Dawgg

Sure, his problems only manifested themselves "this year." A number of people knew, from watching him play at NC State, that he was not a good player and that he was simply riding the coat-tails of Manny Lawson and Mario Williams. When intelligent fans called it out, folks like you were quick with the personal attacks. Now, when it's clear that you were wrong, you pull the "I'm a fan and you're not excuse." How pathetic. Objective fans are capable of calling a spade a spade and don't simply extol every personnel move because the player wears red, white and blue.

From the man who thought John McCargo would make a good pro?

Nah, it was actually fairly obvious that Whitner and McCargo were busts waiting to happen in 2006. Their play just merely confirmed it.

I know what I said, thanks though. That post was more a function of me expressing my disdain for the current ineptitude that is our coaching staff than condoning straight up insubordination.

My point wasn't to say he will be disobedient to the coach; rather, that he will make plays despite an inept coaching staff -- something that Whitner is incapable of doing. Jauron and his staff have made a habit out of discovering players by accident. They didn't give McKelvin a chance to play, instead choosing an injured McGee. They didn't give Fred Jackson a chance, instead choosing an over-the-hill Anthony Thomas. It was by sheer coincidence and by sheer necessity that these guys made the plays that they made. That's what I was getting at with respect to this USC fellow. He will make plays and he has a drive that is seriously lacking on the Bills' roster. You can hurl all the personal insults you want if it gets you off having a holier than thou attitude on an internet message board, that's your prerogative. The fact remains that a sizable percentage of 12,000+ posts were your attempts to defend the strategy behind the Bills' 2006 draft, which has clearly turned out to be a dud. You also claimed that Poz would be a significantly better player than David Harris a few years down the road. Par for the course, you were wrong. I suppose we should be getting used to such a pattern...

EXACTLY why we need a guy like him -- someone who just does whatever the F*** he wants, plays with heart and uses his instincts. Way too many pansies on this team who were born to lose and love playing for their coddling coach (read: Butler, Kelsay, etc). This guy strikes me as an in-your-face dude who'll do whatever he has to do to make a play, even if that means telling the coach to shove it.

Exactly. And I think Erin doesn't mind the free PR that ensued. Here's hoping the Bills pick him

A distraction??? That's exactly what this team needs! I'd be thrilled if they took this guy.

Vincent was worthless from the start and Adams openly clashed with management, so agreed there. Milloy had no such issues. There's a reason he has started in the league for so long and that someone will inevitably sign him this offseason to start for them at the age of 36. Ultimately, the Bills' brass had their sights set on Whitner for a long time, which is why they cut Milloy in the offseason, why they passed on Ngata in the draft, and why they cowered in fear and didn't accept a lucrative offer to trade down. They placed a big bet on Donte Whitner and they failed. I'd love to see Donte turn it around and won't say it's impossible -- but sadly, he seems destined for mediocrity.

Tell that to C. Biscuit97!

The entire defense was poor. I didn't think Milloy himself played all that badly. The run defense was so poor, that Milloy spent most of the game as a 4th linebacker. He was also an assertive veteran leader. There was no desperate need to get rid of him and replace him in light of the fact that (a) he was not expensive, (b) he was still a pretty good player and © Whitner doesn't represent a significant upgrade.

There's no doubt. The dude was playing with a strained back. He was out in last week's game and could barely walk. He was limited in practice all week. Bottom line, he played great all season long, aside from the first half in today's game. He's playing far better than any safety in Buffalo, that's for sure. Not bad for an old guy!

The point is not so much the grade itself as it is the wishy washy justifications you use to bring out supposed "positives" in McCargo's play. The organization wasted a high 2nd and a high 3rd on him and have nothing to show for it. He has been buried in the depth chart and unlike Youboty, McCargo's problems run far deeper than unfortunate injuries. There were significant issues with his work ethic, motivation, and practice habits. Naturally, the coaching staff lost faith in him early on and had to fine him for showing up out of shape. Adding "context" to these types of picks is for the Matt Millens of the world. I suppose WR Mike Williams and QB Joey Harrington showed "flashes" because they have 2 arms and 2 legs... but that doesn't count for much on Sundays.

Seriously. Unlike Whitner, Milloy has played at an extremely high level all season long. He's off to a poor start but it doesn't change the fact that Milloy, even at age 35, is better than any safety on the Bills roster (including Donte "Loud Mouth" Whitner).

Based on injuries??? How about the fact that he showed up to camp fat and out of shape and was fined by his coaches? The fact that the scouting staff failed to see this lack of motivation and spent a first-round pick on him should get them fired. How about the fact that he played on a line with two superior players, thereby inflating his value? The vast majority of NFL teams had a second-round grade on him. Only the Bills were gullible enough to not only trade up, but to waste a first-round pick on him. The "flashes" you refer to were a single defensive series against Denver. As AKC has pointed out, that was a stroke of luck. He abandoned his gaps and the play just came to him. McCargo sucks, was a complete bust... and the fact that you grade this pick with anything better than an F is indicative of your lack of objectivity.

New England drafts well. The Bills don't. New England doesn't overpay for subpar players. The Bills do. There's your answer.

Yet another brilliant pick by Marv in the 2006 draft. Whitner -- barely average. McCargo -- bust. Youboty -- barely healthy. Simpson -- bust / arrested.

Take off the beer goggles Dean!

He's a fine coach, but you can't strip his GM duties away from him... he simply won't buy into that because he can get full control elsewhere. Thus, they were forced to fire him. Change after 14 years is probably needed anyway. As for DJ, if fans want to express anger, they should look no further than Jim Overdorf, John Guy, and Tom Modrak. They are the reason this team flat out sucks. They drafted poorly, let good players go to sign mediocre players to inflated deals, and failed to address the true needs of this team.

That comment right there shows you don't know what you're talking about. Shanahan was fired just as much for his personnel moves as his coaching. He has built and re-built the defense 3 times, spending lavishly on free agents with very little result. He has drafted very poorly in the past few years. Not to mention, since the Super Bowl wins how many winning seasons has he had? Look it up. That's your homework for the day.

I was just being sarcastic. I was calling out Marv for his awful drafts and poor free agent signings a long time ago and was accused for not being a "true fan" because of my negative posts. Now, these same sheep are flooding the message board with negative commentary. Oh the irony

You guys real fans or what?

You realize he has played at a mediocre level throughout his career, right?

Sounds eerily familiar, kind of like the excuses you used to make for John McCargo!

Problem with Whitner is that he talks like he gives a shi-- but often plays like he doesn't. McGee, McKelvin, Fred Jackson, Josh Reed... those guys play like they care about winning – and it shows.