transplantbillsfan

Ummm... what?

A Franchise QB and better than Taylor? Duuuuuuuuhhhhhh!!!!!! No one would pick Taylor over Rodgers. But if your "Yes he is" was that Rodgers is good at 4th Quarter comebacks, then you must think Taylor is, too

This isn't about comparing with Rodgers. Some seem to have "4th quarter comebacks" as THE criteria for being a Franchise QB and actually think Rodgers is good at that. He's not.

19-141 career starts is 13.5%. Guess what 5-37 career starts is?

12 in 141 starts (8.5% of all starts) vs 3 in 37 starts (8.1% of all starts). Way to cherry pick

Rodgers isn't a Franchise QB by your definition since, over his career, he's not good leading his team to a W when behind in the 4th Quarter.

Riiiiiiiiight. I'm the one being obtuse. I respond to a direct quote from you saying "When taylor has 3rd and 7 I'm already hitting the bathroom to beat the crowds before the punt." with facts. I assume you meant you go to the bathroom on those 3rd and longs because you have no faith Taylor will convert, not because you have severe bladder problems. Is that fair or am I being obtuse? Well, if you're going, you're misleading yourself: Taylor has faced the 2nd most 3rd and longs in the entire NFL at 43. Taylor has converted the 4th most 3rd and longs in the entire NFL at 14. Taylor has the 10th highest 3rd and long conversion % in the entire NFL. I'm sorry if you think I'm being deliberately obtuse. Pretty clear I wasn't, just droppin knowledge on ya bro

Sooooo... you missed a lot of first downs I guess? Taylor has the 8th highest 3rd down conversion % on passing plays in the NFL. Oh, and he has the 10th highest 3rd down % on 3rd and long (8+ yards) despite having faced the 2nd most 3rd and longs in the NFL. http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/leaders.asp?range=NFL&rank=047&type=Passing&year= And Taylor is tied for 13th in the NFL in 25+ yard passing plays despite having less attempts than almost all guys ahead of him. Do you just enjoy making crap up?

Yeah, great point Thurm! Thanks for that tendency! We're just gonna note that tendency while we take a nap in the deep middle as you pick us apart on that intermediate middle area we're so so obviously prepared to defend oh wait, Tyrod is throwing to the intermediate middle about as much as Russell Wilson who's, like, a really good QB. And not only that, but his passer rating to that intermediate middle is more than 20 points above the league average. Throwing to the intermediate middle AND successful doing it?!?!?! Well, surely with this tendency we've got those sidelines locked down. Oh crap, that doesn't work either. Taylor's passer rating to the left sideline is nearly 60 points higher than the league average on deep throws and 70 points higher on intermediate throws. If we knew he was so great to the left sideline, by your logic Thurm, we're gleefully lurking over there to defend it. Except that's not reality. Little of what you say is, but let's evidently keep this discussion you're clearly wrong on up for another year and a half just because you're incapable of admitting you're wrong.

So why do you even come in the Taylor threads? Does this place mean that much to you that you even have to post in threads you don't actually want to discuss anymore?

Nah, I'm here less than a lot of posters who seem to just be here for quips and one liners as you, jmc and Shady are doing right on cue in a series of posts irrelevant to the topic in the thread. But when I do come here, I like a serious and substantive discussion. If that's bad, I'm sorry. You're apparently reading what I wrote as some kind of meltdown. It's not. It's part of a year and a half of logical fallacies by Thurm. All good, brah. Surf's more important, and now that I'm done with my coffee, that's where I'm headed

Like I thought you would, you cling to a false argument. Too bad you don't read because all these arguments have been addressed and debunked. I'll just copy and paste some stuff. Brady is the highest of highs... and even he doesn't crack 5% of all of his throws to the deep middle of the field. Yeah, Brady's thrown to the deep middle 14 more times than Taylor on 100 more charted attempts. How about Rivers who's thrown to the deep middle just 5 more times than Taylor on 77 more charted attempts? Or Cousins who's thrown to the deep middle just 4 more times than Taylor on 59 more charted attempts? Or Dak who's thrown to the deep middle just 3 more times than Taylor on 50 more charted attempts? It's idiotic that you really believe there's really some significant difference between 1/209, 6/286, 5/268, or 4/259. I already know the intermediate middle third was a problem for Taylor, you'll notice I even directly stated that and said you and I would never have this issue if you stocked just that. Yes, intermediate middle third was a problem for Taylor. It really isn't much of one anymore. Your problem is that you lump the deep middle third in there. And now I think it's kind of funny that it's like you're letting the deep middle third ride on the back of the intermediate middle third just because it's convenient for you. Section122 had a great response to this play on language you're doing here on page 24 and I'm just gonna copy and paste it: I like how you used the English language there. Very impressive. By saying double, quadruple, etc.. you make it seem like a huge difference. Instead of saying 3, 4, 5, 8, 9, or even at most 14 more throws you used the multiplier which makes the difference seem much greater than it is. Then you picked the most extreme example of 4.8 to .5 nicely ignoring that 3 of the guys are within 1.5% and even your extreme outlier is only 4.3% more. Then you pull 1/20 or 1/200. 4.3% better odds would be the difference between 1/20 or 1.86/20. I'll put it to you another way. Your "vast difference" between .5% and 4.8% means that Taylor would need to have attempted 12 total throws to be at 5%. So 11 more throws over his 236 attempts would make him the leader in the category. As Transplant pointed out though it isn't a throw qbs make often as 11 total throws would be more than everyone on your list save for Brady. The likely GOAT QB throwing to the likely GOAT TE. Shocker that they throw that more than anyone else in the league..." Except that the notification distinguishes between the 2. It says "reacted to," not "quoted you" in your notifications. So... there's that

Interesting. I got a notification that Thurm responded to me an hour ago. I came here eager to read what he'd respond with. I expected some futile attempt to argue against facts. I hoped he'd just admit he's been mistaken for the last year and a half. Instead, I find no post. I can only guess Thurm typed up a response arguing against Truth, but realized facts are hard to argue with so rather than admitting he was mistaken, he's hiding somewhere. Well, thanks to the new format of the board, even deleted posts remain in notifications they're responding to. So Thurm, I see you and I accept this as you finally admitting you were wrong about this whole deep middle third thing

So you're saying Taylor's still our starter in 2018? Interesting... was that a slip? You certainly seem like a poster who thinks he's about to be replaced

Actually, yes, Thurman#1 has been arguing everything I countered in my posts. You're want to start taking a tangent off that point and start arguing, which is what you're clearly doing? Fine, we can do that. But yes, Thurman#1 has been arguing that deep middle third crap for the last year and a half and gets proven wrong time and time and time again. With these Next Gen Stats, it's pretty definitive. Now, you want to talk about your tangent and have a separate discussion from the point Thurm was making and the point I was proving just factually incorrect? Sure, one or two 20+ yard passes down the field could be the difference between 7-1 and 5-3. But then maybe Kirk Cousins's 5 additional turnovers, Philip Rivers's 4 additional turnovers or Dak Prescott's 1 additional turnover are significantly more detrimental in their weight than Taylor's 4, 5, or 3 passes (respectively) to the deep middle than those guys Well then why do you say anything negative about Taylor when the team wins? I mean, you say a crapload of negative stuff about Taylor, win or lose. Why would you do that if he's meeting your benchmark?

All right, bro. Keep trolling. Clearly that's what you're doing. Have your fun. Argue just to argue. I'd love it if that's all Thurm was doing, but he delusionally believes there's really some significant difference between 1/209, 6/286, 5/268, or 4/259. There's not. Brady is the highest end example I could find of throwing to the deep middle and he doesn't even hit 5% of all his throws. Brady as a benchmark that needs to be met is sheer lunacy.

So you go with Brady for comparison's sake? Brady is the highest of highs... and even he doesn't crack 5% of all of his throws to the deep middle of the field. Yeah, Brady's thrown to the deep middle 14 more times than Taylor on 100 more charted attempts. How about Rivers who's thrown to the deep middle just 5 more times than Taylor on 77 more charted attempts? Or Cousins who's thrown to the deep middle just 4 more times than Taylor on 59 more charted attempts? Or Dak who's thrown to the deep middle just 3 more times than Taylor on 50 more charted attempts? This is just pathetic. I know you disagree with me a lot as a poster so you see my username and, like Pavlov's dog, you're conditioned to disagree. But try taking a moment and accepting reality: NFL QBs overwhelmingly rarely go to the deep middle!!!

Honestly, 3 posts in one page you talk about people beating a dead horse and yet you persist in the very same thread. If posting stats proves nothing, what exactly will prove something? Or even start to prove something? The EYE TEST from ShadyBillsFan? I get that this discussion is stale, but it persists in many ways because of absolute stubbornness. And that stubbornness exists on both sides. But if you're so sick of the conversation, rather than just saying "this conversation is pointless!!!" 3 times on the same page, why not exit a conversation that's gone 25 pages where some evidently feel it's a worthwhile conversation to have

Cut the crap with the deep middle obsession, Thurm. Go look at the passing charts over at NFL Next Gen stats. Anyone can easily see the REALITY that NFL QBs rarely throw to your deep middle 1/3rd of the field. According to NFL Next Gen Stats... Attempts to the DEEP MIDDLE THIRD OF THE FIELD (20+ yards) Tom Brady- 15 out of 309 attempts or 4.8% of his attempts https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/tom-brady/BRA371156/season Russell Wilson- 10 out of 303 attempts or 3.3% of his attempts https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/russell-wilson/WIL777781/season Dak Prescott- 4 out of 259 attempts or 1.5%% of his attempts https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/dak-prescott/PRE285723/season Alex Smith- 9 out of 293 attempts or 3% of his attempts https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/alex-smith/SMI031126/season Big Ben- 11 out of 275 attempts or 4% of his attempts https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/ben-roethlisberger/ROE750381/season Carson Wentz- 10 out of 291 attempts or 3.4% of his attempts https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/carson-wentz/WEN615770/season Kirk Cousins- 5 out of 268 attempts or 1.9% of his attempts https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/kirk-cousins/COU709400/season Philip Rivers-6 out of 286 attempts or 2% of his attempts https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/philip-rivers/RIV651634/season Now, Tyrod has 1 attempt to the deep middle of the field, according to Next Gen Stats, but for some weird reason, whereas all the above QBs have every single game they played charted, Taylor only has 7/8. I don't know why, but they've excluded the Raiders game. That mean's Taylor's percentage of total passes to the deep middle is 0.5%. https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/tyrod-taylor/TAY764868/season QBs very very rarely throw to the deep middle third that you're so obsessed with talking about. It's an irrelevant discussion that you keep bringing up. No one cares about the deep middle. This idea that good QBs have an almost exactly even division of throws between 1/3rds of the field is utter crap. QBs throw where they're most comfortable. They don't throw everywhere equally and indiscriminately. Stop making stuff up just because it suits your argument. Maybe in the fantasy world you live in QBs divide their deep throws evenly. Reality is this for at least 2 QBs people would consider "great" Tom Brady https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/tom-brady/BRA371156/season Deep (20+ yard) attempts- 44 Attempts to left- 43% of deep throws Attempts to middle- 34% of deep throws Attempts to right- 23% of deep throws Looks like Brady better get crackin on those throws to the right Russell Wilson https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts/player/russell-wilson/WIL777781/season Deep (20+ yard) attempts- 44 Attempts to left- 48% of deep throws Attempts to middle- 24% of deep throws Attempts to right- 28% of deep throws QBs don't divide their throws to the deep portion of the field, at all. If anything, they favor the left side of the field, which is pretty interesting because when you look at Taylor's charts, he favors the right. But all QBs favor different areas of the field and none divide evenly or really even close to evenly considering there's a 20% difference between the GOAT and Wilson in terms of "most favored" and "least favored." Now, that said, the intermediate middle HAS always been an area of concern, and (once again), when you look at Next Gen Stats, Taylor has SERIOUSLY improved on those intermediate middle throws. In another thread, I pointed out that Taylor was 13/16 with 2 TDs and 0 INTs to the intermediate middle portion of the field. That's 7.7% of all his passes in those 7 games charted to the intermediate middle of the field. For comparison, Russell Wilson is 16/25 (8.3% of his 2017 passes) with 2 TDs and 1 Interception. So, yeah, the intermediate middle of the field was a concern for Taylor in 2015, but he seemed to improve a bit in 2016 and even more in 2017. No need to peddle this deep middle thing that's never been part of a legitimate discussion about the intermediate middle. Glad I could help

No ****. So again... what was your point?

Scrambles = positive Sacks = negative What's your point exactly?

Not a Bills fan, eh?

I think this is interesting, because this is what I always used to love. Sunday was NFL day. I loved wasting my day watching football games. I think part of this is just the direction of the world with smartphones and apps and cord cutting and the immediacy of everything destroying patience. The NFL's biggest problem, in my opinion, is that it hasn't found its way into the "cord cutting market." And I'm a guy who still has cable, but truthfully, it's only for sports, particularly the NFL.

Well, you're prepared to criticize him for everything. He's probably responsible for world hunger!!!

Wow. Dumb post. Boo!