley at 5 means the Browns gave up an elite prospect to move up 13 spots from 35 to 22 and get their 65th pick back. Cleveland doesn't need picks, it needs elite players. We have tons of picks.

Okay I had bad wording in my first statement. They can obviously get one of the top five quarterbacks guaranteed, but they wouldn't be trying to trade into the top two if they thought all the quarterbacks were close.

Right. They risk getting the 3rd or 4th best quarterback even with a trade up at that point. They wouldn't be trying to get up to the first pick if they thought all the quarterbacks were equal.

I didn't say the Browns wouldn't consider 12, 22 and 53 for number 4. I said no team would get to the 1st pick without a future 1st.

No team is trading from 12 to 1 without giving up a future first. A GM should get fired immediately if he does that trade.

That or the Bills get shut out completely ,stay at Pick 12 and not get a top quarterback. Cleveland picks at 1, New York picks at 2, the Jets pick a quarterback at 3, and Cleveland auctions off the 4th pick to all the quarterback needy teams out there. The Bills are the team trying to trade up and desperate for a QB.

That trade actually makes sense. I honestly don't love it but the value is there and Cleveland could package some of their 4 second-rounders to move back up from 12 while still getting a first next year and pick 65 back.

Cleveland is saying no. They would probably honestly laugh. Why would they be throwing picks into a trade down especially a high second-rounder? Yes they could still get Allen at 2 but there is absolutely no guarantee that Chubb would be there at 6. They could probably get much higher value trading 4 outright.

There was only one other trade into the top two that didn't add at least 120% value and that was the trade from 3 to 2 last year. No chance that Cleveland does not get a huge return while giving up 1 & 4. Adding a random 4th rounder is worth next to nothing. I like the creativity and understand that this is a Bills' board so they are going to get the best deal, but none of these trades have any chance of actually happening at the values shown. Cleveland is not moving out of the first pick to break even or anywhere near even.

Cleveland. Pick 22 and 65 to move down from 1 and 4 and give up 35?

What are the point values from the St.Louis Washington trade from 2012?

I think 12 and 22 is fair for 6, and 6 and a 2019 1st is over paying for 4, but no way is Cleveland giving up 1. A team who hasn't had a franchise QB for 25 years can't pass on the top guy on their board. It would be beyond stupid. And teams get desperate for QB, so anything is possible. Washington traded the 6th overall, plus 2 more 1sts and a 2nd for #2 and RG3. Buffalo is moving up a lot further from 12.

ESPN Cleveland just floated a rumor of 12 and 22 to Indy for 6, then 6 and 2019 1st for Cleveland's 4th overall.

It also is a common reaction when presented with something so ridiculous that there is no other response.

I asked nicely!

Tre'Davious White please.

No way Cleveland moves down from 1 and 4 to pick up 2, 12, and a couple 2nds. That makes zero sense. The Jets gave up 3 2nds to move up 3 spots, and 1 is pick 37. Cleveland drop 1 and 8 spots at the top of the 1st round for 53 and a 2 next year. Dumbest trade ever.

Bitonio, when healthy like he was last year, is a top 10 guard, probably pushing top 5. Ziegler is great too. They are both better than Incognito, especially in his current state. Incognito is a better deal in regards to how cheap his contract is, but he is also 34.

Browns wouldn't be interested. Bitonio and Zeitler are both better than Incognito.

You have Buffalo moving from 12 to 1 for two 1sts, two 2nds, and a third, but you have Cleveland moving from 4 to 2 for a first and two seconds and a 3rd, and Cleveland's 1st is 8 picks higher and their 2nd is 18 picks higher. And like I said, why would Cleveland do a deal where they essentially break even? You are making Buffalo's move a lot cheaper than Cleveland's. Cleveland should expect that type of trade for the number 4, not for the number 1.

Even by your point total, Cleveland basically breaks even. No one trades out of the 1st pick to break even, and then essentially trade down from 4 too. If they go from 1st and 4th to 2, 12, and 22 and lose 35, they better be getting a huge ransom back. 1st and 2nd next year, and more.

Dez Bryant is average at best, and Jeffery isn't elite by any means.

That is current year. Picks from next year aren't worth as much, generally a 2nd is worth a 1st the following year, not 2 2nds and a 3rd. Pick 33 is hugely valuable in trades now that there is a gap between rounds. It alone would be worth more than that trade. Teams have players that fall and plenty of time to negotiate trades.