Tyrod's friend

What makes you think the interest in Mayfield isn't a smoke screen, and that Lamar has been the target from Day 1 and to get him roughly at #12? According to this guys report Lamar is a justifiable #1 overall draft pick. We almost know with surety that the Giants and Browns aren't going to take him. Meanwhile Beane is beating the drums about wanting to go high and get one of the "big three" and doing misdirection. For all we know, Beane is the one spreading the vicious rumors about not being able to get a meeting.

Could be King has the player right and the pick wrong. Saquon #1 overall, then Allen (if available) at 4. In which case, that doesn't help the Bills in the least. Because the Browns aren't going to trade 4, the Giants aren't going to trade 2 either. Meaning whomever you want has to get past Denver and Indy has to want a trade.

First, with the computer analytics that are available today I think this is wrong. I see the success rate of drafted QBs in the last five years as pretty remarkable. Say what you want about quality, but Trevor Siemian was picked in the 7th round and since the 2015 draft has 24 NFL starts. He's not alone. Second, the unusual success of backups and the willingness of GMs to treat the position as disposable across the league has devalued the position generally. If teams believe they can be quite competitive by investing in Kirk Cousins, Sam Bradford and Case Keenum (not to mention AJ McCarron, Teddy Bridgewater and Josh McCown), what does that say about the position? And I think the coincidence of these two elements is important and not a little bit related. QB doesn't mean to the FO what it means to you.

Great read. In five years, whenever fans on message boards say "college stats don't matter!" someone will point to Baker Mayfield's 70% completion rate and what he's done in professional football. (Followed by "Colt McCoy!"). And someone will refer back to this study and point out no matter how well versed/thought out this analysis is that the author didn't make even a passing mention of the fact that Josh Rosen has a concussed history. And why his issues within the pocket and his inabilities to improvise would ultimately doom him.

I agree, to a degree. Winning is a team game. But my post was a reaction to someone saying that Rosen had won. On the face of it, Rosen played for squads that were talented. That's just not refutable; you don't get to be nationally ranked 13th, 16th and 25th ranked team and be devoid of talent. They were ranked 13th before Josh Rosen had thrown a pass. I've already admitted that I am not a UCLA expert and thanks for reminding they had a porous defense. It seems to me if you are looking for a QB that is a "winner", then you are taking Lamar Jackson. Not Josh Rosen. Cheers.

Why? In 2015 he was the starting QB for a #13 ranked team that ultimately finished ranked #22. We can go round and round about who did what and what happened. But that is not the outcome a #13 ranked team would want. A#13 ranking tends to beat up the dialogue that Josh Rosen never had talent around him. In 2016, the Bruins were ranked #16 preseason. Of course, the brittle Rosen was injured early. Can you blame him on that? No, I guess not. Worth noting: The UCLA offensive line included three players that likely will have wound up as NFL players. In 2017, by the second week of the year the Bruins were ranked 25th in the AP. They closed out the season NR. Josh Rosen's offensive line has included included a current NFL OT, Scott Quisenberry and Kolton Miller - both likely NFL draftees and Miller is likely to be gone by the end of the 2nd round. At one point he had all three on the line. He's had remarkable coaching. I don't claim to be a UCLA expert but as I see it, those are some of the facts about Josh Rosen. There's a whole lot of opinion about him (no talent on the team) but if you want to discredit the worth of NFL coaching and the meaning of national ranking in each of his three years at UCLA, be my guest. I think if there's one thing you can't say about Josh Rosen is that he's been a winner. He hasn't. And I think ultimately that there has been at least some talent on that team around him and for the most part, it's apologists making a bull crap claim. I think he falls on draft day. Falls hard.

A failure to address both the offensive line, the WR and the quarterback in the first round and even with that, not having moved up? I'd see it as a misstep. At 22 you'd almost certainly see at least two if not three interior All Pro lineman. I don't care a wit for Lamar Jackson (obviously), but either he or Baker Mayfield should have been available at 12 (which would mean you'd likely have a shot at one or two pretty good linebackers at 22). At 56, I'm guessing that this draft has bypassed on Washington or several other fairly good WRs in order to get a TE. No. I think this represents a horrible outcome - like the worst of all possible outcomes to me. Not that I'm some GM, but this draft completely ignores some of our biggest weaknesses so we can get ... a CB????? Not a fan, at all. Worst price ever paid that I can think of is the Washington Redskins to get RG3. Three 1sts in a row, wasn't it? They were in purgatory for awhile. You put a rookie QB behind our offensive line without another first round pick until 2020, and you will know what is to be destitute. And if that QB is scrambled eggs Rosen? You should have taken a shotgun and brought him out back to the woodpile before the season and just been humane. I'm all in on getting Baker. I think he's a generational talent, better than all the QBs taken since Andrew Luck. And I wouldn't do that to him.

I go to the highest point I can find and sit in the nude with my feet in a warm water bath, a lightning rod pointed to the heavens. In the past I had a series of spreadsheets set up, linked from an alpha sheet showing the draft order with links to complete player eligible and team needs - I'm kind of an Excel geek that way. I'd have a PC and a laptop and the TV. This year I'll have First Pick open on a tablet. I can run updates on the site, pick by pick and come out with potential outcomes so fast. Dinner is always wings. I've got a nice bottle of champagne chilled for when my boy is called by the Buffalo Bills. Come home, Baker Mayfield.

You can say he was rambling; that he maltreated the word "ethnicity". But you must admit it is at least an original take.

No particular order: Did you actually read my profile, what I said about myself? I was on Buff A L Orange. I come and go. Not terribly interested in things like "points" and whether or not I am popular. On occasion I remember my username/pwd, on occasion I don't and it doesn't bother me terribly. I mention in my profile at least one of my prevoius nom de plume. 12 years is likely on the low end, but I'd rather understate than overstate. I can recall writing that Mike Williams was the safer pick after the fact over Bryant McKinnie; pretty sure I was posting before that. I'm sorry if I don't remember you from those times. There was this really obnoxious poster ... Shiva? I think? Obnoxious, but about the smartest guy ... the term rapier wit was created for him. You wouldn't want to get into a debate with him. Five threads on Lamar Jackson, yeah; I saw several at least. One was making a case FOR Jackson (of course, I'm not); another was about a tweet, a third was something not related to my point. What I have been saying, over and over and over again, is that I didn't see any that in any was vaguely was approaching the two points in the way I was. I'm not in the business of doing deep dives into threads to see if individual post might be the same as mine. I think it's kind of absurd to expect me to and again, nobody has to open the thread and read it nor respond to it. I think, on surface, the idea behind the OP is different behind the OP of the those threads. No? Okay. If there are FIVE other threads on Jackson, there have to be 8 or 10 on Baker Mayfield. He's my boy. I haven't created a thread about that. There are two separate threads in the last several days that seem to go on for pages and pages regarding Wonderlic and LJ. I'm not going to read into the pages because it's not a subject I like. But .... did any one rage on and on about LAMP then? Did you? DID GOBILLS2012? DID THE MODS EVEN TRY TO MERGE THOSE TWO? Again, I have no idea and it's not worth my time to check. I believe the moral outrage over the two threads is missing. What you wouldn't know about me: I must delete about 15- 20 posts a week that I start to write because I don't think they are adding to the general discussion here. So I am not in the habit of just babbling. And if you've actually looked at my responses in general you'd find I am pretty rational nor someone that wastes time. So ... I'm f'in sick and tired of defending myself because some people think this one thread is the worst thing on god's good green earth when others create thread after thread after thread here. It's absurd. Like I've said, just limit us all to five threads. Don't allow us to create a thread without it being vetted by the Mod first. Much ado about nothing, and I'm only responding to this thread so I can say this: Sure. Love to meet up with another Bills fan. I love talking about the game and learning from other people about this sport. I don't drink much beer anymore but the talk is always welcome. If I find myself around a venue and I know you'll be there, I'll introduce myself. There are literally a dozen Baker Mayfield threads in the last few days. I'll take you seriously again as a person when you can point to at least four different times when you've gone to the effort to squawk about LAMPs in those threads. Not that it matters to you, but until then I'm sure you can understand that I see you as just noise and a hypocrite of the first order.

Since I put zero importance in an intelligence thread, you wouldn't see that from me. There is excellent data from PFF I believe on QB intelligence, but that has been covered - mostly on people that like Baker Mayfield. Cheers.

I agree with this 100%. One Hundred Percent. With one thing as a precursor: Let's have five threads on QBs. Just five; cover the five top QBs. Nearly nothing can be said that hasn't already been said, someplace, somewhere. You and everyone else here should have their mouths muzzled. The only time a thread can be created is by a Mod, and even then ... why not just put news updates within a QB profile? Not being sarcastic, not trying to be snarky. No more new threads on QBs by anyone. Seems to make sense to me. oops. Thank you.

I did, didn't find it. If you want to suggest I am a "newbie" I'd suggest you look at my profile and act like someone that has been around here awhile. I started posting on !@#$ over 12 years ago. So there's that.

I'm not asking anyone to "move on from the board" - like you are asking me. I generally act pretty rationally, prone to outbursts like all the posters here. I respond positively on occasion when I am shown I am wrong. When attacked without what I consider to be due cause I react, sometimes badly. I'm not asking GoBills2012 or anyone to leave TwoBillsDrive, like you are doing right now. I am saying you are free to move on and not say anything about it. What you and others are doing is whining. There's other threads to read. Go there. But I'm glad we've had this conversation. It reveals you and GoBills2012 and others for being presumptive and to think I didn't go looking for a take that centered around his mom/not being ready to be interviewed. For essentially going forward into the draft process like he needed to be indulged. If anyone ELSE has been insulted, I'm man enough to offer apologies. And to tell you to get the damned sand out of your panties. Oh, and sorry to disturb you Irish. Not going anywhere and you and those that would seek to tell posters not to stick around: Go F yourself. Good take, well said. Yes - exactly. He is acting ultimately in a counterproductive manner. Teams are going to "play" him. They'll try to drive down his stock value. There are vague comments coming from Mike Mayock of all people saying that GMs can't get an appointment to see him. It comes off (to me) as if he desires to be treated 100% differently than the rest of the QBs. Cheers. Read through my posts. I was saying that people don't need to respond to me or this thread. In my time posting here, in posting on !@#$, I've always respected the right of an opinion no matter how bizarre. You don't like the opinion, attack the opinion. Not the right to state it, which is pretty been the response from nearly all the posters responding to this thread. Not that I care. I didn't see where someone else had posted anything similar to what I was saying so I put something up about it. Could have missed it. But ... Dopey, you go ahead and write whatever the voices in your head tell you to post. I don't care.

IMO, we are given hoops to jump through. Chose to jump through the hoop or don't, but there is a price to be paid. Like I have said elsewhere, this is an interview process, a path to getting a job. Other QBs understand this, pretty clearly. I myself have said that the 40 - along with 225 reps - is among the most meaningless stats in football. There is a massive difference between whether the activity has meaning, and refusing to do it entirely, and then on top of all of that being in a very, very competitive situation.

Yep. I'll stack my 1099 with just about anyone here. How about you?

Great. You don't think the take is good, I can handle that; you don't think it is important that he is self-indulgent, I'll respond to that. The concept that you don't like the proliferation of threads on the website? Laughable. You don't like the take, respond or move on. You aren't required to say anything. And it strikes me that the ultimate outcome of your fears about proliferation suggests there should be 6 threads. Cheers.

Between the lines? There was a time when I thought he matched up well with the Bills. Talent has to match what's inside your head and what you'll do. The NFL is chock full of incredibly talented players. This year, the competition at his position couldn't be fiercer. Strikes me that in that situation you'd be doing whatever it took to be considered appropriately. Look at what you hear out of other QBs. Maybe you want that out of your leader, maybe its an indicator of someone with willpower to see himself in his own way. Enough is enough. If you aren't running at the Combine, then at the Pro Day, then you damned sure better believe everything else in your life is so buttoned up that there isn't a question. Yeah. I read that thread. Didn't see this point made in it. Wanted to make it separately - specifically the points about GMs complaining about not having access, about him not running a second time and putting the points together. So don't read the f'in post and move on jack.

Having a take is self indulgence? Then get off the board. My lifetime's income ain't based on what I write here.

So he didn't want to run at the Combine, fine. Now he doesn't want to run at the Pro day. So he doesn't want an agent, now teams are barking they can't get a meeting. I get it, a lot of crap being dropped in his direction to have him fall in the draft. On some level, you have a guy with a 56-57% completion rate, who still has problems with his footwork, who showed badly at the Combine and frankly from what I've seen, at the Pro Day, for whom analysts are continuing to blame his WR (I mean, does the phrase "catchable ball" mean anything anymore?). Shouldn't someone be telling him that he is merely feeding the smokescreens by doing things like not running? Hell Lamar we get it. You aren't going to be a WR. Now get out there and run the damned 40 - and yeah, we all know it's an irrelevant number. It just strikes me as a whole lot of self-indulgence. There's a reason for expectations and not all of it is in the outcome of the expectations. Sometimes its just to see if you will go through the hoops without questioning. Gotta say .. WTF do you think you are? #process #notaBill

On some level we need to look at the history of the Browns recently. If they were to take the Bills "offer" ... getting another 1st in 2019 would give them multiple first round picks 6 out of 8 years. It would amount to 17 first round picks in only 7 years. In the last five years ... ZERO Pro Bowls in 11 attempts. These guys have been the 1962 Mets among draft analysts. Yeah, I know, I know, Peppers and Garrett have a lot of potential. What- ev. Anyways, pretty much love the cbs draft. Drafted Players Rk Year Rnd Pick Pos DrAge From To AP1 PB St CarAV G GS QBrec Cmp Att Yds TD Int Att Yds TD Rec Yds TD Int Sk College/Univ 1 2017 1 1 Myles Garrett DE 21 2017 2017 0 0 1 4 11 9 7.0 Texas A&M College Stats 2 2017 1 25 Jabrill Peppers S 21 2017 2017 0 0 1 5 13 13 1 Michigan College Stats 3 2017 1 29 David Njoku TE 21 2017 2017 0 0 0 2 16 5 1 1 0 32 386 4 Miami (FL) College Stats 4 2016 1 15 Corey Coleman WR 22 2016 2017 0 0 2 5 19 18 2 10 0 56 718 5 Baylor College Stats 5 2015 1 12 Danny Shelton NT 22 2015 2017 0 0 3 16 46 44 1.5 Washington College Stats 6 2015 1 19 Cameron Erving C 23 2015 2017 0 0 1 10 42 21 Florida St. College Stats 7 2014 1 8 Justin Gilbert DB 22 2014 2016 0 0 0 4 35 3 1 Oklahoma St. College Stats 8 2014 1 22 Johnny Manziel QB 21 2014 2015 0 0 0 5 15 8 2-6-0 147 258 1675 7 7 46 259 1 Texas A&M College Stats 9 2013 1 6 Barkevious Mingo LB 22 2013 2017 0 0 1 16 78 23 1 9.0 LSU College Stats 10 2012 1 3 Trent Richardson RB 22 2012 2014 0 0 3 17 46 37 614 2032 17 113 912 2 Alabama College Stats 11 2012 1 22 Brandon Weeden QB 28 2012 2015 0 0 1 14 34 25 6-19-0 559 965 6462 31 30 61 201 1 0 -9 0 Oklahoma St. College Stats

Haven't we though? Haven't we seen this guy over and over again in the NFL? Does we really think AJM is any worse than this guy? Just another un-athletic, white guy without really a cannon for an arm that was considered a "leader". Mr.Picked 5th in the draft Passing Statistics for Career Games 2009 to 2012 Games Passing Passing Year Tm G GS QBrec Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD TD% Int Int% Lng Y/A AY/A Y/C Y/G Rate QBR Sk Yds NY/A ANY/A Sk% 4QC GWD Average 16 16 257 467 3023 17 17 32 204 Per 16 Games 16 16 265 482 3121 18 18 33 211 2009-2012 NFL 62 62 33-29-0 1028 1867 55.1 12092 68 3.6 69 3.7 74 6.5 5.5 11.8 195.0 71.7 126 818 5.66 4.78 6.3 All he did was get to the AFC Championship game twice in his first two years, and compile a 4-2 playoff record. I think AJ McCarron can easily equal Mark Sanchez ... if we can get Nick Mangold and D'Brick Ferguson to block for him. Heck, I think he's way BETTER than Sanchez. Team game. Will always be a team game as much as knuckleheads want to make it about the QB. Not many QBs make the team, so stop looking for one or you'll drive yourself crazy. Get some offensive lineman, get that linebacker we need and you might make the playoffs.

I'm pretty sure I'm the only guy that has said Baker should go #1 overall. Huge, huge fan of the guy. That said, this could be a legit question. Except this: he's not ONLY known success. We are all familiar with the story on how he got to OU. I don't recall him winning any national championships. Criticism has served as his fuel, and that's a good thing cause he's going to fail a bunch. I'd rather have the guy that has risen above. Sport is full of these athletes. I think he's special on so many levels - he's the guy that lifts themselves and others and are always of the moment. My only fear is having to face him twice a year.

Leif Larsen sighting here ...