Mikey152

On a side note... Curtis Samuel had 2 TDs receiving and 1 rushing from inside the 5 last year...that was top 10 at WR.

Mahomes has the most passing TDs inside the 5 and was 4th in total behind Hurts, Josh and Russell Wilson

On the other hand... Josh converted 8/14 rushing attempts into TDs...Mahomes was 0/6 (for negative 10 yards)

Better question is...shouldn't we care more about goalline scoring? Does it really matter HOW you score, or that you score? https://www.fantasypros.com/nfl/red-zone-stats/qb.php?yardline=5&range=full Josh Allen scored 14 TDs from inside the 5 last season rushing and passing. Mahomes scored 12 (all passing). 28 attempts for Josh and 25 for Pat... So, nothing to see here

Then why do they use QB sneaks so frequently on short yardage plays?

Do the Eagles have the same problem??? Short Yardage QB runs are the most successful, percentage wise, for a reason...They develop faster (taking advantage of the snap count advantage) and they don't render the QB as a useless player after the handoff. Tom Brady, aka the goat, used to use them all the time.

Not the inventor...Catan Studio is in Charlotteville (where Chris grew up). They were previously Mayfair games and have been making the english language ones for like 30 years. Was not a lie. Was probably talking about this guy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Fenlon

Honestly? I think it is already there on both sides of the football. It started happening when passing rules were changed to heavily favor the offense. All of a sudden, every offense has some kind of spread concept and all kinds of guys are lining up everywhere. Defense, in turn, got got lighter and more rangey (just look at MLB now), allowing them to switch and disguise more. Now offenses are countering back with 2 TE looks (ultimate flex guys) and Big slots to run more effectively and dominate the middle that isn't as scary anymore. Before you know it, there will be no rules. Punch and counterpunch. Hence why having a deep team vs a top heavy one at the skill positions is attractive...deep teams are inherently more flexible. Basketball pretty much has the same thing going on...Centers that shoot and guards that attack the rim and defend, and that was pretty much because of rule changes, too.

I don't think it matters much where they line up for the passing game. Payton had big guys inside less for passing and more for running...they liked to run power out of spread and WR blocked, so big guys near the ball and 12 personnel helped that.

I think there is a difference between being a balanced/complimentary offense and a coaches philosophy on how you do that. Using NO as an example (that's where he worked with Payton...it was his first job and not that long ago), it was this combination of spread pass with power run. Lots of bunch/condensed sets, motion, two TE, empty backfield. They used things like personnel groups, formation, motion and play sequence to attack defenses. In a nutshell, you can either change the route and keep the target to exploit a coverage, or you can keep the route and change the target. One requires a strong QB/WR connection, but spreads out the responsibility. The other places a lot more on the QBs plate, but spreads out the touches. I think Daboll installed the former to help develop Josh, KD kept it...Brady is a bigger believer in the 2nd one (which was also the NO philosophy). Part of the reason our offense felt better with Brady even if it didn't actually do better is because it was more decisive. However, we had really only installed basic formations and packages, so his menu was pretty limited. If you're attacking with formation and sequence, you needs lots of formation and plays.

Yeah, Im not sure I have seen something be so inspiring and heartbreaking at the same time...

Perhaps that is what Brady means when he says position-less...it also uses a lot of condensed and bunch formations, empty backfields, etc. In those scenarios, I know that there is technically a slot, but who it is is kind of a moot point.

We don't talk about it a lot, but before Joe Brady was at LSU he cut his teeth with Sean Payton in NO. I think we are seeing that play out. As for the separation...we've gone round and round so I won't belabor the point. But the whole thing is it isn't just the players that are changing.

Say what you will about this year’s receiving core, but one thing is for sure…they are ALOT different physically from previous groups Josh has had at his disposal. Looking back, our receiver group was almost comically stereotypical…Big X that only runs straight, do everything z that is your #1, shifty and reliable but smallish y, and a gadget guy. Don’t forget the special teamer who gets snaps and the emergency project guy too. There is a reason that is the classic setup…the physical skills compliment the role well in a traditional offense. The problem is, traditional offenses have become incredibly predictable in the modern NFL. You might be able to complete passes and even move the football if the guys are talented enough, but you’re gonna struggle with separation, YAC and scoring in the red zone. Sound familiar? This season, they turned over practically the whole room. Out of the projected top 6-7, only one guy is < 6’ and even he is close to 200 lbs. They’re all fast, or at the very least explosive and athletic. And none of them have been the guy before (which could be a problem, granted). In some ways, it feels more like the way a college team builds their roster, in that they just try and get the best athletes they can and worry about how to use them later. All of this makes for a group that is almost the antithesis of what we have had before, especially when you factor in the other skill spots. As a result, we are way less predictable this season. i get why that is scary, because that also means we as fans don’t know what to expect either, and it feels like everyone is unproven, including the OC. But there is one guy that is proven: Josh Allen. I have 100% faith that he will run the crap out of this offense and have his best season ever.

You're exhausting. JF was the QB for 10 games, and Andy Dalton was the QB for 6 in 2021. And Teddy Bridgewater was not good in 2020...I don't care how you try and spin it. Mooney put up 200 more yards on 43 more targets...in other words his YPT was way lower. Only had like 20 more scrimmage yards when you factor in carries.

Yeah, it surprised me...Harmon has different metrics on reception perception. It was an honest question on the ESPN analytics...just stumbled upon it today. If I had to guess, I think it is a man vs. zone thing. This one doesn't seem to distinguish.

Are we talking about the same Mooney? Dude is a stick. Flanker/slot. While we are talking about wr: https://espnanalytics.com/rtm Curious about thoughts on this...

How so? Fields>Brdigewater, plus Mooney needed 140 targets to get those yards. Curtis put up his numbers with a lot less targets (97). He was fighting with guys like DJ Moore and Robbie Chosen for targets (and CMC, but he got hurt early), while Mooney was up against the shadow of Allen Robinson and the TE room. In the two healthy seasons following their breakouts, Samuel put up considerably better numbers across the board with just as bad a QB and more WR competition. He was also drafted significantly higher and is much bigger. again, I think the contract is more about things like fit, Second contract vs third contract, etc. For example, Curtis Samuels contract with Washington was 3 years for 34 mil...He was either a top 10 paid receiver or close to it last season before all the wild deals But, and even though I don’t believe this…let’s call it a wash. Pitts and Kincaid cancel out and Samuel and Mooney cancel out. So it’s down to London and a bunch of scrubs vs. Coleman, Shakir, MVS, Hollins, Knox and whoever is 6. is that really a 12 spot difference?

I had a feeling contract was going to be your response...That is super situational and team/player dependent. If I had to guess, it probably comes down to age and injury history, but I am not sure. For the record, I also think Samuel is better than Gabe Davis (who got 13 AAV, too) But since you brought up Samuel...aside from contract, please tell me all about how Mooney is a better player. Im genuinely curious. The last two seasons, Samuel has had more targets, catches, yards, touchdowns. He is also 20lbs heavier AND faster AND has better hands.

Mooney the #1 on the Bills? That's a bold statement...gonna need you to qualify that one. By what measure? Im not sure he cracks the top 3 in Buffalo, and definitely not the top 2. Dude is a stick with questionable hands. Sure, he is fast and pretty good with the ball in his hands...but come on. As for TE, Id say #1 TE is a wash, but who's their #2? That guy from SF? Drake London is probably better than what the Bills have, barring Keon Breakout (funny thing is, Drake London is probably best case Keon comp), but after that and Pitts/Kincaid wash, the Bills run away with this one. Also, this is TE and WR (per the sharp list) so not sure what RB has to do with anything.

Ugh. You still haven't answered the actual question...Instead of arguing my points, please give me ANY reason that the Falcons WR/TE are better than the Bills. I looked at their roster. London, Mooney and Pitts. Smith and Hollins were their #2 TE and WR, respectively, in targets and yards and they are gone. Behind those 3 there is nothing of note (late round picks and UDFAs with almost 0 production). Mooney and Pitts had 1k seasons in 2021, but significantly less production since (QB related? Maybe) I am struggling to see how that roster is better than the Bills. The point about Hollins should be clear, because he is a direct comp. On the Falcons, he was their second most productive WR last year. They added Mooney and some late rookie draft picks/UDFAs. That same guy on the Bills may or may not get any run on this team, suggesting we have a deeper room. So, all that said...instead of arguing my post, try arguing the point...for once.

At the end of the day, I get why they are/were skeptical. Last years offense might not have been a great fit. No one guy had consistent production historically. The only thing I really ever had a problem understanding was the idea that they lacked talent. This years receiver group is considerably bigger, faster and more athletic than they have ever been with Josh at QB...by like a lot.

Here's the crazy thing...because of the skill set guys like Kincaid, Cook, and even Knox have...they might draw the CBs depending on where they motion to and iso a WR on a LB

That sure is a giant sized formation...Imagine the damage they could do in the red zone.

Dorsey and Daboll played more against coverage, not people. In theory, you have an answer for everything a defense does...so as a concept it is great. But defenses have gotten pretty good at disguising coverage, and if the WR needs to read it just like the QB, there is a better chance somebody messes up.