HoofHearted
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Posts posted by HoofHearted
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2 minutes ago, NewEra said:
They’re in position but never turn around. Dane especially. He turned once in the 4th qtr and forced an incompletion.
to their credit, the browns made some nice catches (and drops) and Brissett some nice throws.
His issue is at the collision point. He’s not a man corner - neither is Benford - their hips aren’t as fluid as the receivers they’ve been lining up across from and their getting beat at the collision point and then having the play their trail technique which is why they are trying to play through receivers hands and not turning around.
Jefferson and Cooper were both doing a really outstanding job of flashing hands as late as they possibly could so that our punch throughs were late. Really good WR play.
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2 minutes ago, Einstein said:
Dodson is not it.
Yeah… he’s an old school Mike. He can hold up in the run game but just looks awful in space.
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34 minutes ago, kkim0904 said:
DBs giving too many big plays.
Played a ton of 3 today to get an extra body down in the box. Corners were on an island the majority of the game. Frazier sold out to stop the run.
Unrelated - if we aren’t going to be able to afford to keep Edmunds I hope we have a good replacement plan. Dodson is too un-athletic to hold up there with what we ask out of the position.
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Only time I saw him get visibly frustrated was when the Bills ran a Smash concept early on when the offense was sputtering and Josh threw the low route to Knox even though Diggs was wide open on the corner.
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It'll all come down to tackling. Fits have been mostly good. Tackling from these backup defensive players has been mostly atrocious, and a lot of it comes down to taking bad angles.
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If there's any season ticket holder that isn't planning on using their code I'll gladly use it for you. 😀
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On 11/14/2022 at 10:44 AM, Einstein said:
I don’t blame the interception on McDermott. I do however blame the fumble on the coaching staff. Allen should have NEVER been put under center at the goal line.
The interior o-line was getting blown up the entire 4th quarter. Over and over and over again.
He thought it was smart, knowing that the interior line can’t get ANY push, to try a QB sneak? At the goal one?
Before the play I turned to my Dad and said “they have to put him in shotgun”. It was obvious.
It was also obvious to double cover Jefferson and they didn’t. Benford and others did a good job in single coverage but Jefferson is too good. You NEED two guys on him.
It was coaching failure after coaching failure.
We played 2 man almost the entire game - he was doubled.
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13 hours ago, Buffalo Junction said:
Respectfully disagree. You’re absolutely correct for the route concept we ran…. However, with a wheel route or motioned RB the LBer is only fully responsible for the first half of the route. Petersons responsibility would have been to break off and help over the top, especially if the LBer can’t carry the route. If Peterson makes the same assumption as he did and that LB isn’t fast enough the RB’s wheel route is open for an end zone shot. It’s why the CB is supposed to play that post on the outside hip of the WR instead of undercutting the route. Regardless, due to how Peterson played that route concept Allen should have either thrown to Singletary, thrown a high ball to Davis that would have gone out of bounds if missed, run it, or put it in the dirt. Peterson simply knew he didn’t have to worry about anyone threatening that zone unless the play turned into a scramble drill.
They're playing "Palms" which is a pattern match Quarters coverage also known as 2-Read. Both Corner and Safety are keying the #2 receiver. The corner is aligned outside leverage of #1 because the coverage can turn into a Cover 2 look depending on the route combination they get. If the #2 receiver were to break out the corner would drive the out and pass off the #1 receiver to the Safety. The corner needs to be outside leverage of this in order to force the #1 receiver to inside release him to give the Safety more time to work over the top of #1. In the Double Post scenario we gave them both #2 and #1 were vertical. Once the #2 and #1 receivers get past linebacker depth it turns into Cover 0 for the Safety and Corner with the ability to still trade off the route if they run some type of deep Scissors concept. In the case of the Double Post - as soon as the corner sees the inbreak of the #2 receiver he now knows he has true man coverage on the #1 receiver and can begin to push to inside leverage of the #1 to take away the Post.
Linebackers are relate to #2 players in Palms. Once they get their pass read they will drop to the curl window and work to the inside hip of the #2 receiver. His rules are to wall any seam or inbreaking route by #2 and force it outside and over the top in order to push it to the Safety. Once #2 has released vertically he can settle and look for anything else coming out and potentially trying to cross his face. If anything crosses his face he has it man to man. So a swing by the back would widen the outside linebacker to the flat. If the back were to wheel it up the sideline the linebacker would carry the wheel of the back.
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Just now, Victory Formation said:
It’s the truth. Offenses are what win games in this league. McD is a good coach, but his expertise is on defense. I want a HC whose expertise is on offense to get the most out of Allen.
I'm asking why you think there's drop off in expertise of offensive knowledge.
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1 minute ago, Victory Formation said:
Even so, there will be a drop off in expertise as far as knowledge on offense is concerned. Especially if you’re comparing McD to Reid or McD to McVay. He will never be in that class.
The Bills could hire just about anyone to come coach here. Why not find the next McVay? I mean, literally the brightest minds would be salivating to come here. Why go with the DC whose teams fall apart in big moments? Allen is our best player, bar none, get a QB whisperer to come here to help him realize his true potential. At that point we have permanent stability on offense.
Why do you say this?
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3 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:
Do you really think that McD knows offenses well? I love the Bills as much as you do, but don’t expect me to like everything about them like some sweaty Bills Mafia meatball.
Yes. You cannot be a successful defensive coordinator if you don't understand what offenses are doing and what the rules are within the schemes they are attacking you with.
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2 minutes ago, HappyDays said:
We've had this issue since Daboll was the OC. Too many times Allen and his intended target are not on the same page. I've wondered if maybe we have the wrong players for the system we run? It requires cerebral WRs. That's why Julian Edelman was a star in the system, not because of his abilities but because he knew the system so well and played off of Brady to perfection. Guys like Davis and Knox don't strike me as cerebral pass catchers, they are physical freaks. Ideally you'd want them winning with their athleticism and not thinking too much. Diggs fits the system well, I think Shakir could too with some seasoning, but I'm not sure about the other guys.
If Gronk can determine the difference between man or zone on the fly then anyone can 😆
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5 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:
McD doesn’t coach defenses as good as Bellyacher does, nor should you assume that Belichick knows nothing of offenses.
This notion that defensive coaches know nothing about offense baffles me... how can you defend something you know nothing about?
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41 minutes ago, Einstein said:
The idea is to use the player and his talents and abilities quickly, but not in every situation until he learns the offense.
Hines would not need to be relied on for 60 plays a game. You wouldn’t need to limit your play calling for every play.
How about 15 though? Minnesota is making it work.
Yeah, it's a little different with Tight Ends in the pass game than RBs because of protections. You can free release a Tight End whenever you want and still be sound in protections. The box count and the post-snap pressure reads can dictate whether or not backs can release or not which takes time to learn/develop when there's probably 6-7 different types of protections that we run. Additionally, as I described in my post to Scott the EP verbiage system relies heavily on memorization of concepts and understanding where you fit into the concept based on your pre-snap alignment (and how those responsibilities can change based on motions/shifts). In every other system the call will tell each player what his responsibility is.
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31 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:
I know we got into it before and sinceraly I appologize for that. The medication that I take sometimes makes me not myself so I am sorry about that. I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on our offense. To me it seems like defenses have figured out our concepts as a lot of plays I have been able to look at our guys have pretty sticky coverage. It also doesnt seem that Dorsey likes to use TE's or pass catching backs very much even though it was a focal point of the off season. Is this because he isnt using them or more so because our O line is so bad they use them to block more often than they should need to be? 2 of our fastest guys are sitting on the bench. Is our O really that complex?
We're getting guys open - wide open at times. I think it's more so growing pains than anything else at this point. We're relying on some younger guys to produce for us offensively and we're incorporating some new concepts here and there as well which I think has some of our guys thinking at times. I think Josh did a really good job early on of taking what the defense gave him and he's gotten more and more away from that as the season has progressed, and I think when the offense is sputtering he tries to make something big happen to get it going again rather than just take the easy completions at times. I also don't think he trusts his OL to hold up in pass protection. He's rarely stepping back up into the pocket these past however many weeks which is forcing scramble drill situations. We're also seeing a lot more two man than I can remember us seeing in the past which has played into some of this as well.
I don't think Dorsey doesn't want to incorporate tight ends or backs, but he is using them to chip quite a bit which ultimately just makes those guys safety valves to the flats or the hook depending on the protection. There has been a very clear desire to try and incorporate backs in the redzone by singling them up with a linebacker, but with all the zone coverage we're seeing down there they aren't getting the matchups they want.
Every NFL offense is complex. There's multiple protections, multiple blocking schemes each with their own set of rules for different fronts that you could potentially see, and then all the choice routes that are incorporated into this offenses passing schemes. The EP system gets complex with verbiage because everything isn't spelled out for everyone. Concepts are given names so you have to understand what your responsibility is in that concept whereas in other system they call tells each individual player what their responsibility is on the play. Additionally these concepts carry over through formations - so for example you could have the same concept run out of a 3x1 set or a 2x2 set. So if we take a simple flood concept and run it out of 3x1 the #1 has a Go, #2 has an out, and #3 has an arrow. Call the same concept out of 2x2 and #1 & #2 has the same concept, but now the RB has the arrow. So it's a lot of understanding your alignment within formations as well.
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2 hours ago, Buffalo Junction said:
If the RB runs a wheel route or motions outside on that OT INT then Peterson is forced to stay in his zone. Instead it’s a chip and release, Peterson can roam, Allen has to hold the ball, and Davis has to make a choice of whether or not to flatten his route… All the complexity happens post snap because the defense didn’t have to think pre-snap.
This isn't true. Quarters rules have the LB play the wheel of #3. Peterson would have been in the exact same spot regardless of what Singletary did.
16 minutes ago, Einstein said:They said during the broadcast that when Hockensen was traded to Minnesota, they put him right in whether he knew the plays or not. They would tell him in the huddle “run to the 30 and turn right”. It’s worked.
That's all well and good, but limits you as a play caller. All the choice concepts we have would have to be thrown out the window for instance. RB is a tough spot if they aren't familiar with the offense. You have to learn run schemes and your keys in those, the pass schemes and the option routes incorporated with those, as well as all the protections on top of all the new verbiage. It's a lot of information that has to be known and digested so that these guys can make decisions in a split second.
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6 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:
I can see it - defense disguised their coverage a bit and had Allen fooled. A junky 2nd down play. Just a messy 3 play sequence, Allen has to be better. Dorsey can't burn a play on a weird PA screen either. There's gotta be a balance between, allen needs the ball he's our best guy - and we need the ball out quick or run it because of how the opposition is playing us.
Junky because the defensive end sniffed it out and it didn't work, but the concept was good. 2nd and 2 and you show Trap (which is what Singletary had the big run on earlier) with the blocking scheme to pull the inside backer away from the screen. If their end is lined up in anything other than a 9 tech it's likely an easy completion for a first down because of the misdirection. For those talking about lack of creativity this play contradicts that notion.
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16 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:
And he flushed himself right which gave him exactly 1 target. Correct on the mesh call - i dont like how everyone ends up in the end zone though.
Was forced to flush right because of the pressure. You flush to the side contain was lost on. The balls at the 6. Aren't many routes in the route tree under 6 yards. 🤷♂️
EDIT: Davis is setting up the rub. They're anticipating man down here to set the pick so Diggs can be wide open, once he recognizes it's not man he continues to work his shallow.
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28 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:
I'm not sitting down one of the few weapons that has worked inside 10 yards (4 of 11 TDs). It was a terrible playcall on 4th and 2. No Mesh, no rub routes, no stick route. The play was literally designed for allen to run around instead of just getting the ball out quick which is what teams normally want to do in the RZ.
Well that's not true at all. It was a called mesh concept (which by designs incorporates a rub) and also featured a stick/spot concept with Knox.
EDIT: Read was Rail > Spot > Shallow. Vikings played zone and everything was thrown off because of pressure and receivers not finding the soft spots in the zone.
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We're seeing a lot more zone in the Low RZ this year than we have in the past. Dorsey is trying to take advantage of this with the follow concepts, but the spacing has been horrible and the route running has been lazy by the collector (the receiver running the clear) on those concepts. It's also concerning seeing us run a bunch of mesh/shallow concepts and our receivers not recognizing zone vs man. If man they need to continue running the route across the field and run away from the defender in coverage. If zone they need to recognize the soft spots and settle. This is day 1 stuff when these types of concepts are taught. We're so used to getting a ton of mileage out of Beasley on these types of routes, but there's been many times this year where our receivers will continue to work across the field vs zone and essentially run themselves into being covered. Even on our spot concepts I've seen Knox multiple times work to a specific spot on the field and then just sit there even though he's got a backer sitting directly underneath him instead of pushing to the soft spot in the zone.
Imo the concepts themselves aren't the issue - or when they're being called - you can see these same concepts being run by every other team in the league every week. They just need to be cleaned up. The spacing, the understanding of rules for man vs. zone, and then the protections to go along with them. It just feels like there's always a misstep by one crucial player every time we get down there.
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Just now, BullBuchanan said:
Not on that route. Look at the play. In order to hit Davis on target Josh need to throw at exactly when the video is at 0:03. He needs to float the ball over the LB but with enough velocity that it doesn't get picked by the safety int he middle of the field and low enough that Davis can make a play on it. It's a near impossible throw. I can't screenshot it because of the website size limitations, but the window is minuscule between #22 & #7 .
Oh, I meant schematically. Double Post is a Quarters beater. You made a comment in your post that the defense the Vikings called was perfect to stop the play (or something along those lines). They defended it well and Allen should have 100% checked it down.
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11 minutes ago, Big Turk said:
That's the Mike Mularkey fake QB sneak play
😲 I've exposed my true identity!
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14 minutes ago, Big Turk said:
Why? It's effective and it works. I am sure there will be a wrinkle in there to throw out of it as well at some point once teams over commit to stopping it.
Old school Toss Sweep - Dorsey can thank me later.
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10 minutes ago, ArtVandalay said:
Sorry, didn't know that was the only other option. You're right, let's tell the other team when we are going to snap the ball on a sneak, because our only other option is a shotgun run for -2.
Thanks for the levity.
Man, you're a ball of fun with everyone I see. 😆
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The ease of 3rd & long against the Bills
in The Stadium Wall
Posted
They did double Jefferson - like the whole game. We sat in 2-man more than I’ve ever seen us before.