Zerovoltz
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11 hours ago, bourbonboy said:
I'm no contract wiz, and not that I think this is a good fit, but signing and restructure bonuses are KC's hit, correct? So the team that trades for him is only liable for salary and workout bonus, which would be "only" $15.5 mil in 2019 and $17.5 mil in 2020 (with no 2020 cap hit if we released him after one year)?
You are correct...I failed to subtract those out.
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Houston fits any system. He sets the edge very well....rushes the passer very well...and is above average in coverage...though you'd rather not have him doing that when he does other things better.
KC will release him if no trade partner can be found....and the whole thing is about the cap and contract....by releasing Houston, KC saves 14 million in cap space and takes a 7 million hit. Any team that would trade for Houston would be on the hook for his salary this year wich is high, at 21 million, but he has no more guaranteed money left on the deal...so lets say you as Buffalo make a deal.....you pay a high price now....wich you and your massive cap space, can absorb...and if he doesn't work out, you can cut with no cap hit next year...or you like him, and he costs you 21 mil in 19 and 19 mill in 2020. Good overall player...not just a pass rusher....has been injury prone but was mostly healthy finaly last year and he had a very strong season.
As a Chiefs fan...I'd love to keep him, but our roster construction and cap at this time doens't allow it.
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On 2/21/2019 at 9:21 PM, MJS said:
Anyone who thought Jackson should be drafted high in the 1st was on crack. He's got bust written all over him.
Harbaugh will scheme him to some wins, but he'll flame out. His biggest weakness is the most fundamental aspect of playing QB: staying in the pocket and making throws. It's the same reason why Tyrod won't ever be a franchise guy. Russell Wilson can do it and Cam Newton can do it. Their running ability enhances their play, but it doesn't define it.
If the best defense is to make you be a QB, you won't succeed at QB in the NFL.
Uh....ummm.....err.....hmmm.
29 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said:The media is saying that not the Cardinals. They aren't moving on from Rosen.
Murray going 1/1 to Arizona.
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On 2/19/2019 at 6:26 AM, TtownBillsFan said:
I'm the biggest Sooners fan in this place, and I'm telling you now, Kyler is at best 5'8". Yes, he's as fast as advertised, but that doesn't mean squat when you're not running the Sooners's spread.
I can't believe he is even serious about the NFL. He has to know it's something not meant for him. Especially when he already has the MLB fame. Just silly, IMO.
He's going 1/1 to Arizona....they will run the spread. He is going to be very good. He is the best QB in this draft.
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On 2/13/2019 at 1:07 AM, Zerovotlz said:
You have to look at this like a choice of Murray vs Rosen. If you think Murray is better, you take him. A team that moved on from a coach after one year, then hired Kliff Kingsbury isn’t going to worry about moving on from the 4th QBs off the board last year. They will have trade partners. NE SD NO will all make that call.
murray is the one major QB prospect in this draft. He will go 1/1 to Arizona
I continue to stand by this. Murray is the one guy in this draft that is the difference maker. You don't pass on a difference maker.
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There is more to consider than just this “effectiveness “ formula.
if it is 3rd and 7 for example, and Allen doesn’t see the RB open on the wheel route, pulls the ball down and runs for a gain of 5, that is NOT a positive football play.
On 1st and 10, play action, slot Wr is open down the seem. Qb doesn’t see it, throws to TE on out route for 6. That also isn’t optimal.
Alex Smith would do less than optimal things like this all the time. These plays look great in a stat sheet because they are positive plays when only accounting for raw numbers.
Aside from the completion pct issue (and it is an issue) Allen was not efficient at being optimal. He didn’t get the most out of a given play most of the time. These missed opportunities are what is hardest to see but also most often lead to stalled drives and 3s instead of 7s
Where Allen and the team need to get better (this includes passing accuracy) is getting the max value of a given snap more often.
not that anyone here cares about Mahomes but literally running only 9 more total plays on offense last year than the year before with Smith, Mahomes was twice as efficient.
Where it really shows is in the Red Zone when there is less field to defend.
Allen was 12/27 for 49 yards 4 TD an 1 INT.
Matt Barkley played in ONE game for you and he was 4/7 for 33 yards and 3 TD in the red zone.
Jimmy Garropolo only played in 3 games last year. He was 9/16 for 76 and 3 TD.
Allen has to be more efficient period. No sugarcoated cherry picked stats change that. And that’s fine.
lets see how he does with some roster upgrades and a year of off season work.
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You have to look at this like a choice of Murray vs Rosen. If you think Murray is better, you take him. A team that moved on from a coach after one year, then hired Kliff Kingsbury isn’t going to worry about moving on from the 4th QBs off the board last year. They will have trade partners. NE SD NO will all make that call.
murray is the one major QB prospect in this draft. He will go 1/1 to Arizona
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9 hours ago, Mat68 said:
As a number 2 he would be very effective. He is more a h-back than a guy you flex out. He is a reliable blocker. He is the opposite of Kelce. Clay doesn't threaten the defense vertically and doesnt make the above the rim type plays. The issue here is that he is paid as a top 10 to 15 te and he is not that guy. What Clay is owed, it's a real stretch envisioning a scenerio where he is retained on his current contract.
This is kind of what I am wondering about....KC has Kelce....KC doesn't have a good 2nd TE at all...in fact, there is a thread here about you guys asking about our FA TE Demetrrious Harris. (You don' want him.) ....I think, based on the overall responses here, I'd welcome Clay at the right price to be a 2. Thanks for all your input.
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It's no secret I'm a Chiefs fan.....KC will be in the TE2 market. I know from being around this board a while, Charles Clay has fallen out of favor here. Wondering what your evaluation of him is? I am curious if he'd be a good fit as our TE2 in KC....how is he as a blocker? route runner? etc? I know you all are pissed he didn't catch that dying duck Allen threw in Miami...but as objectively as you can...what and who is Charles Clay at this point in his career?
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....consider Mahomes was a coin toss away from singlehandedly dragging the NFL's worst defesne to a super bowl. .....Also bear in mind that against the same Belechick/Flores defesne that stymied the Rams....it stymied the Chiefs for a half....Mahomes figured it out and put up 31 points on that defense in the second half of the AFC title game. The Rams D that held the Pats to 13 points....Mahomes put up 50 on it. ....and it's not even the numbers....it's clear a few here just have haven't seen him play....he does things NO ONE does. They cut the 2017 NFL leading rusher midseason...and he didn't miss a beat. Many of you here see it....I'm not talking to you folks...just the holdouts who don't want to admit Mahomes is good.....or is the product of the system the McNabb, Vick, Alex Smith, Foles, etc...never put anywhere close to the same numbers in.....and it wasn't becasue they tried to bump Mahomes nubmers...KC ran 9 more total plays in 2018 than they did in 2017.....with the same weapons etc.....Mahomes was that much better.
Besides...it's not like you ended up with nothing....Tre White is very good and you have Josh Allen....I don't know what Allen will be yet, but he's exciting and he represents hope for the future....much better than if you had traded out, drafted Ruben Foster and then missed on QB's this passed draft. Nothing wrong with acknowledging that Mahomes is really good AND being excited for your own teams prospects.
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2 minutes ago, Warcodered said:
This doesn't really make much sense I mean if he does somehow lose I doubt it's by much and like you said it's not the most important thing especially to the degree difference there probably is. If he wins, what the people that complain about his accuracy will continue to complain about it...I'd bet they keep doing that contest or not only it would be confirmed he can throw it further which sounds like a net positive to me.
I've learned that you shouldn't use the word "Accuracy" when talking about Josh Allen. Accuracy doesn't apply. Use Acumen. Allen isn't inaccurate.....at least that's what i've read here.
I stand by what I said...if he wins..."wow, too bad he can't actually throw it to a target etc etc." ....and if he loses. "not only is Pat Mahomes better in every statistical category, he can also throw it farther than Allen too!" ....just let everyone wonder...Bills fans take some pride claiming to have the biggest arm QB in the NFL.....why do something that might change that?
Frankly...there are videos out there, easy to find, show Mahomes throwing 70+ yards in the air...including one where he does 60 from his knees...
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1. I'd love to see it.
2. This is a lose / lose for Allen. If he lost, then one of the few positive, tangible, claims Bills fans make "Allen can throw it further than anybody!" would no longer be valid......and if Allen did win, it likely wouldn't be by much, and it would only serve to further highlight the obvious issues with passing acuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuumen.
He'd be better off just leaving things alone and letting Bills fans believe he has the biggest arm ever.
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20 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:
Yeah, I’m rooting for chiefs too. I love Mahomes and feel like Reid doesn’t get the respect he deserves. And I think because they are always pretty good, KC gets lost in the shuffle as a team that has never won a SB.
We get so lost in the shuffle that no one remembers we won Super Bowl IV.
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22 minutes ago, Success said:
I didn’t think it possible, but already I’ve seen an even more elevated level of arrogance and condescension from Pats fans, both online and in person. I thought they had hit the apex.
Please Chiefs. America needs you.
We hear you America....we will answer the clarion call!
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On 1/13/2019 at 11:10 AM, Jerome007 said:
While I think I'm quite clear the OLine matters a LOT or I would not have started this thread, it's like for any other positions: all 32 teams are vying for top guys. They are not lined up in a shelf somewhere just ready to be signed. Some teams are already settled in that area, some have no cap space, etc. So in that sense the Bills are poised to get some, as Beane as publicly said it is the priority this offseason, and finally the Bills have cap space to play with. But for all his good intentions, it could happen that Beane doesn't sign much big names on the OLine nor draft anyone good. They have to be available and sign here instead of with another team! Hopefully, he can solve this issue as what a difference it would make!
I've said this in another thread but Laurent Duvernay-Tardif (RG) of the Chiefs could be available for a trade. He has missed close to 10 games with a broken leg. He could have played yesterday but he didn't. He's paid 8M per season and obviously his much cheaper replacement has been doing the job. He'd be much closer to home playing with the Bills and has so many side projects that it could matter.
For Bills fans interested in Morse, Tardiff etc.
KC has a good line when all are healthy or 4 of 5 it’s still good. We had a period toward the end of the year when we were without both starting guards and it was clear that we couldn’t scheme around TWO backups. Vs the Colts, we got Cam Erving back, and so that just left one backup starting. We are fine in that scenario.
What that hat means to the Bills -
1. Mitch Morse will be a free agent. He is a VERY GOOD center. He has had some health issues and missed some big chunks of time here and there. KC signed his backup to an extension a few weeks ago further indicating Morse won’t be around next year. Rieter, the backup, played well when Mitch was out. If you think he can stay healthy, you are getting a solid solid player.
2. LDT would be a trade candidate if we were in cap he’ll, but we aren’t. He is better than the backup. I wouldn’t suspect he’d be available in a trade.
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This isn't a guy you want. Bad hands. Doesn't help in the run game either. Has a knack for a spectacular catch 2 or 3 times a season..and its a big surprise every time it happens because he drops A LOT of routine stuff. Already been suspended for substance abuse once......this isn't a case of a talented guy being buried on the depth chart behind the leauges best TE....even though that is true....he'd be buried on a lot of other teams depth charts as well. He won't be missed in KC.
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On 1/11/2019 at 11:58 AM, Yav said:
Brady wasn't all that great in college and neither was Montana.
Looking back Leaf was great in college and flamed out in the NFL. Jeff George was a good college QB but never really a super star in the NFL, nice career but that was all.
Mahomes his rookie season didn't start, he couldn't beat out Alex Smith. Are you saying Smith should be considered an all time great? I'm guessing not. Mahomes had a good season throwing to probably the best TE in the NFL, the fastest WR in the NFL and for had arguably the best RB in the NFL for part of the season. Prescott had a great first year playing behind the best OL in football but the minute that line lost talent and the RB was hurt he looked less than stellar.
I'm not a fan of Mahomes, I've lived in KC and I've watched him play. Sure he put up some swell numbers and KC somehow won their division while being the second best team in that division. When the games mattered, Rams, Patriots, Chargers (at home with the division on the line) and Seattle, they lost. Take a look at that NE game and pay close attention to the last TD pass to Hill. Notice the ball was under thrown to a wide open Hill who just outran everyone on the field? Take some time and watch the kid throw and stop just looking at box scores. He's not all that accurate. Had Allen been throwing to competent pass catchers all season his numbers would have been better. Buffalo was one of the worst teams in dropped balls this season. Buffalo also had a horrible OL especially when you compare their line to KC.
Now add in that the Bills have a 20 year old MLB that might end up being one of the best LBs in the NFL and a CB that looks to be just as good if not better than Patrick Peterson (currently the best CB in the NFL). I can't see how this article could have been published. What team in the NFL would give up 3 players for 1 based on 1 season? Sorry but seems stupid.
I will not appoint Mahomes anything until he shows he can actually sustain success in the NFL for more than a year or two, and I would do the same with Allen. I'm not a fan of Mahomes and I was happy when Buffalo traded the pick, I just don't think the kids going to be able to maintain success in the NFL. KC is eventually going to have to pay people and when they can't afford all those play makers then what?
You just keep moving the goal posts further and further back....NOTHING you've had to say about Mahomes has been remotely close to accurate. Mahomes threw for 25 TD and 2700 yards to guys not named Hill, Kelce and Watkins this year. His numbers to just the other scrubs on the team would have ranked him in the top half of QB's for the year. He has done this with the Worst D in the NFL, and lost the support of a pro bowl RB who they had to "kick" off the team....KC's 4 losses were by a combined 21 points. Alex Smith had the same weapons, coaches and BETTER D than this and could barely must HALF Mahomes production. By the way...KC ran and threw at the same ratio they did last year...so this isn't about volume of attmepts etc....Mahomes is simply that much better and way more efficient....I don't often say this about anyone as all kinds of people have all kinds of opinions...but you sir...you do not know what you are talking about.
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Wow.....alot to talk about here.
15 hours ago, Mark80 said:Mahomes had a fantastic year, no doubt. The question is whether he will be able to maintain it when teams have a whole year of tape on him and their offense and then further down the road when he's making $30+M / year against the cap and they cannot surround him such a high level of talent that they have now. Time will tell.
The day will come when it's time to pay Mahomes....he is going to get a ton of money...and he'll be one of those guys that takes up a bunch of cap room....and he'll be worth it because he does make everyone around him better. I'd even speculate that QB salaries are about to flatten a little bit because teams are seeing that overpaying for mediocre QB's has been a mistake...so there is a little bit of dial back coming on these future contracts...plus...Mahomes isn't due for an extension before the 2020 labor agreement happens...who knows what that will look like.
15 hours ago, dollars 2 donuts said:Isn't it funny how the writer tries to make the word "undoubtedly" sound like a quote, instead of him just...writing.
I hope the best for Allen. Of course Mahommes is awesome, and he was one of the guys I wanted.
Additionally, though, looking at the last game of either young man's first season...I'll take Allen's 3 TD passes, and two rushing TDs over 284 yards and an interception.
Um....that 284 and 1 pick was in Mahomes very first start, wich was week 17 AT Denver...it was the only game he played in....and for some context..Mahomes played the first half, and a little of the 3rd quarter. got KC out to a 2 TD lead, then sat on the bench while Tyler Bray came in and threw a pick 6 to Denver, then fumbled and Denver tied the game with 3 minutes left. Mahomes came back in and led KC on the winning drive...part of that drive was a 3rd and 14 where Von Miller is all over him and he is running to his right full speed, and uncorks a strike accross his body as he is being tackled, for a 20 yard completion with 3 defenders all around....he put up 284, and the one pick in 3 quarters, in his first ever game, and led a 4th quarter game winning drive....context is important.
15 hours ago, billspro said:We won’t really know until next year. There is a chance Allen and Mahommes are the top two QBs in the league.
I really can't add anything to this...it just sums up half the posts in the thread perfectly though.
15 hours ago, oldmanfan said:True. Been a while since we've seen threads about how dumb it was to trade Ragland, hasn't it?
While you debate this Allen/Mahomes thing...I can tell you with the utmost certainty....Buffalo won this trade for sure. Ragland is SLOW.
12 hours ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:So why did 9 other FO’s pass on this once in a generational talent? If college TD’s is the sole measuring stick, then NFL draft order picks should be easy!
Great question.....I can explain it. Cleveland decided Myles Garrett was a can't miss no brainer safe pick at 1. San Francisco, probably thought they'd be in on Kirk Cousins the following offseason...and apparently Lynch wasn't into any of the QB available on top that..so traded to the Bears...who took Trubisky.....who they clearly thought was better, otherwise they would have taken Mahomes. The Jags, took Leonard Fournette at 4...they had Bortles, who they still believed in and had OLD SCHOOL Tom Coughlin calling the shots....at 5, the Titans already had Mariotta...and they took Corey Davis WR...trying to get him more weapons. At 6, the Jets took Jamaal Adams...you could argue that they needed a QB...but they had just spent a high 2 on Christian Hackenburg in the 2016 Draft...and wanted to see that through (clearly a mistake) At 7 The Chargers, who already had Rivers...took WR Mike Williams...at 8 Carolina who already had Newton, took McCaffrey. at 9, the Bengals...who already had Dalton...took WR John Ross (I am sure they'd like a doever as well) ...so in many of these cases...you can say that they all "Passed" on a QB..but most of them were set at QB and were trying to add parts....KC had some good fortune that the top 9 were many teams not looking at QB. And then Buffalo at 10...you've all covered it...lame duck GM....new defensive coach...wasn't going to tie his career to a QB picked by an outgoing GM...and wasn't taking one he hadn't evaluated with his new GM. So, hence the trade.
8 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:...of course if he "slips" from 50 TD passes to 40 in 2019, we'll be hearing the "slump" clickbait, right?......
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LOL....50 TD in season has been done THREE TIMES...Brady, Manning and Mahomes.....he is bound to slump....just like Manning and Brady "Slumped" after 50.
Last item I will leave you with.....KC rushed for 115.8 Yards per game with Hunt. KC has rushed for 116.4 without him.....really good back...but its CLEAR that the QB matters...not the RB....also....if you take away all the TD and Yards Mahomes threw to Hill, Kelce, and Watkins...Mahomes still had 25 TD and 2700 yards. To everyone else on the roster....think about that.....25 TD's would tie for 11th just on their own.
I like watching Allen, I hope he gets better with a year of seasoning and some upgrades and I think he will ...but wow....
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On 1/9/2019 at 3:16 AM, Zerovotlz said:
.....Save this post.....because it will need to be displayed right next to my Mahomes predictions here.....
The Cardinals made this hire because they are going to draft Haskins.
The way to look at this for Arizona isn't that they have a QB and can trade the 1/1 in the draft....(of course they COULD) but instead....look at like a chance to choose between Rosen or Haskins. Arizona absolutely has that choice right now.
If you hire Kingsbury, who is going to install a spread, air it out type offense...you want HASKINS running that, not Rosen.
The Arizona front office, by firing Wilks after only one season, has already shown they aren't afraid to move on from a mistake after 1 year and get someone they think is better.
Haskins is better than Rosen.
Arizona will keep that pick, draft Haskins, and trade Rosen to the highest bidder. I predict that bidder will be the Saints, who will probably be able to pick up Rosen for a 4th round pick...get a first round talent into their system to be the heir to Brees and fix their succession problem with a player who is still talented, on a rookie deal, that only costs a 3 or a 4 to kick the tires on?
As for as Kingsbury as a HC...he has HC experience tyring to win in Lubbock, TX. He's proven he knows how to look at QB's and got them out to that ****hole to play college football. He knows offense..the leauge is clearly trending offense....this is about offense...Kliff will hire an experienced D coordinator...again, the man understand how to lead, delegate etc.....
I came to this conclusion before anyone else was considering it. I stand by it, including the Haskins part instead of Murray.
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2 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:
not happening.
they arent moving on from Rosen after one year. Remember how bad Goff was , they are hoping Cliff can do the same with Rosen.
If they didn't have the choice of Rosen or Haskins, then of course...but if you believe the better QB is right there to take, you take him.
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21 hours ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:
With a handful of notable QBs likely to, or expected to, leave their team, I'm curious in opinions or thoughts on where they may end up. Considering the lack of expected potential via draft at the position, I could see teams more willing to look to free agency for a signal caller. Here are my guesses:
Flacco: Jacksonville
Tannehill: Jets (as McCown retires...becomes the veteran backup)
Tyrod: Houston (backs up Watson)
Manning: (stays in NY)
Bridgewater: Miami
21 hours ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:My scenario leaves the Giants with a glaring need atvQB, where they could trade for Nick Mullens or select the highest ranked QB in the draft.
The other interesting scenario is Foles/Wentz in Phili, but ill let that play out to make a guess as to what happens.
Lmk if I'm missing anyone
Rosen: New Orleans....traded after Arizona drafts Haskins.
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.....Save this post.....because it will need to be displayed right next to my Mahomes predictions here.....
The Cardinals made this hire because they are going to draft Haskins.
The way to look at this for Arizona isn't that they have a QB and can trade the 1/1 in the draft....(of course they COULD) but instead....look at like a chance to choose between Rosen or Haskins. Arizona absolutely has that choice right now.
If you hire Kingsbury, who is going to install a spread, air it out type offense...you want HASKINS running that, not Rosen.
The Arizona front office, by firing Wilks after only one season, has already shown they aren't afraid to move on from a mistake after 1 year and get someone they think is better.
Haskins is better than Rosen.
Arizona will keep that pick, draft Haskins, and trade Rosen to the highest bidder. I predict that bidder will be the Saints, who will probably be able to pick up Rosen for a 4th round pick...get a first round talent into their system to be the heir to Brees and fix their succession problem with a player who is still talented, on a rookie deal, that only costs a 3 or a 4 to kick the tires on?
As for as Kingsbury as a HC...he has HC experience tyring to win in Lubbock, TX. He's proven he knows how to look at QB's and got them out to that ****hole to play college football. He knows offense..the leauge is clearly trending offense....this is about offense...Kliff will hire an experienced D coordinator...again, the man understand how to lead, delegate etc.....
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KC not going down. I hope New England beats the Chargers.....New England, for all their history of greatness...never play well at Arrowhead...some of Bradys worst games have been in KC....and that's is the most favorable matchup for the Chiefs...chargers present more problems for us than NE does. Besides...it would make a great story for KC to rip the mantle from Brady and the Pats...kind of a passing of the torch moment.
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13 hours ago, matter2003 said:
So has your opinion changed on Josh Allen from the draft to now?
A little bit.
I thought Allen would struggle with completion PCT....and he still has. I, like many here, underestimated his athletic ability. I have been impressed with his ability to run...didn't see anwhere near the production on the ground that he produced.
I thought he would be a bust...(and I still generally think that his passing efficiency needs to be much better. ..I didn't say comp %....passing efficiency.) BUT....Allen impressed me enough to believe he COULD take a step or two if given some better talent around him. He's certainly exciting, and I am looking forward to seeing if this offseason and and what should be an improved roster, produces results that show more improvement.
So, yes...Allen has impressed me. I'm rooting for him. Looking forward to seeing what happens next.
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Cardinals tweet their support of Right Josh
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
I was right on Feb 13. I am still right.