Straight Hucklebuck
-
Posts
6,429 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Gallery
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by Straight Hucklebuck
-
-
26 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:
As if it's a binary choice.
I want no part of winston OR barkley.
I'll roll with Fromm and make Barkley QB3
Whatever man, I’d gladly have Winston over Barkley or Fromm.That said, I don’t have a problem with the Bills trying a younger QB to challenge Barkley.
But I bristle at Bills fans turning their nose up at Winston when the Beane McDermott era has started Nate Peterman, Derek Anderson and Matt Barkley.
-
1
-
-
7 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:
Q:
If this guy's a gem, just an absolute football treasure, why did the QB whisperer Arians cut bait with him?
Who would you rather have Joe, Winston or Barkley?
Give me a break with this.
-
7 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:
Which is why he's a career backup.
Right, which is why Winston would have been an upgrade at backup QB over Barkley and almost assuredly Fromm.But the Bills are not going to do that number one because he’s a real threat to Allen, and of course the money.
-
Just now, Joe in Winslow said:
Pardon me for being old fashioned, but 5000 yards doesn't outweigh 30 INTs.
That turd can't be polished, and Arians agrees with me, apparently.
Matt Barkley, 10 career TDs passes verses 21 InterceptionsJameis Winston 121 career TDs passes verses 88 interceptions.
Call me old fashioned but Matt Barkley flat out sucks.
-
56 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:
In a perfect world you sign a guy with 30 INT last season and spend real money on him for a backup?
It would seem that pessimism doesn't equate to critical thinking after all.
Because how often is there a situation like the 2020 offseason where a 5,000 yard passer in his prime taken #1 overall is/was available, along with the 2011 #1 overall pick and an MVP winner.Yeah, I would take 30-Int Winston over Barkley, and no I don’t think Allen has proved he is better than Winston.
But the Bills have invested the draft capital in Allen, so that means you go with a non-threatening backup.
-
The Bills need to scour cuts for linebackers.
They are T H I N.
-
1
-
-
8 minutes ago, Jerboski said:
I agree to an extent.. obviously beane is a wizard and knows best but I would have liked to see us make a move in the third or early fourth and grab a different wide receiver... this draft was loaded with WR talent and I'm not convinced the two we snagged are ever going to be big contributors
Sounds like a lot of the discontent are two things:
1. The Bills took a RB in Round 3, not OL or WR. If that's the case, it fits the growing trend that RB's are interchangeable and there is no need to draft them before Round 4. With that said, Moss seemed to be the last of the elite producers. After him, it did seem as if there was a drop off in college production.
2. The Bills took a QB in the 5th who is a long-shot to make it in the NFL, even as a backup QB. But Beane and McDermott have had a blind spot at QB. Drafting Peterman, starting Peterman 2x, acquiring AJ McCarron who flopped, and talking Derek Anderson out of retirement.
In a perfect world you sign Winston, and know you have a capable backup. But we know what that implies, you're spending real money on a backup and it puts Josh on notice. So we don't go that route. Instead, we go with weaker armed, game managers. The Bills have protected their starters (sometimes despite marginal results) for years. What can you do?
After the 5th Round, the Kicker pick was meh, unless he becomes the starting Kicker and can hit 50+ yarders.
-
2
-
-
9 hours ago, HappyDays said:
My main complaint with this draft is we did not take a single o-lineman. Our run blocking especially on the interior was fairly poor last year. Behind Spain and Feliciano we have no developing players, unless you count Bates I guess. I would take an OL and a CB every year because depth is that important.
IMO Fromm was a waste of a pick. I have gone back and forth on this and finally settled on the opinion that he doesn't have a role in the modern NFL. You can't be a statue with mediocre arm strength and make a living anymore. The ceiling of a player like that is Matt Ryan - as great a passer as he's been, he is useless without an above average offensive line and you just can't rely on that every year. And it is incredibly unlikely Fromm will reach that ceiling in any case. I know the comparison has been worn out but all I see is Matt Barkley 2.0 which to me is pointless to use a pick on. And the more I read on Fromm he is not really pinpoint accurate like some people have said.
The kicker worries me. I expect the job to be his to lose. I don't like the idea of relying on a rookie kicker because if it turns out he can't handle the pressure we're screwed on field goals the rest of the year. Hauschka had a down year but so did just about every kicker and at least with Hauschka we know what we're getting. He's been in pressure situations before. From what I've read about Bass he has a big leg but spotty accurscy. The last thing I want is the field goal version of Corey Bojorquez. I'm not 100% against the pick like I am with Fromm, I just get nervous if he ends up our starter.
All that being said I'm very pleased that we used this draft to build up the offense. Last year we had a major lack of talent around Allen, to the point that some Bills fans were tricked into thinking John Brown is a #1 receiver. We once again led the NFL in drops and our only receiver with a big catch radius came from the CFL and was inactive most of the games. Not to mention we gave a 97 year old running back the majority of rushes. So Beane adds 4 skill players (counting Diggs) - 3 receivers with a big catch radius and good hands, 2 of which also have size, and a real complementary RB that we can give the ball to without surrendering the down.
I think all of this is fair. I liked the Bills logic and path in this draft, because they have adopted full competition everywhere on offensive. They have reversed course from their 2017-2018 skill position debacles.
The structure of the Bills draft would have had to change to accommodate an OL.
Maybe the Bills could have still gone Epenesa in Round 2 because he was BPA, but certainly to get a quality offensive lineman, the pick in the 3rd Round wouldn't have been Moss. Can we really see a 4th Round OLineman getting the reps that Moss will get?
OL in the 3rd shoves RB down to Round 4 or 5, and by that point the WR's were picked over.
That's where you're right about Fromm. Mediocre athlete with a weak arm, the Bills are banking on him being a student of the game. He does sound a lot like Barkley, who fell in the 2013 Draft for the same reasons, weak arm, less than ideal size, despite playing at high level D1 School.
I think a few more more things:
1. The Bills are too thin at Linebacker for my tastes. You get past Edmunds, Milano and Klein, and its Vosean Joseph and ....... I was surprised they couldn't find a way to get a linebacker in this draft. Carter Coughlin lasted until the 7th. Instead of Fromm, were there any LB's available. Troy Dye fell to the 4th, maybe he would have been that linebacker instead of Davis.
2. I think we have to keep in mind how active the Bills have been in FA the last two years. They lost two defensive lineman, but signed 3, and drafted another in the 2nd Round on top of Oliver last year. They lost Kevin Johnson at corner (who stunk anyways), and signed Gaines and Norman (last year out of camp they only kept 4 corners). They added Diggs at WR, and signed another couple offensive lineman in FA. I think they looked at their roster and tried to pick positions where guys would actually stick.
3. On Kicker, for that pick to "work" he needs to beat out Hauschka this year. This Bills did this a few years ago when they took Dustin Hopkins. They didn't have the stomach to ride out the misses and bailed. Now the Redskins have had a decent kicker for years. But I think the Bills were right to flag anything over 50 yards was off the table last year, a problem that got worse and worse. Will the Bills have the stomach to ride out the misses early so this pick makes sense? If they don't it's a wasted 6th Round pick.
-
This is a definite blow to the Bills never get any respect card.
-
6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:
Agreed it is about more than explosion. It is about explosion, technique (especially at the line) and route running. It is true that neither Davis nor Hodgins were big separation guys in college. Neither has elite speed (though once he is long striding Davis is certainly quick enough).
The reason I worry more about Hodgins separating than I do about Davis is because when I watch Davis his technique at the line can definitely be improved and his route running lacks precision. Those are both very coachable and the Bills don't need him to start year one so they can bring him along in those regards while having him rotate in for certain plays and be their special teams gunner (which I think he will be from pretty much day 1). When I watch Hodgins..... that guy can run a route. After Jerry Jeudy he is pretty much as precise of a route runner as there is in the class, and yet he still didn't really separate in college. If I can make Davis better at the line and more precise running routes I think I can find an extra yard of separation in his game on most routes. How do I find that extra yard with Hodgins? Where does that incremental improvement come from? I think Hodgins could have a role on this team but it will likely be redzone only. Where the spaces are tighter in any event and so his ability to "go get it" makes him stand out. Is that a special enough skill for a roster spot? I know the overwhelming consensus among Bills fans will be "yes" I am a little more on the fence.
It’s a late 6th Round pick, if he’s David Nelson for a year or two than so be it.I think part of the thinking is competition amongst the lower level WRs to see if that portion of the roster can be improved. Let’s throw two guys in there that improved every year of college and had 25 TDs between them.
Every week last year it someone new - Isaiah McKenzie jet sweeps then he’d be inactive the next week, when is Foster getting out of the dog house, where is Duke Williams, can Andre Roberts be a real WR.
And that WR that fans wanted, Antonio Gables Golden? He was 6’4” too and his first flag was speed, speed, speed. Not too many Moss’s out there.-
2
-
-
Just now, teef said:
Or Ruggs was taken as the first wr because the raiders were being the raiders. They’ve often taken guys with top speed.
many teams say the combine won’t sway them much in one direction or the other. Can it? Sure, but it tends to blow up in their face.
They’re all there with their little notebooks, pencils and stop watches every year. -
10 hours ago, glazeduck said:
Separation is about a lot more than just explosion, it's ankle and hip agility, it's setting up CBs, it's knowing how to run routes against man v zone, hand placement/fighting, etc. This is why most GMs don't take too much away from the combine, literally no one in the NFL has ever run a straight line in shorts, unguarded in a game.
Hodgins had a hard time creating separation against a lot of middling-to-bad DBs in the P12. He's going to have his work cut out for him against NFL CBs.
I call BS on this.A lot of Coaches and GMs say they don’t take much away from the Combine.
But then Henry Ruggs is the first WR taken ahead of a great route runner, why? 4.27.
Then Trey Adams isn’t drafted. Why? Because he posted a 5.62 and other ghastly numbers.
-
1
-
-
3 hours ago, glazeduck said:
2. My draft evaluations/judgments come from 2 places: watching the film and athletic testing
That said, I have my reservations...
1. Love that we got Diggs. I think he's going to add a great dynamic to the offense ... A+
2. Unquestionably great value with Epenesa at the end -- solid A
3. Here's where my skepticism really kicks in. I love the way that Zach Moss runs, if the Terminator was a RB, I imagine they'd have very comparable styles. But I'm a big proponent of there being minimum thresholds of athleticism that one needs to perform at their relative position, and have seen some who feel that Moss doesn't meet those minimums. Only time will tell, but it's a concern (that builds into a larger concern, as mentioned be low)... They liked him, obviously, wanting to move up to get him, so I'll gladly be wrong here, but am nervous... Working on the theme above, would've loved to have been able to swoop in and take Mims before the Jets could've. Another big, athletic playmaker who opens up other avenues for the offense or Bryan Edwards. Incomplete
4. LOVE that we went for a WR with some size here, and I love reading about Davis' work ethic, so again, I'm cautiously optimistic that this one will pan out. But he's not overly athletic, he's not explosive, he doesn't run great routes, he's never going to be possibly more than a very slight a mismatch in terms of size/speed/strength... I don't know where he wins. C
5. Not convinced Jake Fromm even makes the roster. Sure he's a great leader, sure he knows football, cool. Unless we're drafting him to groom him as our next QB coach, this felt like a wasted pick to me, especially with the veterans available in FA. D-
6a. K is a need, we filled it, cool. I know nothing about the kid but like that most had him as their #1 ranked K and he has a big leg. Pass
6b. Really torn here -- I'm married to and Oregon State Beaver so have seen this kid dominate for the past 3 years. He actually tested out better than I expected, but that's a glaring weakness in his game. C+
7. It's hard and unfair to really say that a 7th rd pick is ever wasted, but I don't feel like this kid has a chance to make the roster. D+
In the end, they let things come to them, which I see as both good and bad. It's what the Ravens do every year and they've been one of the most successful franchises for a very long time. It means they're continuing to build on a defensive-minded, control the ball, style offense. I like that they're in sync there and operating with one vision -- that's ULTRA RARE in pro sports. It also means that they didn't take any chances, and as such, didn't make any substantial gains (Diggs' acquisition, notwithstanding). Meanwhile, the Chiefs and Ravens -- arguably our biggest competition out in front both had huge drafts and a number of other teams stocked up on weapons as well.
I’m happy to discuss pessimism, it’s how we think critically instead of being a pom pom waiver.I think you have to consider how active the Bills have been in Free Agency.
When you lose Shaq Lawson and Jordan Phillips, but then bring in Jefferson, Butler and Addison and draft Espenesa, there isn’t much value in drafting an additional lower round lineman. You have three other DEs in Murphy, Hughes and Johnson.
Same at Corner. Bills signed Norman and Gaines, lost Johnson. But have Taron Johnson, Levi Wallace, White, and resigned Marlowe.
I thought the Bills draft followed a logical path outside of the fact that they didn’t draft a linebacker.
Beane said Frank Gore played last year because of his physical nature. So the Bills had success drafting a 22-year old 3rd Rounder last year, so they went ahead with a proven college producer in that physical mold. Huge college production, high broken tackle rate. Instead of over paying old veterans whose best days are behind them like Ivory, Tolbert and Gore, the Bills have moved forward and learned their lesson.
Same thing at WR. The Bills have set up a system of competition. Diggs, Brown and Beasley are set. But the Bills are smart to not rely on Foster one game and Duke Williams in another and Isaiah McKenzie in another. They now have Foster, Williams, Roberts, McKenzie, Davis and Hodgins competing for three spots. It will heat up Training Camp. Mims would have been redundant.
One of the blind spots for McDermott and Beane has been backup QB. Peterman, McCarron, Anderson and even Barkley to a degree are poor options. So try again with an SEC QB with three years of starting experience. The Bills could have brought Winston in, but they would face the prospect of Allen facing real pressure.
Again the Bills could have tried a 5th Round Guard, but how likely were they to crack the 8-man OLine.
That’s one aspect of the Draft I liked. The Bills got guys with huge college production. Both WRs improved their numbers every season, Espensa was a double digit sack guy, Moss had over 4,000 yards rushing. And in all cases they’re young, 21 or 22. Not 23, 24 with missionary visits.
And kicker, well if Bass can put 50-yarders back on the map it helps this offense. But most times kickers have to get cut and bounce around some before sticking.
I think the Bills should have worked in a linebacker. It’s one of the few positions we’re still thin.
-
2
-
1
-
1
-
-
1 hour ago, Dave Allen said:
I'd bump the Browns down to Tier 3, and bump Miami up to 3 based on their FA moves. Otherwise, rock solid.
The Browns are really solid on offense though.
Conklin and Wills added at OT, Beckham and Landry at WR, Hooper and Njoku at Tight End and Chubb/Hunt in the backfield.
And we’re really so sure that Josh Allen has left Baker Mayfield in the dust? Because I’m not just yet.
-
1
-
-
13 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:
That is only sort of true...Whaley did all of the work for that draft. It's extremely likely he didn't make the picks, but the Bills board, the scouting work, everything except for picking the name off the board at the time of the selection was based on Whaley's work.
It's also unpopular, by Whaley was the GM for Hyde and Poyer.
I get it, the Bills have made the Playoffs twice with McDermott, so we like McDermott, so he gets the credit.
But I don't think it was McDermott completing the tape study to where his notes overrode the scouts.
Of course Whaley was being phased out, but it was his group that did the bulk of the 2017 offseason work.
-
1 hour ago, FlaFitz1 said:
I understand Whaley was still in Buffalo but it's widely believed McDermott was the one to call in the shots especially because the draft ended Saturday night around 7pm and his firing was announced around 8:30 am the next morning.
But McDermott didn’t complete all 2017 Draft Scouting for the Bills in 4 months.
Whaley had a college staff and a pro personnel staff.
The owner of the team said it didn’t make sense to relieve Whaley until after the draft because of the scouting effort.
-
I like Diggs and all, but aren’t we inflating his abilities a bit?
He’s been in the league 5 years now and has two 1,000 yard seasons.
He is among the several #1 type WR’s in the league, but is not a Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones HOF presence.
I doubt NFL Defensive Coordinators are dumb-founded with things that they can try to slow down Allen, Diggs, Brown and Beasley.
It’s more of a reflection of how far the Bills have come since trotting out Benjamin, Kerley and Jordan Matthews a few years ago.
-
3 minutes ago, eball said:
He is still learning but the rate at which he is improving is notable.
3 minutes ago, eball said:I see a guy with an incredible work ethic and desire to be great, matched up with unbelievable natural talent.
I will be shocked, not surprised, if the numbers aren't significantly better this year and beyond.
We mostly agree.His character is great, work ethic, team player, coach ability all of that.
I expect another modest improvement this season, but I don’t see a massive jump. That’s my read.
But the Bills FO has done everything they can to improve the talent.
-
1
-
-
2 minutes ago, Talley56 said:
I am very serious, yes, Mahomes is really good, as is the whole KC offense. But, as I mentioned in my post, their defense had a lot of question marks. Last year they lost to the Texans and Colts and, even though the Bills lost to the Texans in the playoffs, I still think they were better than both teams. KC is be no means invincible.
I think you’re selling Mahomes short.
Right now his first two seasons are Dan Marino in terms of numbers.
He’s way past “really good”.
He’s playing at a HOF level.
The Bills still largely have to win the same way. They need to get teams into a tight, low scoring game and win 19-16 until proven otherwise.
There should be development with Allen and Diggs, but I highly doubt we see an offense around 30 ppg, I don’t think Allen projects as that kind of QB.
-
2 minutes ago, eball said:
Umm, go look at Allen's passing stats in the short/intermediate range last season and in the red zone. Really the only area in which he "struggled" was the deep passing game; he got better everywhere else. I will be proven right or wrong in time, but I still say if we look at these two QBs three years from now (after each has completed five seasons) I don't think it will be an "easy" call to take Jackson first.
You also mentioned in this thread that the Bills won't beat the Chiefs because they won't hold KC to 17 points -- implying the Bills' offense will not improve despite what Beane has done to improve the O's potential explosiveness by adding Diggs, Moss, etc. Are you saying you do not expect Allen to continue to develop? If not, why not?
Allen improved relative to his rookie self.2018 was 175 ypg, 1 TD and 1 Int per game.
Last year it was 190 yards a game and 1.5 TDs while cutting down the interceptions and keeping his rushing TDs in play.
What he needs to do now is improve his play verses the NFL standard.
In 2018, the Bills averaged 15 ppg with a laughable talent base, in 2019 it jumped up 19.5 ppg with Brown and Beasley and flushing McCoy out the door. We could see a jump to 24 - 25 ppg this season.
But one thing that is true is that Allen has never put up numbers in college or so far in the pros that predict a top flight offense, capable of scoring 28-32 ppg.
He has yet to break fully from his Scouting Reports which said elite tools but raw. He still functions as a game manager, not a playmaker.
-
1
-
-
5 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:
So the bills get the ball down one score with about 70 yds to go and time to do it(all factors before a couple bad calls on the ravens), and it “wasn’t as close as the score indicated”.....
.... that’s pure unadulterated horse****.
So this is you assuming an offense with a more seasoned qb, Stefon freaking diggs, and a non-geriatric RB2. Is still gonna manage 19 game?
speaking of “you can’t be serious” ..... also I’m not saying the bills will be better than the chiefs. But assuming the bills offense merely holds serve is sorta silly IMO.
Hey Bills fans, I know we’re really excited about Diggs and Allen, but Mahomes and their HOF Coach and skill players have put up 76 aerial touchdowns vs 18 interceptions in two years en route to an MVP and Super Bowl Championship.
Can we show a little humility and acknowledge real results as opposed to romancing our first round collapse against Houston?
Let’s put up back to back winning seasons and get out of the first round before declaring that we could give the Chiefs problems huh?
-
1
-
-
17 minutes ago, Talley56 said:
I honestly believe the Bills can be better than the Chiefs. They are the champs, yes, but I still think they have a lot of question marks on defense. They looked very beatable quite often last year.
You can’t be serious.
Mahomes is off to the best QB start to a career in NFL history.
As good as the Bills defense is, no way are they keeping the Chiefs to under 17 points so that Allen and the offense can muster 19 for the win.
-
1
-
-
1 hour ago, eball said:
I do believe the Bills' OL will be better even with mostly the same pieces, for reasons of continuity and experience as you note.
Jackson's inability (thus far) to make "big time" throws from the pocket is a weakness that Josh Allen doesn't have.
I've spoken to Ravens fans who refer to their offense as a "house of cards."
We’ll see on the Bills offensive line. Beane has done a good job getting an influx of players in so that true camp battles can be had. I’m not as sold that the same players brought back will play much better than we’ve seen, with the exception of Ford.
Where does Josh Allen have a book of “big time” throws from the pocket? His best two of the year were the Cowboys game with the Beasley throw and the throw out his own end zone.
The Ravens have an identity an draft accordingly.
Likewise the Bills have an offensive scheme and have Coaching continuity.
Listen, we act like Allen offers ceiling that Lamar Jackson doesn’t have, but we’ve yet to see that in actual games. This is all a feeling based on the “tools” section of a scouting report, not actual games.
-
2
-
-
1 hour ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:
And they also got beat at home in the playoffs, pretty soundly too. That reigning MVP looked pretty bad. Let’s see how Lamar does this year.
To say the Bills aren’t in Baltimore’s league is laughable.
The Bills went 10-6, scored 314 points.The Ravens went 14-2, scored 531 points. We struggled with the Texans, they smoked the Texans by 34 points. They also crushed New England, a team Brandon Beane acknowledged the Bills couldn’t beat, and they also beat the 49ers.
It’s just my opinion, but given their acquisitions in FA, their full compliment of draft picks, we are solidly behind them in the AFC, at minimum until Josh Allen shows a higher gear.
-
1
-
Healthy Skepticism for This Year's Draft Class...
in The Stadium Wall Archives
Posted
Yeah man.