Rochesterfan

There are dozens of studies that look at financial impacts, but they ignore huge swaths of impact on the economy. They look at the relative economic impact without things like lost jobs and taxes of the players and owners, the subset of people that are impacted like all of the merchandise in stores that are sold and shipped and the sales tax on that. The change in the attitude of the community and the impact on social services needed and loss of donations. So yes it is well known that a stadium by itself will not pay for itself, but the added benefits of the stadium and the team have huge benefits to the community and that becomes both financial and community wide benefits. You are correct ticket pricing is going to change - the difference is if it is a publicly financed project and the cost is picked up across millions of people - individual cost is lessened and the money to cover the stadium cost does not need to be picked up by the owner and passed on to each visitor. If it is privately financed - that cost is then spread across just the 60,000 fans and hits them every visit. Ask the fans in any of these newer stadiums about things like PSLs and what it costs to actually attend games in LA or NY or even NE. NE fans were thrilled that Kraft was building a privately funded stadium and wasn’t going to have PSLs everyplace. Now if you read about it - most fans have been priced out and it has become a corporate venue where people are less concerned about the game and more about the vibe. It has been a huge complaint. The Pegula’s in doing their fan survey already have an idea of certain price points and the only way to get there is a healthy mix. As to you final point - of course there are millions of investment opportunities that provide better return, but the chances of Buffalo getting those are slim to non. You can easily say let’s not write Terry a check and 100% the Bills leave and what do you gain. Does Buffalo get the 1 Billion dollars freed up to do something with? Does Buffalo lose an identity and become another also-ran small city? Does Buffalo suddenly lose 53 millionaires that buy houses, pay taxes, buy vehicles, throw huge parties and become a fabric of the community. How much is that worth? Your point about infrastructure is why to me the best thing the county and state could do is say - we want this thing built downtown and we want the infrastructure built up around it and we will cover the costs and it is going to be used to drive much needed infrastructure and change. Will it make money - nope, but can it be used to get things that are badly needed and ignored no - yes it can. Overall - in the end - it is going to be a mix with a huge amount publicly financed and it will get done and that is a good thing.

You are completely principled on this - so as the people of SD, LA, Oakland, Cleveland, Baltimore, and St. Louis for example - how great it was to call the bluff. Those cities all called the bluff and lost their teams - did that help and improve the local economy? Did those cities all suddenly become wealthy because they didn’t subsidize a stadium? Nope all of those cities except SD so far - went out and subsidized a stadium very shortly after and then aggressively went out to pay through the nose to get a new team back. A majority of the time now in a 100% public financed stadium to lure teams back. So you can be fully principled and say no public funds and then drop your drawers and bend over when they leave ala St.Louis, Cleveland, Baltimore, and LA. Or you can have a stadium sitting there and no team so it is just a waste and reminder - ala SD and Oakland the second time (both of which are trying to figure out if they can get new teams to return and what it will take). Or you can work with the team, county, and state to come up with a public/private mix and get things taken care of and maintain the team and still maintain the current fan mix. The final thing is you can pray they want to do a 100% private and the Pegula’s own the stadium, but then you better be prepared not to attend any more. Anything greater than about 30% paid by the owners will come with pricing out the majority of fans - see the NY teams, Dallas, and Boston. They make back the money and true fans no longer can afford to attend. So for me - I hope the stadium is nearly 100% financed by the public because even though it will never return the money - the team and the experience are more important in the end.

Agreed - and I would expect a lot of what I am calling a Hybrid 12 player grouping near the goal line. 1 RB, Gilliam as a TE/shift FB (hence the hybrid), and 1TE with Sweeney. I think then you bring in Kumerow or Davis as the #2 WR to give a big body/blocker. I think this player grouping allows for a ton of variation for a talented play caller like Dabol with RB runs, shifting Gilliam into the backfield - you have quick handoffs to him, you can use him to help gain an edge and run pitchouts to the RB - heck you can even do the Kelce play where they toss Gilliam the ball so it is a forward pass and let him crash into the line. You could fake a pitch to the weak side and have Josh follow Gilliam as a lead blocker. You could fake the run and have the #2 WR on a crossing route and the TE sliding out to the back corner and Gilliam just busting forward and turning around past the goal line to hold LBs and the RB sprinting out into the flat. Or you can reverse that and have the TE run across and the WR block down and then pivot to the corner. There are just a ton of plays with that player group and utilizing different formations and I think it starts with a better blocking TE like Sweeney and a jackknife of a player in Gilliam. My guess is Daboll and the offensive staff discussed player grouping a lot and this type of play is not in Hollister’s wheel house. It is also not in Knox’s wheel house - which is why I don’t think it came down to Sweeney versus Hollister. I think it was Knox versus Hollister once the WRs and DL showed out and Knox has looked really good. Once Knox got the starting job - then it fell to who else do we keep and what positions and Hollister backing up Knox could more easily be replaced by a WR than losing Stevenson/Kumerow or Addison/Obada. It stinks, but I get it.

I am not sure I believe the bolder bit. Just based upon Beane’s comments alone - I think they would of loved to have him on the PS and it was very close to getting on the 53. I think based upon what Beane said in his news conference and on WGR about how he handles cuts - that he and Hollister and probably Hollister agent had a discussion and they decided that he had opportunities to make someone else’s 53 and they gave their blessing to pursue that. Beane quite candidly stated he thought he would sign on someone else’s roster and that the door here was not closed and that he could be brought back, but I think the agent was already working on landing places. Beane seems well respected by agents for his honesty and openness as was seen when he talked about how they signed Mitch and the discussion Beane and Mitch’s agent had - so it would not surprise me if Beane had a similar discussion and that was why Hollister was an early cut and my guess is that just increases the respect these agents have for Beane.

This exactly - The way Beane talked him at the press conference and the things Beane said on WGR about the cut process - I strongly believe the Bills like Hollister and wanted to put him on the PS, but in discussion with the player and the agent decided he was probably good enough for someone else’s 53 and as a sign of respect - they agreed to cut him early and let him pursue that. I am pretty sure that is where the comment came from by Beane that we are not closing the door and if a spot opens he would be welcomed back. I think most of us (me included) thought that he would be a quick re-sign to the practice squad, but I think that is part of what makes this a good front office - I think they worked with the player and let him go after a 53 and had a backup plan to bring in another player as needed.

I will say the other piece that I think worked against Hollister was Reggie Gilliam becoming a multi position NFL level player. Where I expected Hollister to have a big advantage on the Bills was in an H-Back role - picking up blitzes and then sliding out to become an outlet. He seemed to do that well in Seattle and I thought that was a spot Knox struggled last year. I think Gilliam showed he could become the Bills version of Kittle lite in the backfield. He can protect, he can slip out for catches, he can run that Kelce style TE/H back shovel pass near the goal line, and he can run the ball on occasion. I think the Bills looked at it as we have Gilliam and Sweeney near the goal line and Knox in the middle of the field - what role does Hollister bring other than back-up to these spots and is that worth a roster spot over Kumerow/Stevenson or Addison/Obada?

Maybe people are embellishing what people are saying because of things like your original statement. Keeping Sweeney over Hollister is going to “hurt the team” and “fans will be right”. Basically the last 2 years the #2 TE has been targeted 14 and 16 times in total with a catch rate of 45% and 75%. I am not sure that Hollister or Sweeney in that role truly “hurts the team”. I also think that where the Bills will utilize the #2 TE most is around the goal line as a blocker sneak out TE - think Lee Smith and that is where Kroft got several of his catches. If the Bills think Sweeney is the better in-line blocker and he has pretty much continued through this camp catching everything thrown his way per Sal (Sal stated he thought Sweeney had the best hands of all the TEs and it wasn’t close) then Sweeney was kept for a specific reason - a role Hollister could not fill. Hollister and Knox in the end were competing for other TE position because of the numbers - so I don’t look at it as Sweeney over Hollister because I think Sweeney fills a specific role that Knox and Hollister can’t. I look at it as Knox over Hollister and that may be a mistake - it may not - but those 2 play a similar role and based upon the Media watching practice - Sal (and the coach and GM) said that Knox has looked real good and they like what they see. Honestly based on Beane’s comments - I think they liked Hollister, but preferred Knox’s upside and his work ethic. I think (and it is just my opinion) the Bill’s would of liked to get him on the PS, but in discussion (sort of like Cam Newton) - Hollister felt he could make another teams starting 53 (and maybe Beane even suggested to him to go ahead and try) and therefore they agreed not to go the PS route. Beane did say it was available and not to rule him coming back - so to me it read like - the Bill’s decided on Knox over Hollister and then working with the player and agent decided to let him pursue other options and left the door open if things don’t work out we would love to have you back. My final guess is in the end because Jacksonville has a rookie QB and an offense that uses TEs - Hollister will get more opportunity there than the TEs here. The WR room here is too good and too well stocked for a back up TE to see the field enough to be a difference maker. Where it might hurt is if Knox reverts back and is unreliable- then Knox over Hollister was a mistake. Sweeney was most likely the right call as he was the only true in-line blocker of the 3 and fills the role in the red zone to run those look like I am blocking and slip out roles.

I would agree, but owning the Sabres is his life long dream - so I doubt he sells them anytime soon. The state keeps finding ways to build new arenas all over NYC for hockey, basketball, football, and baseball. My guess is they will come up with the funding at some point for the Sabres, but they absolutely have to turn it around first. At some point Hockey is also going to have to have another come to Jesus moment because once again Cost is outstripping revenue for many teams as the cap goes up - even after huge loses.

I think this is mostly right - he would care where it was built to better support his other investments like Downtown Hotels and Restaurants and help bring infrastructure to help improve the area around the hockey stadium to bring more and better tournaments in. Money he could make outside of the sport itself. The more important piece though - I believe - is to get the most public funding possible and the lowest cost and have it owned by the county - so they pay upkeep and renovation costs that will come every year because it is open air. I think if this had been done 5 years ago - they would push downtown big time, but PSE has been getting rid of the poorly managed restaurants downtown and therefore there is less for them. We will see with the ECC campus - if the Pegula’s are gifted some land to develop around the stadium or if they eventually push to have a new rink built out in OP in the next decade. This decision has the potential for additional impact down the road.

There you go - position numbers it makes sense - I think they must have been trying to give Hollister a shot at an active roster - or maybe his request. Not surprised - makes sense positionally. Probably a guy they have been watching. Very developmental, but has nice traits - just to injured so far.

It could be - I totally agree with the logic, but if there was a veteran OLineman out there that was any good - it seems like he would be heading to an active roster. OL - especially tackles are at such a premium that the Bills didn’t feel they could cut Doyle and get him to the PS. They did cut Hart and I don’t anticipate him coming back and he is one of the better veteran tackles available - so I am just not sure who this mystery Tackle is. I could totally see a young rookie or UDFA if they can find one - I just don’t see the valuable veteran OT that is better than Bates and Brown. To me Doyle is just on the 53 to protect him and he will be inactive every week, but will get valuable experience for next year. Ideally - I am right there with you - they would love a veteran tackle that could be a call-up and protection, but I don’t see those guys available. The only position that I see veteran depth that has a talent pool left is DB - you have several CBs and even a guy like Marlowe at safety and a few of these guys might be able to play either Safety or Corner in a pinch. This is the part of the game that I love - it is like math mixed with a puzzle.

Or Kraft found a way to give Hoyer money under the table. Anyone want some BH#5 juice or bars - 100% all natural - we accidentally bought 10,000 cases at $1000 a case and found out they were horrible. Oh well I guess Hoyer will get the 10 million - AW shucks it was an honest investment opportunity. 😂

It is interesting. Going through the numbers both on the roster and on the PS - I am leaning away from DB. They already have 3 on the PS - which complements the active roster being short. Safety is the same except they kept an extra safety on the active roster and are 1 short on the PS. LB with 6 and 1 seems fine and DL has 2 PS guys so they seem covered. QB with 2 and 2 and WR with 7 and 2 seem set. OL - they kept extra tackles on the 53 and have 2 guys on the PS - so there is not a glaring need. That leaves me with RB and TE. TE has the biggest need with 2 active and 1 PS - when traditionally they keep 4 on the active roster. I know Gilliam can fit that role, but that still leaves them 1 short of our usual numbers. My only concern here is that we had a guy in Hollister - that would be your obvious bring back guy and they didn’t. RB - we have 3 (+ Jones - really a ST guy) and 1 PS - not exactly short, but not fully fleshed out. If they had their eyes on a speedy pass catching guy - I could see that. I guess position wise - I lean a TE is coming in, but I just don’t see the value or the player. Available players that seem obvious - I lean CB as there are 3-4 veteran guys that could be nice fits - so my guess is a veteran DB will be visiting to be around for a last shot at a ring.

Completely disagree with this take. We saw once again that for bottom tiered young guys 45-60 - pre season is vital to making a roster. That was really lacking for rookies and UDFA’s last year and there were almost no waiver wire pick-ups because of the lack of preseason. Stevenson makes this roster because of preseason work. Hamlin makes this roster in the preseason. McCloud gets picked up and is on a roster because of preseason. For 27 waiver wire pick-up - preseason meant the world. Now we will see how it goes once the season starts. Do defenses look better early because they got (even if limited) some playing time? Are there fewer soft tissue injuries early in the season because these players were able to open it up and go all out and actually tackle? I could see a reduction and/or a change from 3 preseason games down to 2 or 1 and more controlled scrimmages to allow coaches to see these players actually play, but there are just as many injuries in the scrimmages as games. I personally loved how McD handled the preseason. Almost no starters - he let bubble guys play and it showed out for some young guys that made this roster and some Veterans that got cut. He also chose one game and got his guys a little time together just to get them all on the same rhythm and timing.

Maybe, but he made the original 53 and was cut after the Lions claimed 2 players. So the timing really doesn’t add up. For example Ferguson was cut yesterday so Stevenson could make he 53 and then when Stevenson moved to IR Reid came back. Marlowe was on the Lions ester day when they would of IR’d players and was cut today with their Waiver pick-ups that hav to go on the active roster. Doesn’t mean he won’t be back, but I don’t think it was the cut and IR piece.

Could be. It ruled out Hollister for me and Becker. I thought maybe Marlowe, but he wouldn’t need a tour. Trufant sounded like he was dealing with some family issues, but if that is cleared up then I am all for it. I was trying to see if there was some younger OLine prospects, but didn’t see anything earth shattering. Can’t wait to find out.

McKenzie was fielding kicks today - so my guess would be McKenzie.

Brandon Beane said at 5:00 on the radio - the last spot is filled - they were flying the guy in to tour and to sign. Not sure who or what position - BB would not say.

I heard Beane say that also - wondering who they have coming in. Sounded like a tour and signing - so I thought it was someone totally new. @Reks Ryan - why is it strange they haven’t signed someone from another team. We have a deep and talented roster with lots of guys they like. It should be no surprise that they wanted to keep as many of their own guys as possible. The surprise to me was that we only had 1 guy claimed and some lesser teams had multiple guys picked up. It shows me the Bills really have a pretty good handle on this.

What can you repeat that in writing on the board? 😂

Urban has always felt he was above the law or was the law everyplace he has been. Jacksonville has been no different except each time he has tried to do things his way - sneaky hires, over practicing, and now vaccinated comments - he keeps getting his hand slapped. He is not long for this position and that is going to set their QB back because Urban seems vindictive and I could see him doing similar things that Bill O’Brien did and destroying the team from the inside before he is gone.

Not sure I would consider CB a position of need and I am really not sure an upgrade comes from the Jets cut pile. If he struggled bad enough to be one of their worse defenders - he isn’t beating out our top guys on the 53. He just isn’t.

With one last spot - I would expect it to go to Becker, but I am wondering if they are waiting on Hollister. Maybe if Hollister doesn’t find another team - he will fill the last spot. Overall - very happy with the breakdown. Would of loved McCloud based upon what I saw, but Cam Lewis showed just a bit less in just a bit more time. I am all good.

Depends, but based upon much of what has been proposed - ECC south gets demolished and suddenly you have 4-5 extra lots - more than enough to support the fan base. They already have more spaces available if needed as they allow doubling up in lots as people leave space to tailgate. In a 60,000 seat stadium you are looking at 15,000 fewer patrons already - so I think they could easily get more than enough spots if they want. There are other ways they could go about eliminating private lots if they want, but the most effective is to bake it into the cost of the ticket/PSL and then they get the money even if you decide to park elsewhere.

Yes people absolutely love going to Bills games and we are known for having some of the best tailgating in the NFL. Of course people love being in the lot drinking THEIR BEER and eating THEIR FOOD. And this is the crux of the issue. The fans love that, but if you eat a ton before going into the game with food you brought and you drink your alcohol before entering - how much money does the team make? The teams are running the league to make money and if tickets, parking, and concessions are all ways to make money and in Orchard Park you have private lots and huge tailgating parties - you are eliminating 2 out of the 3 ways to make a profit. So whatever happens with the stadium - current 60,000 open air in OP - the team has to he looking at ways to shift that money you spend outside to into the stadium concessions and parking to claw money back. My guess would be to see parking passes as part of the tickets/PSLs - therefore they are getting paid for parking whether you want to park in their lots or not. I would also expect them to adjust parking hours - keeping people out of the lots a bit longer to limit the amount of time people have to cook or drink and closing the lots earlier for the same reason. I would also expect better control on parking spaces to again limit the tailgating ability. I would then increase the concession area intake by having a “party zone” on the way in with local private vendors paying a fee and you have food and drink set-up along the walk in, with merchandise, and fun “kids” things to do. Those become the areas to grab the extra dollars that are right now going to private lots and people eating and drinking their own food. This will tick some people off - along with new price points and PSLs - so you reduce the number of tickets to keep demand high.