BringBackOrton

Beane said he never had a conversation with Sammy or anyone else about him re-signing. Please open your eyes John.

You can't have a discussion about "lack of overall production" of a WR without acknowledging target discrepancies. You also can't have a discussion about what he will command without factoring what his replacement will cost. Jordan Matthews will command $2-3M less than Sammy a year. That's it.

Yes.

Yeah, like Darby.....Oh wait

And yet, when evaluating players, NFL teams thought Sammy was worth a second round pick and a CB, but Jordan Matthews needed a 3rd attached to him to trade him for Darby. SJ13 received a high number of targets and thus produced good numbers. Just like Matthews. But neither are very good. If Sammy received as many targets on a per game basis as Matthews, he would have had way better numbers still playing in less games.

From where? That would be awesome. Then again, Ramsey would walk in 4 years due to "signability."

Jordan Matthews got 2 more targets per game last year and had 4.4 less yards per catch. Watkins is a way better player. Matthews is Stevie Johnson 2.0.

The Rex Ryan hiring poll had a 7:1 approval rating. We're in trouble.

They will re-sign Matthews to make the trade a "success." I believe Kirby said this earlier, and I agreed 100%. Trading for Matthews, touting him as a good replacement player, then letting him walk would look awful.

It's just bad business. I don't think there's a move that's been so universally disliked by the most intelligent posters on this board. Taking on bets about how it works out....

Good topic Kirby! This may be a little off-topic, but when discussing the cap, we also need to talk replacement cost. Lots of "we can't afford to pay Sammy $13M" talk going around, but Matthews is looking at $10M next year to preemptively replace Watkins. We DO need to have a #1 receiver now that there's a hole. That's why I find, "we could sign two or 3 good players for that," arguments so frustrating. Sure, you could. You could sign a serviceable LB, 3rd CB, or vet OL for that money. But then how do you pay your #1 WR that you are going to need? The guys that hit FA are gonna be asking for $15M. Our odds of drafting a top 15 WR talent are not good. You don't win in the NFL losing a star over a few cap dollars and paying a few serviceable players instead. 53 Jordan Matthews caliber athletes isn't a Super Bowl team. Case in point, Gilmore. Who did we sign when Gilmore walked that we really need? We could've afforded Hyde still. Vlad Ducasse? Andre Holmes? Dimarco? Is there any doubt, on today of all days, that letting Gilmore walk for a FB and a couple backups, along with trading Sammy for picks and "adequate" players show a flawed team-building strategy? With the money we save from not keeping Sammy, we will end up signing Jordan Matthews and a backup OG/C who sees some ST snaps. That is NOT a recipe for success.

So we traded 1 year of Sammy Watkins with resign potential for another's 1 year rental and a pick. Brilliant.

Doctors were forced to over prescribe because of morons and now everyone is paying for it.

Agreed. If we sign Matthews for $10M, this deal was awful.

https://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/175270-do-you-approve-hiring-rex-ryan-as-hc/?p=3419098 Ball don't lie. I got to say. You and the majority "nailed it."

McD was calling the shots before Beane was hired. If Watkins isn't "needed," neither is Ducasse, Davis and Holmes. And again, the comp pick is before every 4th round pick. It's not "basically a 4th." Beane flat out said he had no info about Sammy wanting out.

The majority, and you, thought Rex Ryan was a great hire. Bye Felicia.

Some may say no, but Rico's last offense had Thomas and Sanders as 1A and 1B. Both broke 1k yards and saw over 130 targets each with Simien at QB. It may not be needed. But they had 2 WR's better than anybody we have.

This is just absolutely baseless . A comp third is before every single 4th pick. Spin zone on spin zone.

Beane said he didn't have that conversation with Sammy ever. So what are you talking about?

But why would you look at it like that. We had Boldin before the trade. We could look at it like: Tyrod, Shady, Kyle, Dareus, Tre White, Boldin, Matthews and Gaines, 2nd and 3rd for Watkins, Darby and a 6th. It looks even better now. Yes, when you turn the roster over fast, the first folks to fall are the cheap depth players. That on top of a roster already declining on that front and we could see some ugliness at certain position groups.

Not sure how you could believe Sammy's talent was worth 2 firsts and a fourth 3 years ago, and now not worth a good contract and a second.

Maybe Spiller will be available soon.

4th highest YPC of the year. Edit: Wrong again. I'm bowing out of this one

What was your stance on the Sammy selection in 2014?