Ozymandius

Unfortunatley if the Bills have a good year, they'll have a top 5 pick.

Yeah, Gibson was a former first round draft pick of the Lions who ate himself out of the league. Here's a draft scouting report: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/...ayers/3801.html

If you re-read what I wrote, you'll find that I wasn't being critical of Marv at all and was offering an explanation as to why the announcement came a bit later than what you might hope for.

Good for Marv. But it took long enough for him to release this statement that skeptics will say Losman DID get shopped around but nobody was biting. The most likely explanation for the delay, though, is that Marv probably doesn't have enough time to surf internet message boards, which is where this rumor really was fueled. He probably didn't realize how rampant the rumor had gotten until just recently.

The lines, people. Gotta work the lines. 1. OT (perhaps trade down for Marcus McNeill, if his back checks out) 2. DT (gotta find an "over tackle" to go with Triplett) 3. DE (Chicago may have matched us on the signing of what's-his-face, but we're still looking to replace the white, high-motor LDEs we have) 3. OG 4. OG 5. DT 5. WR or QB 6. DT 7. OT 7. CB

Since the dispute was between the 4th and the 5th, I don't see how the Bills are going to end up with a 3rd unless Marv performed sexual favors.

Not really. It's not a concern with everyone. There are plenty of guys who keep themselves in tip-top shape, play hard every play, and have healthy knees.

Marv or anyone associated with the Bills has NEVER said that Ngata won't fit the Cover 2. It's all BS overanalysis from the fans. His true concerns continue to be his weight, his motor, and his rebuilt knee. I personally don't want to draft Ngata at #8 because I don't like forking over millions to a guy with weight/motor question marks--can you really trust him to not get fat and play hard every play and develop himself into a great player through intense film study and practice and working overtime once he's a set-for-life millionaire ?

All college players are unproven, no? Justice and McNeill both showed the potential to be elite offensive tackles in college, and if the Bills draft either one of them, it will be a good pick.

Do you really expect me to spend the time to break that down for you? Look at the NFL rosters--I'm sure you can figure out for yourself whom I would take over Gandy. There are two things Gandy can't do, single-team against the elite pass rushers, and overpower someone in the running game. There are at least two tackles that will be available in this draft that can do those things in Justice and McNeill. If the Bills find a way to add either of those guys to this roster, they would've made a good move. I don't know how arguable that is.

If you're going to go by the "first year" logic, then you might as well not draft anybody since 95% of rookies won't make an impact right away. Gandy is in the bottom half of NFL left tackles and if he can be upgraded, it would be prudent to do so. The NFL is about matchups and creating double teams from the opponents and single-teaming for your own team when possible, and if the Bills can get someone in at LT that can eliminate the rush without double team help, then that frees up a player on offense to do something else, which is huge. Players that can create double teams from the opponents, and players that can do their jobs without help, are valuable in this league. Yes, the rest of the line besides Peters is a mess, and I do expect several offensive linemen to be picked in this draft, but an OT absolutely can be used as well.

You can argue that DT is our biggest need but I don't see why we necessarily need to address it in the first round. At some point, risk management has to come into play. In the past 15 years or so, top 10 DT busts include Johnathan Sullivan, Ryan Sims, Gerard Warren, Darrell Russell, Dan Wilkinson, Steve Emtman, and Sean Gilbert. Ngata is just too big of a risk given the reasons I've outlined in this thread.

TEs are used marginally in many NFL Os because most teams don't have the stud talent at that position to take advantage of. Teams that have the stud there tend to throw lots of passes to their TE and score lots of points. You're also being too kind to say that the TE position is occupied well on this roster.

Well, it was always silly to project MW to LT because he didn't have the mobility because he was so fat. Justice projects much better.

Which would rather have, that win over Cincinnati, or Nate Clements? We could've had Dabrick, but nooooo, we have to beat the Bungles and now we have to go trade Nate to get him. Assuming the rumor is true, which it probably isn't.

Well, the technique will still be different when he transitions over to the left side and there definitely will be an adjustment period. However, when you have a great athlete like him, the transition should be manageable. He has the feet, arms, and frame to be a left tackle.

Mike Williams was a fat guy that many people predicted would fail in the NFL, including myself. Winston Justice is in shape, has more overall talent, and was coached by a great offensive line coach at USC. This really isn't the case of an OT shooting up the draft boards; Winston Justice has always been held in high regard. If anything, it is the opposite. He's a top 10 talent who has seen his stock underrated because of off the field issues. To answer your question, though, he played RT in college but has the athleticism, long arms, and feet to play LT.

The reason you are wrong and the reason trading Moulds is a good idea is because the Bills are going to suck for the next two years. We are building for the future and even if Eric is still good today, he won't be in two years, or at the very least he's not in the future plans. Let's get a 4th rounder for him, which in a deep draft, can hopefully be a starter on what we hope to be a contender in three years.

I believe Winston Justice is the player Marv is targetting and I don't terribly mind that at all. The history of offensive tackles who are in shape and picked in the top 10 becoming quality players is pretty good. Justice actually has more upside than Ferguson because he's just as great of an athlete on a bigger frame. Justice's negatives are his off the field issues, including soliciting a prostitute, and also brandishing a pellet gun in front of a fellow student. His maturity is a question mark and that makes him a risk because you don't know how he will handle getting millions. That's why Ngata is a risk as well -- you don't know whether he'll stay in shape and work hard every play after he receives millions, given that he had a rep for taking plays off in college before he was rich. The reason I think Marv is targetting Winston Justice is simple. He fits the context of the other offseason moves we've made. Craig Nall, for example--he's Marv's boy and I believe the one that Marv and Jauron are rooting for to win the QB job. Nall is a pure pocket passer without much mobility. We need a huge upgrade in our pass blocking if he's going to have success. Also, we signed Andre Davis, who is a pure deep threat. This is in addition to already having deep threats Lee Evans and Roscoe Parrish on our roster. Do you think our coaching staff is planning on a downfield passing game? Yeah, just a bit. Well, we ain't gonna have one unless the QB gets time to throw. Taken together, I believe these moves indicate that the Bills' top priority is improving our pass protection and overall offensive line play. We're not going to get DaBrick, so... Winston Justice is our prime target. I don't buy that Marv will be scared off by Justice's off the field incidents. Remember, Marv got his butt kicked twice in the Super Bowl by a Dallas team full of poor-character guys. He, of all people, understands that you can win and win big with troubled talent. In the end, I doubt Justice will need to pay for sex after he becomes a millionaire, and I don't think the pellet gun incident will foreshadow violent crimes in his future. I think he's our boy. A phenomenal athlete at offensive tackle who can dominate in both pass blocking and run blocking. I'd be excited if he's the pick.

Agreed. Mario Williams is the best player in this draft.

DT is a great need but the Bills have other great needs as well on the OL and at safety, TE, and I'd even argue at LDE. It's about risk management and evaluating past trends, something I hope a well-educated man like Marv can understand. It's really my only hope with him. Ngata is a bigger risk than Vernon Davis, who by all accounts has a tremendous work ethic in place.

This is a very good point. Another aspect of Ngata is that there are very few scouting reports on him that don't mention that he tends to take plays off and obviously he carries more than ideal weight (although he is very strong as well). Even his own defensive coach at Oregon has made comments to the effect that IF he turns it on, IF he doesn't get fat, then he can be great. Well, you know what? For a player with those kinds of question marks, you do not fork over a multi-million dollar contract. Think about all the Bills fans you know who are somewhat lazy and overweight (and there should be many). Would you trust any of them to continue to work hard if they win the lottery? To put it another way, name me ONE past player that fits Ngata's talents and body type that ended up dominating for the team that drafted him. Ted Washington was drafted by SF but dominated for Buffalo. Grady Jackson did most of his domination after he left Oakland and joined the Packers. Who else? Not Dan Wilkinson. Don't forget Ngata hasn't always been healthy as well. It's just not worth the risk.

If the OL and DL don't concern you, then you need to follow another sport because you sure as heck don't know anything about football. Yes, the Bills probably lack some "playmakers" as well, but you should build a football team inside out. That was the mistake Donahoe made by not following that plan, and I hope Marv doesn't continue that trend.

Great thread, and I agree 100%. Draft the best player available (within reason). Duh. I think the trap that a lot of Bills fans are falling into is trying to shore up ALL our weaknesses in one offseason. That's just not going to happen. Let's just get as many good players as we can and realize that it's going to take two offseasons at least to turn this team into a contender. In case anyone hasn't noticed, we're in full rebuilding mode. So if freaking Vernon Davis is available at #8, we sure as heck better draft him over Ngata. Need, schmeed. You take the player that has more superstar potential, and if we have to wait until next year to shore up the DT problem, then so be it. Oh, by the way, I hear you can get good DTs in the second round and on as well. Please don't draft Haloti Ngata at #8. Take Vernon. Please.

We hired Dick Jauron as our coach! April Fools!!!! Wait.... Sh-t!