Chuck Wagon

Allen is from a tiny farm town in rural California. He had to go the Juco route because no one scouted him in high school. I give Baker props for walking on and making it, though he quit on Texas Tech when someone threatened his standing. I never said pick Allen. Just saying why a team will.

Right? If Baker was at Wyoming he would be "the guy who kind of plays like Manziel, got arrested and did some other dumb stuff" Day 2-3 pick.

You just called him Rob Johnson / JP Losman / EJ Manuel

If Allen played at Oklahoma with their talent and Lincoln Riley I think he is likely the #1 pick in this draft, while Baker at Wyoming with their talent is likely a borderline 1st round pick, if that.

Allen makes me nervous, I certain have Rosen and Darnold over him, but man, if he's good there's going to be A LOT of crow served up.

I agree. Not the place. Just seeing some similarities. I don't know what to tell you. Smarter football minds than you like Allen more than Baker.

Allen is the more justifiable prospect. "I took a chance on the 6'4" guy with a rocket arm" sells a lot better in NFL circles than "I took a chance on the 6'0" guy from the Big 12". Could not agree more. There's always drama with Baker, which will scare teams away. And I completely agree about putting him in the right scheme. For fans who watched Baker win the Heisman at the center of the college landscape, I get having difficulty putting him above the guy who played in Wyoming and never appeared on TV, but NFL personnel and scouts are drooling over Allen (not to mention Darnold & Rosen) and are terrified of Baker.

I agree with you on Baker sliding. I think A LOT of teams have him as 4th on their board and he's probably a lot closer to Jackson than the guy who is 3rd on a lot of teams boards. Teams like measurables, it potentially cost Brees and Wilson entire rounds on their draft standing. Things have changed a bit since then, but the measurables of the QBs taken a the top of the draft haven't. I think teams, especially with high picks, are going to default to a 6'4" guy if the evaluation is anywhere close.

Why do I have a feeling a lot of the posters who like Baker more than Rosen have a shared political affiliation.

I didn't say "get sacks". Quick pressure up the middle forces the QB to get rid of the ball quickly. A lot of offenses are predicated on timing and getting the ball out. Penetration up the middle through DT is how you knock that timing off. You don't build a defensive line in 2018 by putting two block eating "run stoppers" together at DT, bottom line.

It's not 1998. You need to get pressure on the QB up the middle. Two fat run stuffers at DT would let the secondary get picked apart.

No he wouldn't. They are very similar players. Need to put a guy who can penetrate next to Star.

FA has really shifted and quickly. It wasn't that long ago guys would be visiting with players on midnight of FA and FAs (especially big time ones) always did visits, usually waiting a few days into the start of FA to make their choice and teams wanting to talk in person with them to make sure it's a good fit. Now it's just a huge cash flush, with agents doing the legwork before FA even starts and teams needing to commit monetarily before they can even have the guy in the building.

Suh That would set us up to have a very talented and deep front line. I would be ok with dumpster diving / later draft picks on linebackers. I'd like to see Eifert / Brice Butler, but otherwise the pass catchers are rather uninspiring. If we are spending <$10 mil on our QB depth chart between Rookie / McCarron / Peterman, I want to put the money on the lines, Suh being the only real difference maker out there.

Yes. I think Allen / Darnold / Rosen are above him.

I hate to burst your bubble, but I think Mayfield is 4th on our QB list (maybe even 5th with Jackson).

Yea, you can just say "Cle - QB / need to move up to 2 or 3 for Bills QB / Broncos QB / Jets QB" But my point is largely, if the Colts or Giants aren't taking QB and they have Barkley / Nelson / Fitzpatrick / Chubb with similar grades while being OK with BPA, they likely could trade down with us for several picks, then give a little bit back to go back up to the 7/8 spot and get a similar level player they were looking at with 2/3.

It's pretty clear the Browns choices are Darnold or Allen. I'd have to believe it'll be Darnold, but you just never know. I think we'll trade up with NYG to #2. 1) Cle - Darnold 2) Buf - Rosen (admittedly personal preference, could be Allen) 3) Indy - Barkley 4) Cle - Likely Fitzpatrick could be Chubb 5) Den - Mayfield or Allen or Rosen 6) NYJ - Mayfield or Allen or Rosen 7) TB - likely whoever between Chubb / Fitzpatrick 8) Here's where I could see the Giants coming back up from 12 to get Nelson (or Chubb / Fitzpatrick if Nelson is gone) Basically the Giants can get #12 / #22 / #56 / #65 from us for #2, then use #12 / ~#66 to get one of the guys they are likely considering at 2 (if they aren't going QB) in the 7-9 range.

Come on. It's one thing to use PFF, they have their warts but is largely respected. Fansided? Get out.

The price has been exorbitant on WRs so far. Would like to see them take a chance on Eifert but it would have to be a very friendly deal. I also like Brice Butler as a guy who can add a different element to our WRs.

The trade was agreed to, the Browns botched it by not sending the fax in time. It's been covered extensively.

4.38 40

Terrelle Pryor Mike Wallace Brice Butler

2 years of McCarron for the same price as 1 year of Tyrod. Plus pick #65.