corta765

1000% agree on Marv with this. Back in those times many coaches believed players were players and they would do what’s needed. The more detail focused coached may have had an edge just simply for doing a bit more. The flip side is that group of Bills had a lottt of pride and ego. They weren’t necessarily a group that wanted to be told what to do as much as direction of where to go and how to maximize it. Marv excelled here as the SB runs showed despite falling three prior times. But he may have had a better fate over time to just have been a little more hands on.

Haha well I think certain guys transcend eras. Allen's size and skillset and attitude most importantly he would've been fine. Same with Bruce or as I mentioned Aaron Donald. Troy Aikman might actually be better now where he gets less hits and can just throw the ball as he was very accurate. But I don't disagree Josh would've altered his play a little otherwise he would die haha. It's funny the older I have gotten the less losses bother me at least at this point (SB loss live could be different) and I have become more objective that basically outside of an truly awful call/non call like the Rams Saints NFC title your team either earns it or doesn't and that is it. Even the KC loss I could probably watch back right now objectively and my thoughts would be relatively similar that Allen was a god and the defense/coaching staff blew it, but what a game.

Free agency didn't take fold until I believe 93. Outside of trading for players you really just had the draft to build teams or free agent guys who were cut. When free agency came Buffalo was over the cap so even if they wanted a big run stuffer or to add size they really didn't have the ability without shedding talent and they tried to keep it together as long as possible. Watching it back the offense played not to lose, the defense played pretty much the same and did all they could to keep the Bills in the game which they basically did until the INT 4th quarter. You could see Dallas offense was better then the Bills defense, but kinda like the current Rams who have some stars that float the rest up Talley, Bennett, and Bruce were able to make enough plays to not let Dallas make a ton of ground. Of the 4 SB's this is the only one I would say one unit of the Bills probably deserved a better fate. Considering the defense was a middling unit that was use to playing from a lead not behind, they held Dallas to 13 pts until early/mid 4th quarter due to another Buffalo turnover. Not sure what else you could ask as they weren't the 85 Bears on that side either.

Even if JJ didn't see it wouldn't have taken long to figure it out lol. Watching the tape back in a prism my greatest frustration was the coaching/offensive gameplan. Very vanilla and not very creative. Honestly even if Thurman didn't fumble I think Buffalo's offense would've got slowed down a bunch just because it wasn't very diversified compared to what Dallas was throwing against them. He also is bigger then most defensive players and back then may have been one of the fastest players in the league. It's why you can't compare era's, watching the game back it is much slower in comparison to right now. Not meant as criticism players have evolved and train to such a high level its wild what they physically can do. By comparison Kenny Davis was running a gas station summer of 93 lol.

No one would argue that. Josh is more talented then Jim skill set wise. Like I said watching the talent difference between then and now is wild.

Yep I mentioned that up above that it felt like momentum wise you could feel even then Dallas took a breath of relief down just 7. It reallyyy was a bad call to not attack there and push Dallas on their heals out of half up 17-6. The offense in general played a ball control style as their only TD drive was 17 plays and 7:56 mins which helped the D. The second half Buffalo had a few drives they moved the ball and failed to convert with playing calling seemingly limiting what they chose to do.

Inspired by the thread on "Why Was Thurman So Bad In The Last 3 SBs" I made the brave slightly illogical decision of watching the Bills final SB loss. This truly was a game of two halves. Here are my thoughts on not only the game but how the sport itself has changed which was cool in many ways in sad in one: -Lead up for the game had pageantry but man does the NFL do it to the max now. I actually miss the player introductions and coming out of the inflatable helmets it was a really cool thing. -Having no graphics on the screen outside of the play clock counting down was actually really nice. I would like to see that as an option in the future because it was much easier and less distracting to watch the game that way. -OJ is here! (murders happened a few months later) -They are really excited about the new Falcons stadium.... which is now gone haha. -Dallas 100% was more athletic then the Bills defense and you could see that. But I have to give the Bills credit the D came to play that game -Michael Irvin was a freak and made some big catches to move the sticks where he out muscled guys -The Bills defense despite getting pushed down to the redzone twice early on did a great job holding Dallas to a FGs to keep it 6-0. Overall the Bills defense actually kept Buffalo in this game and didn't deserve to lose. The Cowboys scored 13 pts off turnover in which Dallas started in Buffalo territory or in the Thomas fumble was a TD return. Despite Dallas getting the go ahead TD to go up 20-13 Buffalo's defense actually stood in there until Kelly's INT early in the 4th. At that point you can see they finally were worn down and Dallas offensive line was finally being able to enforce their will. I think had Buffalo got it tied 20-20 the defense probably could've made it through the 4th as you could see they were waiting for some pick me up by the offense as they kept Dallas back. -With that said Buffalo's strength 100% was their front 7, the secondary let some pretty big pass plays go through. The fact they hung in the way they did is a credit to the effort of the D and coaching -With that said the game did change on the fumble to tie but it was not the way I expected. It 100% fired Dallas up but like I said the defense after allowing the TD to Dallas to go up 20-13 hung in there. The offense just gave up in a sense. Thurman was beyond despondent and I am surprised a teammate didn't punch him for how bad his attitude was. The Bills also did not finish drives. The fact they didn't attempt a TD at the end of the 1st half and just played for the FG was mind blowing. In general the first half felt like each team trading punches and the Bills landed a few that had Dallas back. Yes the game momentum 100% turned on the fumble, but I would argue it actually started with the Bills not getting a TD to go up 17-6. You could feel Dallas walking into half that they dodged a possible knockdown punch there. -If I had watched that game live I would've thrown my TV remote in anger with the play calling in the 2nd half and in general. The 1st half the offense had tempo, but they played a very vanilla ten yards or less attack style for the most part. Kelly missed Beebe on a deep bomb and that was the only major deep pass that stuck with me. Buffalo's inability to test Dallas on mid range to long range passes certainly caught them in the 2nd half. The kept trying this stupid shovel pass which Thurman got maybe 2-3 yards each time. The best plays Buffalo had were either screen passes or slant routes that negated some of Dallas speed. The coaching staff never adjusted for the fact Dallas kept eating up misdirection plays like crazy. -Please appreciate in general the level of passing we see today and the skill associated. Aikman had quite a few well thrown balls as did Jim, but in todays NFL they probably each would've been picked 2-3 times. The skill of the league and speed is just so much more noticeable now with how the game is played it is impressive to see the evolution. -With that point both teams for being the peak of the league offensively in the early 90s really liked to run the ball right into the middle for 3-4 yards. It is 100% in the NFL's best interest it is a passing league now because it is more entertaining. -Watching Bruce Smith manhandle guys made me think of Aaron Donald. The pure power and strength of both players is insane and Bruce 100% could play today and I do not doubt he would eat players all day. -I am happy the NFL did adjust their headshot rules because there 100% are guys with CTE with how the game was played. I like hitting and I do not like the penalties on QBs now, watching the game Kelly and Aikman took hits that were perfectly fine but would be penalties today. That stinks and I wish we moved back a bit on, but the headshot stuff is 100% for the best to be gone. -Don Beebe deserved the SB ring he got with GB for his effort in his time in BUF. The dude fought all game and his play stuck out as one of the few offensive players that actually did something and kept fighting to the end. -On the flipside Marv Levy had the personality of a rock on the sideline. Especially in the 2nd half as the offense saw the floor collapse under them he realllyyyy needed to get some energy going. Has anyone ever said if he even talked to Thurman who on the sideline was borderline on suicide watch after the fumble? -Jim Kelly actually had a solid 1st half. He picked apart Dallas pretty well and had them off balance which negated their speed. Once Dallas got up and Thurman removed himself from the game Dallas pinned their ears back and attacked. If you have seen the movie The Replacements with Keanu Reaves he speaks about when things start going wrong its like quicksand. Watching Kelly in the second half I would apply that quote to his play. You can see he starts pressing rather then taking what he is given, but you can understand it after 3 SB losses and the position they are in. My greatest criticism for the coaching staff was not reeling him in a little and going off script with the game plan for some easy yardage plays like screens or quick passing plays. You watch and see he is trying so hard to make a play to keep the Bills in it but it isn't there. The INT in the 4th quarter that iced the game was 100% this in a nutshell. -Emmitt Smiths greatest thing in this game was evading/breaking tackles which allowed him at the end of the game to finish Buffalo off. You could see the Bills didn't have the energy on D by the 4th and he was able to shake them with ease. -The biggest sad change for me from the NFL is the crowd at the SB. When Buffalo scored the shout song is playing and it is a very loud audible crowd of Bills fans singing. When Dallas made their good plays or scored their fans were 100% into it. You do not get that anymore as it has become a rich corporate affair. It really stuck out to me that regular fans were in attendance and you could 100% hear and feel them. This is 100% a loss for the NFL and the fans of their teams. -Final remark watching it back as a fan of the Bills was frustrating as you could see it was a game they 100% were in if not actually had control of for a while. It is a shame the offense never got out of its way in the 2nd half as they had their shot. With that said it was really cool to see though our guys in the big game and everything that went with it. Time has benefited the Bills of those days well with how they are now remember because they were a great team and deserve to be remembered so. On to 2022 and the Josh Allen SB train!

This is a pretty bad failure between the website and to prioritize to season ticket holders. Training camp is one of the very very few opportunities if any a family can take their kids to actually see the bills. It should've been done with local businesses as in the past or a better process online to handle it.

It is not a season. I would like the Bills to win a SB so I can be there with my dad and wife together to celebrate. My father has loved the Bills like crazy and it has always been a thing together. His mother/my grandma was a huge Bills fan and I have great memories of us watching games together win/loss. My mother's parents also were huge Bills fans. I have said that when the Bills win I am going to graves of each with shot glasses to do one with them to celebrate with them. I have told people forever I was born a Sabres fan but married the Bills and that's the truth. I was always a massive Bills fan, but I grew up going to more Sabres games and played hockey. As I entered college and met my wife it didn't as much switch as my fandom for the Bills took over tenfold because it was such a shared love between us. For as bad as many of the drought years were, we have had a blast together from 2009 to today through the years regardless of wins or losses. So yea its not avenging much as it is just to get that moment. My father is 66 and thankfully in great health but time is what time is and he use to joke just one before the bell rings and now it is slightly more real. So yea please win this year Bills haha

That was my thinking. Minnesotas new coach comes from McVay who maximizes offensive talent unlike Zimmer who didn't have a clear plan. I think GB is weaker across the board as they lost some guys and D also plus their schedule is nasty. Still think GB is a playoff team and SB threat, but MIN I can see rising to meet them. Granted you could say that about MIN the last decade sooo ..... lol.

I got Minnesota. I think GB makes WC, but I am not bullish on their offense with Adams gone and there are advanced stats that said their defense is a bit of a paper tiger. Conversely I think Minnesota's offense is far deeper and their new coach will maximize the talent and players they have. Also GB's schedule is a straight up bear. Lions maybe push for WC spot if things fall together ok. Bears its a preference thing and I think they are a year away still from competing although Fields will do better having a coach who isn't trying to kill him. I still think they have the worst pass catching crew in the NFL and that is with Mooney being a decent WR.

At least with these two hires they were considered prototypical or with the times on what to do. Donahoe especially was considered a good move at the time as PIT had been quite good and the Bills needed a true Czar. Whaley was what many teams did promoting a good scout with a decent reputation. Donahoe and Whaley kinda flamed out but their teams had talent and they were just misses in terms of outcome. The middle three are the true errors as they were over their heads from day 1 and I fully blame for the worst of the drought. It should also be said that the Donahoe experience soured Ralph on outside hires basically the rest of his time which to me caused the worst elements of the drought as no one objective was around to say "we shouldn't be doing this". Even Buddy Nix had ties to the Bills going back to his scouting days.

I watched it back in 2020 during the shutdown when ESPN had it on. I knew what was coming and even so I was still in a stunned state on how they managed to give a game away they had won ten times over in such an epic fashion.

Doesn't work that way though saying "we weren't really a playoff team" because they were. The 2017 Bills were the worst of the teams from 2014-2017 that all had roster that easily could've made the playoffs talent wise even with limitations at QB. IMO the 2015 Bills were the most talented squad we had since 99 until the 2020 team rolled into the picture. Rex single handedly wrecked what was an 11-5 team and using the lens you had I would say that was a playoff team. The beauty of sports in general is sometimes the impossible or incase of the 2017 Bills unlikely does happen and you get a fun ride out of it. I will agree with you that even though the drought ended in 2017, to me the true end of the Bills being the bad Bills that the drought gave us was 2019. They did that on their own with a QB they drafted and roster they built not one they inherited like in 17. 2017 was the reward of so many years of bad breaks and luck to finally just be back in the dance and have fun. 2019 was the validation of being a competent org that did things properly and truly taking that big step into being a relevant good team.

Agreed. Truthfully had he been 10 years earlier as a coach he probably makes the playoffs a bit. Football when he coached the Bills was literally changing to an open passing attack style and the best teams took advantage of this. Instead Jauron tried playing a ball control running esq style with minimal passing and everything else you said. With football evolving though it had a lower ceiling compared to the prior decades for success.

IDK if there was a worse time to have seasons between awful losses and just the team not being remotely competitive. At least you got the Pats and Raiders wins in 2011 to see

I think it was Prescott Rossi's down and drought series that said the drought truly took form with Jauron and I couldn't agree more. It started the trends of "in the hunt", "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory", and under Jauron we got to witness some of most soul crushing losses in team history: 07 Pats 56-10 07 Cowboys MNF 08 Browns Wide Right 08 49ers loss (look at the stats in this one on how bad we outgained SF, ooo boy) 09 Pats McKelvin 09 Browns 6-3 I mean those are 6 games in a 3 year period which if you attended you deserve paid therapy by the Bills for. 2006 to 2011 was just such a god awful time of irrelevance and lack of talent. Sure in 2012 they failed expectations but at least you could start the see the needle slowly move up with talent and signing Mario was a big boost to the fans moral.

I think I am still stuck on the part where he mentioned beers were only $8 lol

It is funny the Packers game does nothing really for me. I think part of it is because Green Bay looks weaker then they have in the previous few years and I think they are tops an 11 win team even with Rodgers. Also as a non conference game it does not really impact the Bills the way the Titans could or Baltimore. The Bengals is so late in the year that it could be important OR it could be not nearly as crucial with seeding and the playoffs. So I guess for me those games which are bigger matchups do not have the same luster and intrigue. The Dolphins I am very interested in.

That was like #6 for me on the best, def thought of it. Miami at least is intriguing this year to say the least.

Agreed. Ravens people seem to really be underselling and forgetting until Lamar was hurt they were 8-3 and the 1 seed. They had a historic amount of injury problems last year. Miami is the 2 in the division but I think they have too much they need to have all go right this year to fully challenge. I could see in future years they win the division over Buffalo due to the Bills having a tougher schedule and McDaniel having more time for his system.

We are less then a month from the hall of fame pre season game and football really kicking into gear. My football juices are amping up and figured have a fun discussion on the season games your most excited for vs least. To me I love every week even if it is the Jets or Bears especially watching Josh play. Here is what I got, feel free to join in or dissent! Top Games: 1. at Rams NFL opener- Goes without saying this is the game most fans wanted from day 1 and the biggest spot of the regular season 2. at Chiefs - Revenge game and opportunity to put them behind us in standings. Watching Mahomes vs Allen is beautiful to the eyes in terms of QB play 3. Titans home opener- Place will be rocking and the fans haven't seen the team since January. Plus after last years MNF game good opportunity to set the tone early 4. at Ravens - This game quietly is a 1:00 pm start yet could have more fireworks in terms of explosive plays of any. I think Baltimore is healthy and a lion of a team this year which should make for a great game. 5. Vikings - Minnesota has a very deep offense and tends to play very entertaining games plus Jefferson/Cook are awesome. Factor in the storylines of Diggs and Cook's brother on the Bills this is my darkhorse game for what could end up being one of the best of the year. Least Interesting: 1. either Jets game - I actually think the Jets take a step forward and win between 5-7 games. But they are still far below Buffalo and just not much to get excited with 2. at Bears - This game comes during the Xmas holiday which kind of stinks as people have stuff going on. Mix in the game itself feels like a 23-13 snoozefest as Chicago plays a super boring brand of football and yea... 3. at Lions - I think this will be a game based off how you do thanksgiving for how excited you are. For me its a complete pain as I travel during the day so I will miss out on a portion of the game. Additionally thanksgiving weekend I really enjoy going through the holiday and capping it with a Bills game on Sunday. Add in the Lions have proven nothing and it does nothing for me. 4. Cleveland - The whole Watson mess makes this a buzzkill. The dude is a creep and predator and whether he plays or not the stench will surround this game. 5. Patriots at home - I hate that we have NE week 18. There is a good chance the division is wrapped up and possibly the 1 seed where we are not playing for much. Additionally it would be nice to finally get NE early in the season and not on what will be a 10 degree game for what feels like the 8th straight year.

Does DunkirkDon get an invite in....follow the dots?

The 98 season is the first I truly remember as a fan where I look back and kinda know watching a bunch of games week in week out. This one I distinctly remember watching with my father and he lost it when the refs did this. The PI afterwards was even worse because it is a call that never happens. I watched back the Bills Phins 98 playoff game and that game was freaking wild. You really felt like Flutie was going to tie the game as he was magical all year. I remember the moment he fumbled I went upstairs to rip up my Dolphins trading cards I was so mad, Dad stopped me haha.

Yea probably my only gripe of his post which was good is this. They made the playoff and it was a known rebuilding/reset the deck yea we werent thinking playoffs. If anything people were crediting the Coach/GM for making the playoffs AND trading up to get a franchise QB prospect as that is super tough to pull.