Dawgg

Yawn. I don't need your certification on what a true fan represents. Watching McCargo play in college, considering who he played with, and looking at the value of the picks the Bills gave up, it was pretty easy to see that this trade was a dumb move at the time. Despite that, you were vociferous in your support. You call it being a "good fan," I call it being straight up gullible. Nobody wanted McCargo to fail once he donned a Bills uniform. But it was pretty obvious that it was a bad pick at the time and it's even more obvious now. If supporting questionable moves constitutes being a "real fan," be my guest! He plays hard. He doesn't make many plays... which is perfectly fine, we can't expect all 11 players on defense to be great. But considering the constant praise he receives on this board, many of whom think he's already an All-Pro, it's rather laughable because his play does not come close to matching the praise he gets. As for Vince Young, he did win Rookie of the Year and go to the Pro Bowl as a rookie QB. He's a good player, he just happens to be a psycho.

I'd rather see the Bills make good moves than bad ones. Many moves they have made are good. And I give them due credit for that. Many moves they make are questionable. I don't hesitate to criticize those moves. If you want to assess my character from an internet message board, be my guest. I couldn't care less about what you think. It's apparent that you're not all that bright. You can attack Dvoracek and Manning all you want. The bottom line is that they're good enough to make this Bills team and they bring more to the table than McCargo. You were wrong about the McCargo pick. Admit it like a man, and move on. Had the Bills kept those 2 picks, they likely would have addressed other needs. Starting tackles Daryn Colledge and Marcus McNeill were both available in slot where Manning was picked. And leave it to you to judge a player by the number of tackles he has -- a DT no less. It makes perfect sense. No wonder you have a permanent hard-on for Donte Whitner. He has 100 tackles, he MUST be a Pro Bowler! The Bears defense is ranked 6th in rush defense, allowing 85 yards a game. Dvoracek has been a big part of that. The Bills are 13th. Nice try, come again.

I'm glad you pay close attention to my posting patterns, it's quite flattering actually. Given the fact that the Bills hold one of the longest-standing playoff droughts in the NFL alongside perennial doormats like Arizona and Detroit, the Bills have been "down" for the better part of the last decade. So yes, statistically speaking, the chances are significant that more posts will be during "down" periods than "up" periods, as the "up" periods have been few and far between! Unlike you, I don't gush about marginal players. I was right about McCargo from the start (you were wrong). I was (and still am) right about Dockery being overpaid and overrated (you were wrong) and I was right about the fact that JP ought to be benched in favor of Trent Edwards (you were wrong). I think you need to put away your Whitner jersey and give some love to the real stars on this team -- guys who, unlike Whitner, bring it every Sunday with their PLAY as opposed to grandstanding in front of the press. Guys like Trent Edwards, Marshawn Lynch, and Lee Evans.

Really? Nice try, anyway. I have plenty of praise to give to the players who actually earn it on the field, not with their rhetoric.

Excuse #247 for Donte. Keep em coming! His play on the field is slowly but surely confirming what has been obvious for quite some time. Donte's talk > Donte's walk.

This is a great move. In limited action, both this year and last, Scott has shown flashes of being a very good player. Moving Whitner over will take better advantage of his speed. I like

Ah the usual Ramius to C. Biscuit reach-around. Pretty typical of you considering that you have blindly supported every move the Bills made, like a sheep. But wait... there was ONE move you were pretty vocally against: Benching JP Losman in favor of Trent Edwards. How does that one look now? Looks as though you're still trying to defend the McCargo pick, as you have for the past few years. Dvoracek and Manning vs. John McCargo -- you do the math. Dvoracek is starting and playing well at DT. Manning has contributed a lot to the team, both on kick returns and defense. As for Vince Young, he has hit a setback but he has accomplished quite a bit in his limited career and he'll be back.

Well... Whitner standing around and watching the onsides kick didn't help the outcome that fateful Monday night As for "facts" see SN's post directly below yours. Those are facts... keep dancing around them if you so choose.

Precisely right. Let's not forget Jason Witten's 9 catches for 110 yards in last year's Monday Night debacle.

If he makes the Pro Bowl, then yes. The bottom line is that he's a good player NOT a great one. Your definition of "great" is awfully convenient in this case, but it's flat-out wrong. By your definition, Fred Jackson is a great player, as he certainly makes the players around him better. Great players at the safety position make game-changing plays. It's nice that he's versatile and it's wonderful that he's likes to talk the talk... but the bottom line is this: he has yet to show that he's an elite player at his position. Freester is right. In the 2006 draft, a high first, high second and high third were spent and the output of that is a good (and improving), versatile safety who is adept at PR.

If you strike gold with a QB anywhere in the draft, it can make up for mistakes. I stated from the day of the draft that the Trent Edwards pick could be the best of all Marv's picks because it was a value selection. One of the strengths of this front office is finding value in rounds 2-4... which is why I think the Bills should accumulate picks in those rounds rather than trade them away to move up in the draft.

... what he said.

But pretty typical. Par for the course, Whitner makes a greater impact with his rhetoric than his play on the field.

Competent. He knows the offense, executes the plays to perfection and doesn't force the ball when a play isn't there. He also feels the rush and isn't afraid to step in the pocket and throw, as he showed before that big hit he sustained in Arizona. In time, when and IF he develops more accuracy with his deep ball, he can be a great QB. But for now, he's a very good, competent and efficient QB. I'll take that any day of the week, especially on Sundays

Trent Edwards makes all the difference in the world for this team. Super accurate, doesn't turn the ball over and spreads the ball around. That 3rd round pick alone was key to turning this franchise around.

You are absolutely right. Donte has been a solid player, nothing more. He has made about the same impact on the field as Kyle Williams. Solid, borderline good... nothing spectacular. That said, the key difference between Donte and Kyle Williams: Donte knows how to work the media. And the fans here at TBD eat it up!

Seriously. His famous Thursday night film sessions and letting Leodis crash at his house are two of his finest accomplishments in the NFL!

He played that in college, but he'd also be a great nose tackle in the 4-3. Nuff said.

Indeed. And thus far, Whitner has made more waves with his rhetoric than his play.

Would they have made the Whitner pick and passed on Ngata had they known that McCargo was not a starting-caliber NFL player? I doubt it.

It's really amazing isn't it? Whitner is a nice team leader, but my guess is that if the FO had to do it again, they'd take Ngata. The only reason they passed on him was because they planned to get cute and trade back into the first round to nab McCargo. They felt that he would be adequate at the all-important DT position. Had they known at the time that they were dead wrong about McCargo, they would have passed on Whitner and taken the premium DT. Unfortunately, they misjudged the situation badly and the defense has paid for it since.

This board is ready to enshrine the guy in Canton!

Ngata didn't have any such problems with his work ethic. In fact, pre-draft reports indicated the contrary. When you're rebuilding and you have a choice of (a) a very good, not great DT and (b) a very good, but not great Safety, you always always ALWAYS take the DT – unless the safety has very rare game-changing ability. When confronted with this decision, the Bills thought they could get cute by taking the safety and trading back into the first round and nabbing McCargo to address the DT need. Yesterday's trade is their admission that the move blew up in their face. And they surrendered a high 2nd and high 3rd in one of the deepest drafts in years in the process. Whitner is a good player in his own right and he's a great locker-room guy. And his PR savvy has made him a media darling. But it seems to me that the front office picked him over Ngata in large part because they had their eyes on McCargo. As it turns out, they were wrong. If there's one thing I like about this front office, it's that they are more than willing to ship players out who lack motivation. McGahee and McCargo are prime examples.

Looks like you've been reading too much Chris Brown. Folks around the league regard him as a good young player. A star? Hardly.

The fact that you spent $225 on his jersey does not make him a star.