Kelly the Dog

Agree with all of that. I would add that people were so frustrated with Tyrod not getting the ball out quick they WAY overvalued Nate able to do that and for some reason just ignored that he had other glaring weaknesses. Combined with thinking that his great stats and moving the chains in the preseason equated to a huge improvement in his game when all it really did was show stuff we already knew and didn't ever show stuff we should have been worrying about.

That's exactly right. I said the same analogy earlier. I was hoping Nate would prove me wrong and show elements of his game I feared he lacked. But all of them were clear here. He's Tasker to me. Love the guy. Hate him as an announcer. Shouldn't be doing this job at this level.

When teams know you cannot beat them 15-50 yards downfield it is easy for them to take Shady out of the game. Many people here predicted that and it's exactly what happened. None of the core problems of this game were Shady's fault.

No. That's not true. Practices and preseason is three quarters speed. If the ball is getting to the WR on out patterns and barely completed or near interceptions at three quarters speed, it's pretty easy to extrapolate those passes are incomplete or INTs at real speed. It's the same reason he was a #5 pick.

And assign more weight to character and cleanliness than talent and skill and production. Character is important but not most important.

Yep. That's another thing I don't understand at all about McBeane. They had to convince Kyle to come back. They only have Shady in his prime for X amount of time. And yet they didn't address the OL or WR seriously at all.

Yeah. That's an extremely hard catch even if it hits the WR in the hands because of the quick misdirection. The ball was also five yards short. But Allen looked good.

What I can't figure out is how so many people think he can or has done things he really doesn't do. The arm issue, which is huge, is only one of 4-5 glaring deficiencies. I said here in the spring that Peterman is not even going to make the team. I was ultimately dead wrong about that (even though he shouldn't have). But in the same breath, before OTAs even started, said my biggest fear was he would wow the coaches and fans in practice and preseason because he does certain things well that CAN succeed in practice and preseason but not when real bullets fly. That's exactly what happened. And I'm not always right at all. I made other predictions that didn't come true. But that was OBVIOUS to me. And it's scary to think McD didn't see it.

Maybe. But at least he gets sacked and fumbles a lot.

Excluding the penalties I thought the OL was average. There were a lot of plays Nate and Josh had a decent amount of time. Not good of course. Far from it. But there weren't the jailbreaks most every play I feared.

Didn't the Foster pass hit the back of the defender before it hit Fosters hands?

Yep. And JT didn't really belong in the league either.

Maybe his team. I think that McD might set an all time NFL record tomorrow for apologizing to his team twice for the exact same decision. For a guy who constantly says how important it is for a player to learn from his mistakes and never make the same one twice, perhaps it's time to look inward.

I'm not giving up on McD yet and hope I never do. No coach is going to be right much more than 50-60% of his decisions, including Bellichick whom I consider the best ever. But McD puts SO much weight on character and practice and attitude and off field life and film study and weight room, etc, that it may cloud or override his NFL game day player evaluation. He loves Nate for a lot of good reasons. But he seems blind to actual ability and performance.

I think it's about 50-50. If I HAD to bet I would say Nate starts because McD is stubborn. I don't even think NP should be in the league. But if he does start Nate next week, at home, and in the first two series he looks bad, which is a very possible if not likely scenario, the boos from the crowd will be deafening. The veterans and good players on the team would have to question whether their coach knows what he is doing, which is a huge factor. If Allen starts and he does the exact same thing as I think Nate might, and looks awful for two series, no one will care, no one would question the coach.

Trent was substantially better and may still be now, and Trent stinks.

The first start was literally the worst half in the history of the NFL. The very worst. The snow game doesnt really count because everything for every player on both teams is thrown out the window because of the snow. The second real start had to be one of the worst halves in NFL history. No first downs. An INT. There were worse stat games but not one first down? Could be a trend. How do you start him again?

My buddy said before the game that Nate looked scared. He doesn't portray confidence or inspire teammates. Josh seems to immediately do that. You saw it in preseason. Even when Nate was great he didn't seem to change his demeanor outside of the immediate joy of a TD. He panics in real games. It's pretty obvious.

The defense was awful. The special teams dropped a snap, missed a FG and gave up a long return. The Ravens scored 47 points. But one TD was a three yard drive from an INT on Peterman. The Ravens got at least two extra series in the first half because we got zero first downs, and scored on a two minute offense they never would have got if Nate wasn't so bad. The team got very discouraged early on all units.

The deep ball to Foster was five yards short. But I agree with you.

That was one of his worst passes. It was five yards short for no reason. He had a lot of very good throws though. Nate had an upwards of none.

The Dennison and Castillo hires were disasters. There are certain things I like about Daboll but he hasn't had a good track record. I have no idea what he thinks about Peterman and whether that was a clear McD decision over Daboll but if he really thought Nate could play well in this league that could be a huge flag. He wasn't given much to work with. We'll see what he does with Josh soon. But there is nothing so far to make me think McD knows much about offense.

It was somewhat of an unusual situation. He was actually playing well and then he got hurt. Missed most if not all of his second last year. The guy that replaced him because he was hurt was Calvin Ridley. Then last year, they played a QB that couldn't throw a ball, he didn't play much and Ridley was a #1 pick.

But my point in that game is he did everything we already knew he could do in that game and nothing that were his deficiencies. I kept harping on here that yes he played great in the short game but no he did not at any time show sufficient arm strength, he didn't show he could throw downfield or over the middle, he didn't show he was good in the pocket under a heavy rush, he didn't show that he could back a defense off him that was determined to stop the run. And all of those which were said by me and other NP detractors were blatant today.

No, Allen threw 5-6 very good passes and Nate threw none. I don't know the math but it's about 872,700% better.