BeginnersMind

What is the question? Bridge is failing and some solutions are on the table for consideration.

Have the Russians write the check to the Jews on your behalf.

I have a Constitutional right to give you measles, as well as the right to believe my god will cure me. And right at the top of the news today: Thanks asswholes. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/22/world/asia/japan-measles-outbreak.html

I give this guy credit for calling for the re-vote. That was the moral high ground. It took some pressure but it's the right decision. Bravo to him. It seems like most pols go to the mat lying, kicking, and screaming.

Relatives of The Dude, no doubt.

Most people are not as smart as their doctors. Maybe you are. ...but don't give my kid polio with all the knowledge in your WebMD. It is not your decision when you decide to make decisions that kill me and my kids. Life and Pursuit of Happiness and all of that stuff matter. Sure, it's a slippery slope to government mandated euthanasia and all of that. Here’s the deal: When morons make bad decisions that kill me and give me polio, I would like to appeal to an authority who can make the morons stop. That authority is the government. If you want to vote out people who think we should make it mandatory for school kids to get vaccines, vote 'em out. Or just move to California or Washington and be free to live in hippy vaccine free heaven. But mind the measles outbreaks.

To the people accusing a strawman of saying it is ignoring that some vaccines have risks, no one denies this minimal risk. Every vaccine is given at a doctor’s office with warnings. And if you are likely to have a terrible reaction due to previous ones or relatives who are suscsptible, you won’t take the vaccine. And you will take public health precautions. Those folks are so incredibly few in number, as are those for whom the vaccine may be ineffective, that as long as the rest of us get vaccinated, *we keep them safe*. That’s why we keep talking about transmission benefits of vaccines. That’s the miraculous benefit of vaccines and how public health works. Isn’t that sort of actually great? But when you add those people, for whom I feel compassion, to the growing anti vaccine crowd, of which you become one by advocating their dangerous arguments to encourage more of them, we reach a tipping point on public health and have the return of measles, once eliminated in the US, and polio outbreaks. People think vaccines will give them [autism/headaches/whatever], believe there's a [big pharma/big government] conspiracy, or have faith in [God/Allah/Druidic spells]... and don't go to their doctor to discuss vaccines because they know better. Talk to your doctor. Get vaccinated. No polio for the rest of us. You say you hate anti anti vaxers. That’s great. I hate seeing kids with polio. I am pro VAX.

Vaccines work. Except when morons don’t vaccinate and kill people. Can I make it any simpler? Are we really doing this in 2019? This isn’t rocket science people. There’s no grand conspiracy. Vaccines just work. But to prevent transmission for many diseases, they need mass adoption. Please read up on the measles comeback. It was 100% preventable. And then came the anti vax make beleive non science.

Here’s the thing. The pursuit of life and happiness gets ***** up when you (apparently not you personally but the you of this argument) contribute to the spread of polio, measles, etc. So if you want to send your kid into a school, where disease transmission is on hyperdrive, the government can require you to vaccinate your kid. So they don’t help kill other kids. And if you don’t like it, homeschool that kid up, live in the compound bubble, and please order your deliveries by drone. Don’t use hospitals. Don’t go to movies. Never leave and re enter the US. And on and on. There will be moments when the government will give you a choice: vaccine and some privilege (like school) vs life in a bubble in Colorado. Make the better choice.

Don't. Kill. Other. People. (Stupid-head.)

California, Washington have lax to no school requirements...this is, as I mentioned earlier...an interesting intersection of the fringes of Ds and Rs coming together. Conspiracy "think" overlap. The measles thing is incredible.

Don't kill my kid, or me, or other people and I'll be happy to stay out. You can be as stupid as you want and lather up in the conspiracy pool all day, but I have those boundaries.

Don't kill my kid. And hopefully the government and every school denies unvaccinated kids access to any contact with anyone where legal. But it's Trump's administration that is considering mandatory vaccination [for school students] because there is an outbreak of stupidity, which unfortunately can't be cured. [edited for clarity]

Vaccines prevent disease at a high rate, but more importantly, they prevent the SPREAD of disease to those people who might otherwise be in the low percentage of people for whom they are ineffective. How hard is this to understand? I, too, am against government overreach. But if your stupidity goes so far that you think it's your right not to vaccinate your kids and that action along with the other morons who think similarly, OF COURSE, leads to epidemics that kill and infect lots of other people, then yes, I'm for government intervention. I'd prefer that people were just plan smarter and got vaccinated...like they used to. But Jenny McCarthy has won and the Internet can give echo to any kooky belief, so people read that if they get a vaccine, their kid will get autism and go with that. And now we have polio outbreaks in America. Polio FFS.

He did that to counter your silly point that the only good vaccine is one that is 100% effective and riskproof. So he pulled out the smallpox vaccine as an example of close to 100%. Repeating: If almost everyone is vaccinated, and the vaccines work *almost* perfectly, the diseases don't spread and those for whom the vaccine was ineffective don't get exposed. Controlling epidemics is a worthy result of vaccines. Get vaccinated. Get your kids vaccinated. If you don't, you put my kid at risk, and that's not OK. And since there are no so many anti-vaxxers whose "knowledge" is completely wrong, it's turning into time for the government to take steps to ensure that people don't kill each other because of their wanton stupidity. If all you did was kill you and your kid by refusing vaccines, I'm cool with that. If the Jehovah's Witnesses want to refuse medical treatment, god bless 'em. But when your refusal to take advantage of simple medicine increases the chance of global epidemic, ***** you. Want to work to make vaccines safer? OK fine. But get vaccinated.

No it's not. There is no question that vaccines are a benefit to humans, unless you just want us to have more diseases and illnesses. No, it's cut and dry. If you want to advocate for safer vaccines, so be it that's fine. But the risks are minimal compared with the rewards.

Vaccines aren't 100%. But if Almost everyone is vaccinated, and the vaccines work *almost* perfectly, the diseases don't spread (and mutate for that matter) and those for whom the vaccine was ineffective don't get exposed. Said another way, less people with disease = less chance of infection. More people with disease = more chance of infection. This is one of the reasons vaccines are so effective. It's not that they are 100%. It's that they are just really good. And being really good has increased benefits than just to the vax recipient. There's no rational contest. There are just people who don't want to vaccinate. The problem is that their choice has a much better chance of killing many kids, including mine, than saving their kid from an immunological response. I don't like the government getting into my right to make ***** decisions. But certain ***** decisions that affect other people's lives and deaths require some more active measures. If you (not you, specifically, whatadrought) want to be stupid and risk contracting polio, that's on your dumb self. If you want to increase the chance that it goes to me and my children, ***** off.

Because he's our current president and his administrations actions this week prompted the current vaccine discussion. I also threw RFK Jr's son under the same dumb bus. Relax brother: It's OK to call Trump dumb when he is. It doesn't mean all Rs are dumb, as I said. Two people answered yes that vaccines cause autism. They should speak up and be heard (unless they are just joking).

And you're just talking about the flu vaccines. I'm more concerned about the people skipping the other vaccines because of the "autism risk" covered up by [big pharma/government/the man]. Jenny McCarthy, RFK Jr., and Trump could lead an amusing panel on this.

It's a good thing that Trump somehow listened to Bill Gates on vaccines. The road Trump was headed down with RFK Jr on the anti vaccine campaign was straight out of crazyville.

15:00, time's up. And I still don't know who he is.

Yeah. God forbid we read the report, then react to its contents...based on the contents and not preconceived notions.

Wait, so if the news is that there is collusion, then Mueller is a phony and a liar...and if the news is no collusion, then he's done an admirable job? That's the R view. The D view is reversed. And where is the part where Mueller and Trump are working together to root out Pizzagate? (Wrong thread for that theory's discussion.) Maybe we should just let the investigation play out, read the report, and draw conclusions. I expect there to be no collusion found between Trump and Russia. I also expect there to be a note about widespread corruption all around Trump, which we know to be true. He keeps dirty bedfellows. Say what now? https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_trump_job_approval-6179.html He's on a little spike up to 44ish these days but even Rasmussen doesn't have him at 50 yet.

Cohen in Congress should be great for America. Trump will need his Magneto helmet on to keep others safe from the shrapnel of his head from exploding--must be fun working in the White House right now.