DriveFor1Outta5

What has Cook done that would make you think he'll ever even be somewhat decent? He could be, but I still laugh how Bills fans love every crap QB that isn't our own. I probably shouldn't have said "he what he is" but if this guy played for us you would all be saying how crappy he looked today. None of you would be talking about his "potential". Mark my words that Cook will never be more than a backup in the NFL. I'll eat crow if it happens, you can hold me to it.

Funny how much slack Bills fans are willing to give crappy QB play on other teams like Connor Cook today. They guy is nothing special, he is what he is. A backup QB. If Cook was on the Bills you'd all want to run him out of town after that game. Just because we don't have an elite QB doesn't mean every other crappy QB is good.

I actually thinks it's quite the opposite. Jim has obvious insider connections to the organization. That is why everything he said is probably consistent with how the organization feels. I think Jim knows that TT isn't coming back. I don't think he would have answered the QB question in the same manner if he expected him to be back.

The Running Man. Can be taken many different ways. Sums up the season.

Yes, and QB's no matter how good they are tend to consume a good portion of it. We have to let other guys go. That's just the way it works. Fair enough. I can understand that stance. TT leaving just concerns me because it makes me ask a simple question. Who will be our QB next season? There is no definitive answer. That's why you don't just let him go imo.

Good points. TT may be a bridge, but why do so many want to tear down the bridge before we know what's on the other side? You keep the bridge up until you know you never have to cross back to the other side again.

Because the Pegula's can't afford it? Let's just throw out a bum free agent or throw a rookie into the fire? I don't understand why you wouldn't keep TT while continuing the QB search. The myth of TT having a big contract makes no sense to me. He's a middle of the road QB. You have to pay QB's. Ps regarding the Texans winning a crap division. They beat two playoff teams in the Lions and the Chiefs. We beat one in the Bradyless Pats. Our defense sucked so much this season I doubt we could have won any division including the AFC south.

Yes the Chiefs have won with special teams and defense this year. They have done so consistently for several years. That was supposed to be our blueprint under the defense minded coach Rex. As far as a rookie QB it is in fact quite possible to produce less than TT. Apparently people have forgotten Holcomb,Edwards,Fitz,Manuel,Brohm,and all the other QBs we've had who did nothing at all. TT is not a great passer and can't read a defense, but he does contribute with his legs. When you add that to the equation along with his ability to protect the ball he is an average QB. I don't think he will ever be more. It's just ridiculous to think that Kizer or Watson or some other bum like Glennon is going to make us any better next season. There is no reason to let TT go next season. There is also no reason to place all the blame for missing the playoffs on TT. Three two hundred yard rushers says everything you need to know about the team this season. It's just not as sexy to talk about how much the defense sucked when you can talk about how badly we need Joe Montana. That's why people focus solely on the QB. It's a simpler solution than looking at the big picture.

I didn't say that we need a top 10 WR. I just said TT needs receivers that aren't bottom of the barrel. When you go most of the season without Sammy and you are throwing to guys like Goodwin,Hardin,and Hunter that isn't helpful to any QB. In fact a top 10 defense would be helpful too. That's what Rex was supposed to bring us, and it's what we had before he tore it apart. I'm not a big TT guy. I'm just saying it's ridiculous that some people think the playoffs would be impossible with TT as QB. The Texans with Osweiler and Savage are in the playoffs along with the Chiefs who are a perfect example of a soild all around team with average QB play. TT gives us average QB much like Alex Smith. It's not going to win Super Bowls but it is possible to get you to the playoffs. TT is not the long term answer, and he has tons of flaws. However, we are closer to the playoffs with him than we are doing something like playing a rookie next season. We just need better all around team play.

It's a fact that during desperate times the human psyche always runs to simple solutions for complex problems. The 17 year playoff drought has created feelings of desperation. Now we are all searching for our heros and our scapegoats. The easy answer to the pathetic results of this franchise is to say we don't have a quarterback. That makes us feel good because we feel as if we have an answer. This makes it all seem to make sense. In reality we haven't had a franchise QB during the playoff drought. That doesn't mean there aren't many other reasons why we haven't made the playoffs. Plenty of teams with crappy QB's have made the playoffs since our last appearance. If we want to be a Super Bowl contender we need a franchise QB. Just making the playoffs doesn't always require one. There are other components to a team aside from the QB position. If those other components excel you can make the playoffs without a stellar QB. You may not go far, but it's still better than what this franchise has been able to do. As far as TT is concerned, you are right that he isn't good enough. He isn't good enough to overcome playing with a roster of JV receivers, he isn't good enough to overcome a crap defense, he isn't good enough to make the proper reads a majority of the time, and he isn't good enough to consistently put up up big numbers. He IS good enough to be on a playoff team if it were a complete team. This means good receiver play,good defense,good special teams,coaching,Oline play, and a running game. The running game being an element we actually did have. I'd like to find a much a better QB, but to just send TT packing before we find a better option is senseless. To say he's the only reason we didn't make the playoffs would also be senseless.

I disagree with Whaley's ideas on how build a team, but what you said is the number one reason why I think Whaley should have been gone with Ryan. Now we are stuck with a lame duck GM searching for a new coach. I think that a rebuild needs to take place. The roster and culture of this team need some major adjustments. I understand that some people think we are close due to us being around .500 the last few years. I see us as being more or less stuck at that record. The only way out is to move forward with a new plan. Now what we have is ownership unfairly expecting Whaley to pull a playoff appearance out of a hat over the next couple years. We don't even know who our QB will be next year, yet we can't go into a full rebuild mode because Whaley is on a playoffs or bust deal now. I think this limits what we'll be able to do as far as building the roster. Whaley will be basically forced to stick with what we have, and hope it's good enough to make the playoffs. I don't think it is. Keeping Whaley really limited what we can do over the next couple years imo. Now we have a GM who is forced to think very short term to save himself. This is not in the best interest of the franchise.

I know Whaley is saying all the right things, but honestly how many NFL coaches stick around that long anyway? Even if we find a guy who takes us to the playoffs there is still a great chance he won't make it 10 years. Coaches rarely do. If Coughlin was the right fit you'd hire him regardless. The right fit will be whoever allows Whaley to dictate everything. Whaley wants a puppet coach. Once the puppet coach fails Whaley and the coach will be out the door. Then we will get the chance to do all this again. Sadly this is exactly how I feel. It's a depressing thought, but it's not far from reality. I obviously can't question the success the Pegula's have had in business, but it's stunning that they are repeating the same mistakes with the Bills that they made with the Sabres. They really don't get it yet.

I certainly don't have any concrete information that I can back my statement up with. It's just the feeling I get about Whaley. The guy has already clashed with his last two coaches, and he wants to save his own job. This next coaching hire will have more to do with Whaley's ego and ability to control the situation than who the best available coach is imo. This is why I think we aren't hearing any more about Coughlin. The Pegula's may have really liked Coughlin. The difference is that this time it's supposed to be Whaley's hire. He's not going to want someone who may challenge his decision making.

True. I don't think Whaley would want a big name coach anyway. He wants total control, and needs to find a puppet imo.

Jim is never going to throw this organization under the bus, and I think his answer proves that. TT certainly isn't an elite QB, but how often do coaching jobs actually become available if the team already has a SB caliber QB? I would guess it's not very often. There are reasons why a team is looking for a new coach. It often starts with failure at the QB position. Sure, there are exceptions to this. I just find Jim's answer to be a bit simplistic.

I love Jim just as much as the next guy. However, Jim is always out there in the media saying how much he loves the direction the team is going. Then it all falls apart and he talks about how things need changed. He has been doing this for the last sixteen years. He's always totally on board with everything (new coaches,QBs's etc), and when it fails he tells us that it wasn't a good fit. My point is that he is essentially the most famous Bills fan. He doesn't sound any different than a lot of posters here. I certainly don't think I'd want him in the front office. I agree. Even if it's true there is no need to do that in such a public forum. I didn't hear him call out the defense.

Yes, but I'd take Kosar,Testaverde,and Kelly over Marinovich,Palmer, and Leinart.

No USC QB's. Please. Not a good NFL track record. Carson "choker" Palmer is the best. That's not good.

USC QB's are soft. No thanks.

Newark NJ.

This is why all our dysfunction or least the perception of it hurts us so much. Now we will probably end up with a coach who Whaley feels can be his puppet.

This league has way too many problems with balls.

Just not a fan of college coaches myself. It's so hard to differentiate being a great recruiter from a great coach. I'll use a guy like Dabo Swinney for example. He seems like a personable Gomer Pyle type who would say all the right things needed to land recruits. I don't know if he has the analytical mind needed to be a successful NFL coach.

Yep, but he's certainly not the only guy in the league with similar issues that have just been forgotten. People love hating on the guys where the judge said "guilty", but so many of us are naive enough to always take "innocent" at face value. Fame and fortune will get you the innocent as long as don't pull an OJ, and keep up your shenanigans.

Ok I'll change my example. Here are where some really good teams picked their QB's. Aaron Rodgers Round One Pick 24, Joe Flacco Round 1 Pick 18, Russell Wilson Round 3, Derek Carr Round 2 etc. So I don't think we should let this franchise off the hook because we are in "8-8 purgatory". There really isn't any truth to that statement. It's just an excuse.