maryland-bills-fan

Yes, what I've seen agrees with that. I don't follow the college game that closely, so I don't have any sleepers myself. I wonder a little, if this years hype is a little bit of a new cottage industry for sports reporters and maybe there isn't as much quality there as is being said. Is there a top 2 or 3 or 6? ( https://www.si.com/nfl/2018/04/11/best-quarterback-nfl-draft-darnold-rosen-allen-mayfield-themmqb-newsletter )

About 25% of the Bills running yards came from the QB. That is not a healthy number. Also some of Shady's best runs were to get 3 yards by avoiding a LB in the backfield and making something out of nothing. We can also argue whether it was because TT was unable to see receivers and took off after 3 minutes standing in the pocket or was it because he was running for his life and took off. Other teams figured that TT was not going to hurt them with is arm and put a spy on him and went for containment rather than stuffing plays. That gets you cheap yards but leads to stalled scoring drives. Running QB's get hurt. Single wing tailbacks get hurt. ......... I don't think the Bills line was as good as the numbers suggest- and certainly will not be for a non-running QB.

The trolls are out in full force tonight. Is there a full moon? (can't find picture)

How do you "grap a solid OL" and WR in the first two rounds. If Baker or whoever falls to #12, that leaves you with 3 picks to get a solid LG, C, RG, OT and WR. How is there going to be anything other than a 3rd string guy available after FA cuts? Now you are also going to have street FA's playing two linebacker positions and no nickle back or solid backup at DB. AND that would mean many rookies and a 100% hit rate. There are too many "home runs" in that plan.

Look at my post about the great Bills golden year offensive lines. I added up the "draft value points" needed to build those lines that helped the team/QB/RB (oj) look so good. We have about a tenth of that invested in our present o-line. We are far away from being there. Think of the offense as a couple of numbers multiplied together. ( QB ) x (o-line) x (skill players wr/rb/te)= your offense. If QB is 3.5, but the o-line is 0.25..... you don't have much.

Yes, I agree. They were very good but I wouldn't try too hard to say they were the best ever. They did work well with Kelly and let him do his thing with TT and company. Not quite good enough to get over the hump with several great teams from the national conference but they sure dominated the american conference. What flabbergasts me is that it took a lot of work to build and maintain those great o-lines. They were absolutely vital and integral to the success of the QB that used them to make the WR and RB into stars on those offenses... You gotta have all three elements for an offense- the o-line, the skill players and the QB. I wonder how many great HoF QB's are missing from the history of the NFL because they lacked the other 2 elements they needed. Our current crop of TBD trolls only see the QB and not the foundation. They get brain-dead when they are told about great QB's that never were very successful and some of the reasons why.

"........First, it was Eric Wood retiring. Now Richie Incognito. Seven free agents have left for other teams, including starting middle linebacker Preston Brown, with no apparent successor in his place yet on the roster. There are certainly question marks hanging over Zay Jones’ head after his bizarre incident in Los Angeles. ......." So run in the other direction??? How about a plan where we build a team and then bring in a good QB? Why not trade a high 2nd from this year for a 1st for next year and trade a low 1st from this year for a high first for next year. Invest the results from those into the next years draft (supposed to have some really good QB's) and get the guy then. In the meantime put draft capital into long-lived meat-and-potatoe linemen and linebackers and improve the quality of tools Does one of the three give you success? What if you do the first but can't do anything (5% success) on the other two? What does that give you. I like rainbows and pixey dust too, but you can't do all three at the same time starting where we are at.

So you sell this year's draft and next years to draft a QB who might be a bust 50% of the time. He makes everyone look so good that 4th string o-linemen become pro bowlers and your next 3 years of 9 top 3 round picks all become pro-bowlers. 2 guys signed as long-snappers as UFA become the same guys as Paup, Biscuit and Talley. THAT IS THE PLAN. ...... geesh. You know,, I see a LOT of guys who were decent starters being shown the door with no effort to keep them around for a while. Some guys who were aging but still good starters deciding they have had enough. No trouble making these trades or releasing them to get snatched up by the pasties and others. Hogan is a starting WR for the SB runner up. Hmmmmmmm what is not adding up here? How many ex-Bills were in the playoffs or the SB ? Is the plan to tank for 3 years? It is late at night. I just got back from a blown 1-2 Orioles loss on a cold night. Is darkness creeping in?

Gee, why does anyone draft them in the first 3 rounds. They must not be very smart. Remember the good Bills teams used a lot of high draft picks on the o-line. I have a thread somewhere, about the Bills o-line cost in the glory years. The QBatAnycost trolls didn't like it.

You can get great guards in the lower half of the 1st and good guards in the second round.

Funny thing. Our two best offensive linemen decided to quit football this off season. The only two guys who were in the pro bowl. Both were sort of funny retirements- Woods is still on the roster. Also a bunch of former lead players (Darius, Watkins, Glenn, Darby, Brown....) got traded. Yea, the Patriots have a model of selling-high on trading players with good rep's a year early rather than a year late. I get that. But two funny retirements from guys who played next to each other for a couple of years.....?

How about keeping next year's #1 and trading one of this year's #2 for a #1 next year. Go for the QB next year. (we would have two #1's) OR Trade #22 to a high drafting team this year for their 1st and 2nd (3rd) next year. (We would have one high and one medium high #1). OR start the Pat's method of drafting a 2nd/3rd round QB every year and look for a Garro or Brady.?

Or outside the tackles. Or having the QB get beyond the "chuck and duck" 2 yard out pattern.

But the Jets were already drafting at #6 and just traded that and two #2's to move up. They are not trading two #1's, two #2's and /or next years first day pick.

It feeds the trolls

No. If the trade away both 1st and both 2nds they will put a terrible product on the field next year. With a poor offensive line, the QB will be running for his life, the RB will be getting stuffed in the backfield and it will be 3 downs with negative yardage and a punt. With 3rd team linebackers the other team will march down the field and have subs in the game in the second half. It will be a terrible product on the field. The fans who pay money to enjoy a football game will wander away and find other things to do. They will not be thrilled to see God's best rookie QB on the sideline with a clipboard. They will not be thrilled to see the team treading water for the next 5 years while slowly sinking. Are the fans sick of losing seasons now? Wait until they see 4 more years with "hope in the future coming". Okay, you can then root for the San Diego VAQUERO's in the future.

..but we need two guards, a center, two linebackers, a wide receiver, and by the time we get those things we will need a defensive back and a running back. I think you do NOT want to wind up with a good looking QB and fatal holes in the roster.

Thank you. The QB is very important. You have to give him weapons to use. In those good years, the Bills continually built by using 1st and 2nd round picks for linemen.

The success rate for a the high first round is about 50%. Even if that were successful, we would have a crap offensive line, need two starting linebackers and one or two quality wide receivers.

Yes it is serious. There is a brand of posters here who say that all we need is a QB and we can say that we are in competition for a super bowl. We didn't win in those years just because of a QB. If we draft around #16, it would take two years of using the 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks to spend up to getting such offensive lines. (If you are lucky). Maybe you might want to draft somebody like Biscuit or Talley or Paup along the way for the defense. A couple of defensive backs to cycle in and some good target wide receivers? Sounds like a 10-12 first day draft picks?

Brave man.

I think I agree with the spirit of that.

I think we needed serious help at O-line, linebacker and even wide receiver. The people who were ignoring the needs there in a desire to move up regardless of cost are not going to change their mind. I think we can still trade both our first round picks this year and both our second round picks and a third and get one of the top 5 QB's. We then would have another shot at the top QB next year, and the year after.

Well our offensive line and wider receiver core looks like it needs a rebuild, so they could rebuild those around the new QB.

How does the Bills o-line stack up against those of previous glory years? I think there were 3 previous periods when the Bills were good. The first was I the old AFL days but that is hard to evaluate since there were two leagues that for many years (until Broadway Joe) not evenly matched. The other two were the “Electric company” years and the K-gun years. There are a range (and I mean a range) of opinions as to how the Bills should proceed in this year's draft and the run from “Trade this and next year's draft for sure-thing QB X” (etc), through, trade up a little maybe, to “work on a foundation and draft QB in the 2nd or 3rd round. You might wonder how much in the way of higher draft picks those good Bills teams spent on their offensive line. Different eras, different styles of play were involved but where the players were drafted and how dominate they were compared to their peers gives an indication. Here is some rough information. ================================================= The Electric Company. Position............player........,,,,,,,....draft pick............pro bowls. OT....................Foley,...................1st (#26)..............1 OG..................McKenzie.............2nd (#27)...............1 C......................Montler.................2nd (#32).............0 OG.................DeLamielleure.........1st (#26)..............6 OT...................Green......................5th (107)............0 TE....................Seymour................1st (#7)...............0 A few comments. The pro bowl is a bit of a popularity contest and some great players were shut out by some of the all time greats. Seymour was drafted as an offensive tackle but played TE and as a 6th O-lineman helped block for OJ. …. Okay, a summary 5of 6 drafted in the first two rounds cost was 3360 total “draft points” 8 pro bowl spots ============================================== 1992 Bills Position............player........,,,,,,,....draft pick............pro bowls. OT...............Wolford …...............1st (#20)..................3 OG..............Richert.......................1st (#16)..................2 C..................Hull........................... ..??.........................3 OG..............Parker........................3rd (#69)..................0 OT …...........Ballard.....................11th (283).................2 TE...............McKeller....................9th (227)..................0 A few comments: Hull came over from the Generals where he signed before the 1983 NFL draft. McKeller only played one year of college football and was a basketball player who was a good receiver in the “K” gun offence. 2 of 6 (more like 3 if Hull included) drafted in the first two rounds cost was 2065 points not including Hull 10 pro bowl spots. ================================================== == 1995 Bills Position............player........,,,,,,,....draft pick............pro bowls. OT.............Fina..........................1st (#27).....................0 OG............Brown......................1st (14th).....................8 pro bowls ! C..................Hull........................... ..??.........................3 OG..............Ostroski.................10th (271)....................0 OT …..........Parker.....................3rd (60)........................0 TE................Johnson.................2nd (61)......................0 3 of 6 ( 4 if Hull included) drafted in the first 2 rounds cost was 2372 not counting Hull 11 pro bowls spots 2018 Bills (as of 4/9/18) Position............player........,,,,,,,....draft pick............pro bowls. OT............Dawkins.......................2nd (#63)...................0 OG............Incognito....................3rd (#81)....................4 C …...........Gray.............................UFA.. ........................0 …..............Boline.........................4th (#111)..................0 OG............Ducasse......................2nd (#61)...................0 OT............Mills............................5th (#163)..................0 TE............Clan............................6th (#174)..................0 2 of 6 in the 1st 2 rounds 412 cost 4 pro bowl spots ========================================= 2018 Bills (as of 4/10/18) If Incognito actually has retired Position............player........,,,,,,,....draft pick............pro bowls. OT............Dawkins.......................2nd (#63)...................0 OG …...........Gray.............................UFA.. ........................0 C...............Boline.........................4th (#111)..................0 OG............Ducasse......................2nd (#61)...................0 OT............Mills............................5th (#163)..................0 TE............Clan............................6th (#174)..................0 2 of 6 in the 1st 2 rounds 227 cost 0 pro bowl spots So if you want to give Ken Hull a rating of middle the 2nd round (420 points)?? these would come out as Electric Company..........3360 1992 Bills.....................2465 1995 Bills.....................2792 2018 Bills......................412 or 227 Okay, you can find o-line gems in the lower rounds. BUT, I really think we have to pay serious attention to the o-line before we are back in the big time