GunnerBill

Depends what you mean by same class. If you mean they are not elite Quarterbacks, yes, we agree they are the same class. As for what that means in January.... Purdy has been to a Superbowl. Matt Ryan should have won one but for Kyle Shanahan's stupidity. Joe Flacco won one. The ghost of Peyton Manning won one when he literally couldn't throw. You need everything to go right to win with a guy like Goff. That is for sure. Whereas a Mahomes, or in theory an Allen or Jackson can make some magic happen even when some things have gone wrong. My main contention is good Quarterbacks are hard to find. Elite ones even harder. If you are lucky enough to find one as good as Jared Goff you should try and put pieces around him and hope for a few bounces your way.

He is finished. I don't care where he signs. He doesn't move the needle.

I think they are honestly pretty similar. I haven't focussed as much on Downs since he came into the league. I think he is a more natural route runner though. Ha you missed the thread here the other night then.

Tier 1 is EXACTLY what I said the other day. Jefferson, Chase, Brown in some order.... then a BIG gap.

The last few Hard Knocks have been singularly dull compared to the early years so I don't think the distraction is the same as it was in the years when this was novel. Teams are much more used to this kind of behind the scenes filming than they were. I'm excited for it personally.

Why?

Only played 1 year. But was a Bill for 2.

Zach Brown.

Yea Teller is the one. Scheme switch was critical there. Poona Ford is the only othere one I can think of who was good before. Meh here. Good after.

He is a cut candidate, yes. But it isn't anything like a guarantee. I think he has a chance to stay too. But he will have to look good in camp. For most of last season him being out there was a net negative for the defense.

This is the list of the best though and length of proving it is part of the consideration for me. I do think the two best players in the NFL under 25 are Sewell and Hamilton. They both look like future HoFers. I do agree if you let any GM choose Daniels (and Stroud probably) are the top 2 because having a Quarterback just matters that much more. If Daniels backs his rookie year up he for sure moves up.

Yes. But the whole point of the elite talent conversation is about surrounding Josh. Come on you know that was the context. I don't know who executed the trade. But is pretty common knowledge Veach was the guy who banged the drum for Mahomes and convinced Andy. https://www.esquire.com/sports/a44893777/patrick-mahomes-scout-discovery-true-story/

Yes. And all you have proved is the only elite guy he has drafted is Josh Allen. We are talking about putting elite talent around Josh Allen. That is what I meant. Veach technically inherited his QB (although he was the guy that idenfied him which is why he was promoted and Dorsey let go) but he has put more elite players around Mahomes than Beane has around Josh. And Howie has put more elite players around Hurts (who isn't himself elite so needs more pieces). Your own assessment supports that.

It's actually centered on his ability to put elite talent around Josh. That is what matters.

You might not. I do. Cos when January comes around it matters.

Because those guys have multiple elite players on their rosters and Beane has one.

He is better than Cousins and better than Purdy.

I don't have Cook yet in the near elite. I have him, as I said above, two steps away from that status rather than Brown and Benford who are one. And while I dobn't know exactly what numbers.... yea I broadly think Beane has been good at getting guys in your 2nd and 3rd category. Again I might quibble a bit about a player or two (Bernard isn't in that territory for me). As for other Chiefs and Eagles I'd throw into the conversation.. it probably is just Creed and Rashee for the Chiefs. The next 4 would be Sneed, Trey Smith, Nick Bolton and Karlaftis but think they are all in the very good rather than near elite bucket. Howie has more. He still has Lane Johnson from his first spell (before the Chip Kelly having GM control disaster) who I don't think is quite elite anymore but is still near elite. Then Landon Dickerson who is near elite too. Smith I'd put in the very good category personally but can take an argument either way. And then the two DBs last year who were near elite as rooks. If they both back it up in 2025 they could both well be in elite territory. He has been the best left tackle in football over the last four years. He is elite. End of discussion for me.

But there are not 32 guys who you do. At any one time there might be 4 or 5. What do you do if you don't have one? You put a team around a darn good QB like Goff and hope you can find a way. And about once every 10 years or so that works out.

Yep. Again.... LEVELS below AJ Brown.

Yea he has only failed to have 1,000 yards once and that year he missed 3 games.

I think Verse belongs on the list. He is too high though. There is no world in which he us better than Will Anderson. And I liked Verse a lot coming out. He was my EDGE1 last year. He belongs in the 15-25 territory. Not top 10.

If we are talking just 2024.... Ed was bad for 2/3s of the year. But down the stretch and in the playoffs he was very good.

I don't disagree with much of your post. I do disagree with this. He has to find more elite guys to support Josh. AJ Brown is LEVELS above Drake London. That is an insanely bad comparison. Brown is behind only Chase and Jefferson. And there is a GAP to #4. You are entitled to your opinion, obviously but I think you are miles off.

Dawkins, White and Zay were not Beane. They were McDermott. And Oliver is a hit. Not a star, but a hit.