Chuck Wagon

Not if he's a franchise QB and more importantly not if the Pats believe he's a franchise QB. If they are convinced he's their guy for the next 15 years 12 is a steal, for the Browns.

I think there's a fair amount of people who aren't thrilled when someone creates a new thread just to drive traffic to their website.

Baseball was WAY better when everyone was on steroids. I also believe many more NBA and NFL players than people would suspect are on HGH already.

This exactly. Unless the Browns blow you away (#12 this year and their first next year) if the Pats are sold on the guy they have plenty of avenues to keep him. He's dirt cheap this year still and a lot can happen in a year, especially with a 40 year old Brady. Even if everything plays out perfectly this year they have plenty of avenues (transition tag, franchise tag) to control his rights next year. I know everyone thinks the Browns will be bad for a decade, but if Garrett is for real, Jimmy is for real and they add 5-6 good starters with their $100 mil of cap room I think that team is closer to the playoffs than they are the #1 overall pick. Either way the Pats have to tell everyone they are keeping him. If they really are keeping him they need him to know how they value him. If they aren't keeping him it ups the price tag.

Unless it's the Dolphins. But the NFL does love to go with the division games on Thursday nights, especially as a way to get the "less premier" teams their obligatory night game.

Having the best QB in the league and his willingness to play for 1/3rd of what he actually is worth is truly what the Pats do better than any other team. It's a major competitive advantage that allows them to do everything else they do.

32 teams want to trade down, get a similar level player and pick up more early picks.....

There's very little incentive for him to play this year due to the offset language in his contract. Basically he's going to get paid $6 mil this year regardless of if he plays or not from the Jets but the first $6 mil of a new deal would offset what the Jets are going to pay him, so in order to get monitory incentive he'd need to make north of $6 mil, which may be unlikely to happen.

People can crack all the jokes they want about the Skins, but this offense was loaded at the skill positions with one of the best LTs in the league. They see Cousins and McCoy in practice every day. If they see there's not a major difference between what Cousins gives them vs what they would get from McCoy, it's reasonable to hold off making him one of the 10 highest paid QBs in the league long term. Especially if they have Shanahan Jr. salivating over him loaded up with prime draft capital to trade.

But wait, I was just told Gilmore would be worthless in a trade on the franchise tag.....

I'd wager Jay Gruden has a heavy influence right now http://www.denverpost.com/2017/03/06/jay-gruden-contract-extension-washington-redskins/

The "I've heard of him" game is my favorite part of the offseason.

Well they can't tag Cousins again and perhaps they aren't sold enough to give him the deal he wants so they may as well trade him now while they have the option.

Gruden has been tooting Colt's horn for a while.

Whaley has done an admirable job of adding talent to the roster. He's hit on a lot of his draft picks and our talent level has risen dramatically under his watch. My major point is between Tyrod - Clay - Kyle - Graham - Aaron Williams we have A LOT of money tied up in guys who haven't gotten us to the playoffs and likely won't be here when we do make it. We let Gilmore walk because of that situation and now need to use a high draft pick to replace him instead of addressing some holes like RT and WR, not to mention finding long term replacements for the safeties or Kyle. My major point is "depth" isn't what is separating us from the playoffs and signing 2-3 guys combined for what Gilmore would cost us on the tag isn't closing the gap, especially if it's guys like Kamar Aiken and Jack Crawford (perfectly fine players, but not well above replacement level). Best case we find Zach Brown 2.0 who is just going to walk after a strong season or worst case we sign Chris Williams and light money on fire. We let a guy walk who could be a key member of the team for the next 3+ seasons because we've got money tied up on guys who won't be. The major sin by Whaley (and it's one that may have been done too him instead of by him) is switching schemes from coaches twice in the last three years and creating a moving target on what talent we do need. We've been pressing with an "all in" approach the last 3 seasons and Gilmore is the first major casualty to go. We are going to reach a point soon where we need to reset anyway, I just would have preferred it was done with a guy who could have still been around when we found a solution instead of guys who won't be.

No it didn't, they didn't join the Big 12 until after he left.

Whaley is on record as saying he wants to prioritize QB - WR - LT - Pass Rusher - CB as the backbone of our roster. It's a perfectly reasonable way to build and popular around the league. However our money is going to RB, TE, 2 Safeties we need to replace & DTs. I'm not a Whaley hater, but what we are doing clearly isn't working. Simply put I'd rather move on from Clay / Kyle Williams / Aaron Williams / Graham than Gilmore, but I understand that's an unpopular sentiment, especially with the crowd still crying in their cheerios about Fred leaving. I completely understand the danger in overpaying a corner, but we've got ~$50 mil in precious cap space tied up in several guys who won't likely be on the team in 2018, much less 2019.

My favorite thing about Mahomes is the fact his arm talent should allow us to build the same type of offense for both him and Cardale, giving each an opportunity to win the job in a system that suits them and giving us a backup option that doesn't require a dramatic scheme change. Opinion on Mahomes is definitely split with concerns about his level of competition and inconsistent mechanics, but watch a game on Sunday and QBs with arm talent and improvisational skills tend to shine as you simply aren't going to get a lot of opportunity on a perfectly mechanical throw. Obviously all these guys have cause for concern or else they would be going #1 no question. Waiting till the second round on any of the top 4 QBs is not a realistic option, even if a couple of them don't go in the first you've got a minefield with Cleveland - San Fran - Chicago - NYJ in front of us on round 2. There may even be 5 QBs off the board by our second round pick the way Webb looks to be rising. "Value" is such a ridiculous concept when it comes to the draft, especially when you get past the couple of consensus blue chippers at the top. There simply is not a ton of talent difference between guys going in the teens and guys going in the 40s, it almost always comes down to scheme fit and team need where guys end up landing, either way with a 1st or 2nd round pick you are looking to land a starter.

Absolutely he will. Guys like him don't hit the market often. I'd have to believe we could have franchised him then dealt him for a 3rd or 4th at least (we aren't getting a comp pick because we'll be adding in FA), but Doug loves to leave the agents with a good taste in their mouths as guys walk away, then the agents turn around and bend him over on extensions for the guys we do keep. It just feels like a constant treadmill at this point, we use high draft resources on guys like Gilmore and Woods, they are just good enough to get more money elsewhere but not good enough to win anything for us, then we either lose on the comp pick game trying to find replacements in the market or we have to reinvest high draft picks in the same positions, meanwhile we leave the same holes in the roster year after year (QB obviously being the biggest one). And the unoffical illegal tampering period has been going on for a month.

Given how many complained about Gilmore's tackling and durability, I'd think Sidney Jones would be the more popular corner here....

Goodbye Gillmore, goodbye comp pick, but at least we'll get a Ravens backup WR and Cowboys backup DE. #Bills.

He might be a smart guy, but he had a 2 year run as Dodgers' GM 10 years ago then never really got close to another GM job in the subsequent decade. I'm not holding my breath for his reinvention of NFL scouting and analytics.

That's my point. If he hits FA he's the 2nd best available QB behind Romo, regardless of what those here may think of him. Not every fanbase is disgusted by just average QB play, some would gladly take it. The likelihood is high Tyrod decides to go somewhere other than Cleveland or his price tag could change dramatically with multiple teams bidding for his services. There's a certain sense of control in trading for him, though I think the 33rd pick is pretty aggressive. Others have stated Cleveland is taking their time, but if people honestly believe Haslam isn't going to get an itchy trigger figure on Hue or the Harvard boys if they go 1-15 you are kidding yourself. Just like the 76ers with Hinkie the Browns would get to a level where they are such a national embarrassment there would be several very hot seats. No one wants to put themselves in that position, regardless of "building the right way".

Some numbers (TD-INT %, ESPN's QBR) paint Tyrod in a very positive light, not to mention our top ranked rushing offense. Who knows what formula the Browns are using, but if you plug in the right numbers compared to the market on QB salaries, Tyrod could look like the right thing to do.

Dennison was the Broncos OC for the entirety of Cutler's time in Denver.....