Rochesterfan

Basically - we don’t know what new advancements are coming - so can they build the field with the ability to handle future technology as things change. The current stadium has been known to lack the ability to handle the full crew associated with prime time games because many of the cable pathways built into the cement could not be increased to handle more camera locations around the stadium. We also saw huge leaps in lighting and scoreboard technology, but they have struggled to upgrade the facilities to handle the new upgraded technology. They also struggle to get powerful wifi around the stadium due to the sheer amount of concrete and metal and those are just in recent years. we don’t know what tech is coming, but building a stadium with some built-in flexibility will help. The old stadium was great for about 30+ years and the last 10-15 the lack of ability to upgrade even the showers and locker rooms in the opposing teams areas and the concourses to fit more choices have really hampered the overall experience.

The intentional grounding was on the RB not Webb. The screen was read and destroyed and the RB decided to break his route and start downfield. Webb threw the ball purposely into the ground right where the RB should have been. I actually thought he stayed composed for his first real action against a different team in years. I think it is obvious he does not have Josh’s or Mitch’s talent level, but it sounds like he is a great guy and someone they all like and he is smart - so I still see him as a valuable PS player.

Yes there will be improvements to get it in line with what is needed today, but you are not changing toward the future - you are taking the existing idea and placing it in a new location- hopefully with enough room to grow in the future.

I will also say that warmer temperatures will keep the lake thawed more and when the cold polar wind currents shift down and go over the warmer, moist, thawed Great Lakes - we get lake effect snow in the Buffalo area. Warmer temperatures will not actually necessarily decrease the snowfall in Buffalo because of where most of our snow comes from. Warmer temperatures will most likely lead to more cases of blizzard like conditions that last for short periods of time as wind patterns shift.

Based upon some people I respect calling this a one-sided hatchet job - I will not give clicks to the original article - I will wait for a reputable source like Warrow to write a true piece. I agree with JMF that this is negotiating tactics- I just don’t see it landing near 50/50. I firmly believe the Pegula’s are making a huge concession going open air and in OP and that is their opening volley in payment. Basically we are saving you nearly 50% of the cost on the stadium we could demand - downtown and retractable roof - so we expect you to contribute about 1.2 billion publicly and we will get 200 million from NFL loans and pay this off. I think the final figures will be close to that - probably 1 Billion public, 200-300 million NFL and a couple 100 million from the Pegula’s covering cost overruns and additional amenities they want. I think there will be a lot of bickering and it will be messy, but some of it will come from the infrastructure bill being passed and now is the perfect time to get this done.

Can most current fans afford big increases - the answer is maybe - if the price was significantly higher and had PSLs - some would find a way - just like they have done at other stadiums - I mean some Jets fans found ways to deal with massive increases and PSLs and some were priced out. The question is if 30,000 people that currently are ticket holders got priced out - could you replace them with 25,000 people with more disposable income and a higher willingness to park in the Bills lots and buy food and drinks in the stadium? Would you see the transformation to a more corporate clientele that would prefer different amenities including a roof and less tailgating - similar to how the number of people getting into club seats has increases. If we want to keep the same tailgating and table jumping crowds that spend more money on food and beverages outside the stadium - then you build cheap and publicly funded. If you want to change the clientele and the game day experience- then you change the stadium - you go smaller, roofed stadium and charge higher ticket prices and PSLs and you provide a more personal experience like in the club seats for more fans. The Pegula’s seem to have decided that trying to maintain the current experience is what they think is best for now - so that is great. Now people just need to expect a larger percentage of public funding to maintain the lower ticket prices.

What I have seen is milder with more extreme changes - so warmer followed by more severe blizzards and higher winds at higher frequency. Much like hotter weather in the south with more hurricanes and dryer weather in the Midwest with more tornadoes. My guess would be we could see a few years with wonderful weather, but potentially more times like the blizzard that caused use to move a NYJ game to Detroit.

Look - I get it and don’t disagree and I am pretty sure it will end up as an open air stadium in OP because of money. I just feel that is based on maintaining what we have - low cost point and tailgating and although both are important- I think it is short sighted thinking to just build a newer version of what we have rather than what will better suit our needs for the next 50 years. The fan base, the sport, and the climate are all changing and now is the opportunity to plan a future to help an aging population in a snow belt climate - when it might just be a better product to watch at home.

This is also incorrect - Buffalo is the snowiest NFL city typically by a lotupwards of 20 inches more than other NFL cities - especially in Orchard Park compared to downtown.. It is also the windiest NFL city as you stated. Buffalo also sees even more snow starting in January than Nov and December - meaning as the season extends 17th and eventually 18th regular season game and additional playoff rounds - the chances of getting hit by a blizzard or super windy game goes up.

That is exactly what I am talking about - it is called the best blue collar city because of the hourly union healthcare and education jobs. They are not traditional blue collar jobs. It is the same reason Rochester is #3 on the list - with an extremely limited traditional blue collar workforce. Rochester has traditionally been considered much more white collar than Buffalo, but it is #3 because it is being driven by the same healthcare and education jobs as Buffalo. Why for any reason would you specifically talk only about men and just the city of Buffalo when talking about a stadium in OP - that makes literally no sense. Asking what guys named Bob that live on the south side of Hamburg and deciding what stadium design is best makes just as much sense. We we’re talking about stadiums and you said we are a blue collar city and therefore should be an open air stadium in OP, but we find out you are basing that on men only that live in the city? 🤦‍♂️ I am pretty sure that the people going to the game include people from the suburbs and even women and maybe a covered stadium is even more inviting for that group and brings in more people. We already know that late season and bad weather games tend to have difficulty selling out even when we were going to Super Bowls. We also know that when we were bad those late season and bad weather games end up with 20-30,000 fans - many complaining about Donahoe at the time. The final thing we know from the players is several of them prefer indoor venues and have talked about liking the consistency- including our franchise QB. I understand the Pegula’s making the choice because it saves money and the ask will be close to 1 billion in public funds and that money should cover the majority of the stadium, but it doesn’t make it the best choice - it made it the most convenient choice.

I think your pulse is way, way off and it completely impacts your opinions. The major employers in Buffalo right now are 4 Hospitals systems, 2 grocery chains, multiple banks, and insurance companies. There are also gaming companies, schools, and food service driving employment. The occupational employment and wage information collected and printed by the US bureau of labor points out the fact that education and healthcare alone outstrip Construction, industrial production, and installation and repair for the Buffalo region. Due to the number of union employees (including in healthcare) - Buffalo is considered an excellent “blue collar town” with high wages compared to housing costs, but the caveat from reading the studies - is the majority of jobs are not “Blue Collar Jobs” - they are hourly paid union jobs in healthcare and schools. There are also over twice the number of people working in banking than construction - so I guess my overall take would be that the people you know and interact with fit a more traditional blue collar job and perspective. There are an even larger group living throughout the surrounding area that have a different and just as valid set of feelings. The issue with you wanting to poll all of Buffalo and the surrounding area will lead you to the same issue that San Diego had. There are huge swaths of people that don’t care about sports and would rather see the money spent elsewhere and that ends up being exactly how San Diego lost the Chargers. They had support of fans, but the wider community rejected the call for money to build a stadium and therefore the team left.

I believe you are correct it is about a 50/50 mix of people wanting fixed roof and people wanting open air. It bounces a bit back and forth either way. As to the idea that we have sold out plenty of games even during the drought - that is just crazy talk. The running joke for most of the early 2000’s - was the cost of Bills tickets on the resale market starting in November. Most years you could get resale tickets on Stub Hub for under $5 a ticket. The Comeback game wasn’t the only late season game during the Super Bowl run that didn’t sell out - it was quite common with Ralph having to by up 2-3000 tickets and give them away. The other misconceptions is that the weather effects other teams more - that is a false narrative- the weather makes the 2 teams more closely matched because each team loses the ability to play the game to the best of their ability. The wind in the Ravens game basically kept the Ravens in the game as teams only moved the ball going in 1 direction. Bad weather/windy games help strong running teams and hurt passing teams and if we want to have an elite offense built on Josh Allen’s arm - we should be doing everything to maximize that. Yes he can throw the better and farther than most, but if the wind is causing issues with every throw going in one direction a team built like the Pats is going to have a huge advantage coming into OP late in the year. The same thing goes for a team like Cleveland or Tennessee in the playoffs - if we have home field and the weather is crap - we hamper our own ability - while enhancing others.

I agree, but the fans wanted open air and OP because cost and Tailgating were cited in multiple studies as the top things fans wanted. For the city of Buffalo, for the long term enjoyment, and the development of the area - it is by far the most short sighted decision as basically you are replacing one with another and there is little benefit.

That why I said they have been divesting themselves of these things. I think years ago they were hoping to buy up and move things downtown, but over the last 3 years that has changed to the point they have been moving on from restaurants/bars around the arena downtown. I think they saw the OP site as the future stadium site and then coupled with the pandemic- have moved on from that area.

It could have been avoided - if and only if the staff believes there is a depth issue. I think they always like more veterans, but I don’t think they believe the issue is bad at all. Especially if they play more aggressively- I think they will be fine with the guys they have. I don’t think they believe even guys like Nelson were real improvements.

I think he plays because it is at home and gives fans a chance to have a true game environment for him. I think with the extra week - you give him time and let him have the moment before the season starts.

Robey-Coleman is on Detroit - we saw him last weekend. Sherman to me is exactly like what the Bills have done the last 2 years - he is a mediocre CB that was a name several years ago. He would be ok if injuries hit, but I don’t think he is better than our current and I would rather see the young kids play. Boston is a safety and was terrible last year - definitely not what they need. Conley is at least young, but he has baggage big time and was injured last year. Based upon his play - I am not sure he is better than Jackson or Wildgoose at this point. For me the only way this works is if a veteran on a bad team wants out - like Bell on the Jets last year - and you can get him on a super cheap deal or you trade some depth - DE, DT, OL and get a younger veteran CB in return, but even in those cases you are picking up someone else’s unwanted and hoping it is better than guys this staff likes.

I voted no, but if there was something available a cut or a trade - I would be fine. I just don’t think with what is available you are getting any upgrades. They have tried veteran CBs each of the last couple of years - guys that fit in and they do not work out. I don’t want another higher priced former mediocre CB just because he was a name 3-4 years ago. I would rather play through with these young kids and see where they can take me.

Look to be fair - I totally agree that Watson is a scumbag that should be suspended as soon as possible. If they kicked him right out of the league - that is still to good for the guy, but I really see how the NFL is in a tight situation here and I think they are really hoping something breaks to make the decision clear which way these various groups are leaning. I have always assumed either way he will go on the list the week prior to Week 1 and Houston knows that - which is why he is spending little time as QB because he will be unavailable.

This is especially confusing to me because the choice that was leaked: Open air and in OP both are choices that benefit the fans over the owner. People should be thanking the Pegula’s for listening to what they want - the fans wanted cheaper prices and tailgating as some of the more important features of a new stadium and for once you have owners that listened. The things that benefit individual fans in OP also benefit the Pegula’s financially - which is a win/win. A higher public financed amount - by any means - helps lower or eliminate PSLs and keeps ticket prices down as the Cost is spread across a wider group rather than just users. This should allow for the Pegula’s to maintain a profit and people to continue to get season tickets and tailgate. As I have said before - I believe the ideal situation for the Pegula’s would be a downtown Stadium - near the Arena where visitors/opposing teams use their hotels and visit their restaurants and bring them more money, but I think they saw that OP would be cheaper and make things better for fans - so they divested some of those things and went with the OP route. The people that should be mad are the non-fans that will have their money invested into this new stadium, but that was occurring either way. The Bills fans whether local or outside the area should not be angry with the Pegula’s - even if in the end it becomes 80-100% publicly financed because the choice in OP was done strictly for the fans as it is the least logical choice based upon what the Pegula’s own and where and what would be most helpful to get additional funds to improve much needed infrastructure in the city.

How many games has Watson played since being accused? AB was exempted after there was proof of him texting back and going after an accuser. He also had attacked a moving truck and driver. Things occurred with AB and it happened during the season - so they put him on the list. I will consider Watson and AB to be the same if once the games start and charges are filed - if they allow him to play through the charges. How the NFL should handle this is a no win situation - my guess is prior to actual games he should be put on the commissioners list, but for preseason the Texans should be dealing with the issue.

All that does is help the Texans - right now it should be the Texans deciding what he can do. The NFL should put him on the commissioner’s list before game 1, but not now. What are the consequences if they take a stand against injustice and we find out he is innocent - look no further than when they went the other way on Kapernick. Ideally they should stay out of it until Game #1 and then force a decision by the Texans. Don’t give the team an out - that is what Houston wants.

What should they do? Why are they embarrassing themselves? It sounds to me like they are waiting on the legal side to make a decision and will decide on whether he can play or not as they approach the first game. They are leaving the legal parts to the legal team and forcing Houston to deal with the situation rather than letting them off the hook. I have no issue with what they are doing right now.

Don’t know him, but too many people just belittle certain people and that is not who I am. I re-read my post and I didn’t like the way it came off like Zay has no talent and just an ol shlub could beat him out - when it is obvious he is a good player and I felt it needed to be clarified.

Sorry - I just want to be clear - I am really not trying to belittle or put down Zay Jones with my comment. He was a waste for us, but I genuinely believe this Bills WR room is that deep with guys I would play over Jones. The first 6 are locks to me: Diggs Sanders Beasley Davis McKenzie Kumerow Then I would seriously consider as better or equal some younger guys like: Hodgins Stevenson Lenoir Then you have 2 veteran guys like: Gentry Williams They are in Zay’s ballpark, but probably just below. We have a very deep and talented WR room and Zay Jones to me is just a borderline NFL player that does just enough to stick around. Again no offense to him as the NFL needs those guys also, but I seriously don’t think he beats out the top 8 or 9 on this team.