GunnerBill

Whose theory was that? That was never what the Bills said. Or what Leslie said. He wasn't fired he stepped down. I know that for a stone cold fact. What Brandon said in the presser, that when they took their week off in Feb and then came back Leslie said "I'm not coming back I want to take a year off" is absolutely true. What prompted that, you can speculate on. My thinking has always been that McDermott had decided to take a greater role in playcalling (either he was going to call the entire game or maybe he was going to do a Rex Ryan and call 3rd down and redzone or something) and Leslie decided that under those circumstances it was better for all concerned if he moved on. Some people here created their own narrative that if he was really not fired presumably he'd be back after his year out but neither the Bills nor Frazier ever committed to that. They didn't totally shut the door, and to do so would have been foolish, but I know, again for a stone cold fact, that Leslie's belief when he stepped away was that would be the end of his stint in Buffalo.

He was never horrible. He was really good for the Bills. Neither the Bills, nor Frazier, ever said he was coming back to Buffalo. Just that he had decided to take a year off but still wanted to coach beyond that. The chances he was ever coming back here after a year off were next to nil.

Hmm. I think that was more a Spencer Rattler problem.

@DCOrange mentioned Dane Brugler's initial 2 rounder I think earlier in this thread or possibly elsewhere. Last night I did a count up for comparison purposes. We are 11 players different out of the 64 we have as potential 1st and 2nd rounders at this stage. I can't answer for what Dane thinks of the guys I have and he doesn't but thought it might be interesting to look at the guys he has that I don't. Will say before I do that I have huge respect for Dane he is one of the best pro draft guys out there, but here goes: Jaden Hicks - S, Washington State (Dane has at #41 to the Packers) - We both have safeties at this spot. Hicks is a guy I need to do more on I haven't really got into him, but from a cursory look last night I am concerned about his play speed. When you look at what Green Bay has generally looked for on defense in recent years speed has been their thing - whether Wyatt at DT, Walker at linebacker or Savage at safety - they have gone for guys who are fast for their position so not convinced this is a fit. Ruke Orhorhoro - DT, Clemson (Dane has at #42 to the Vikings) - I have Minnesota going Quarterback here, I did consider defensive tackle as a possibility though I see the logic. Don't love the player he is very raw to me. Doesn't have the bulk to play the run consistently and I don't think his pass rush package makes him a viable starting 3T at this stage. Provisionally I actually have more of a day 3 developmental grade on him. Dominick Puni - OT/G, Kansas (Dane has at #45 to the Saints) - I have a receiver for the Saints. I see the point on a left tackle for them but that would mean they are already out on Trevor Penning, a first rounder from two years ago who has had injuries and I'm not sure I see that (if they have I'd love Beane to get on the phone and see what it might take...). On Puni though I really like him. I actually do have a provisional late 2nd on him and really wanted to give him to the Chiefs at the end of the round but thought I might be way off the consensus. Intrigued to see Dane has him so high. Javon Bullard - S, Georgia (Dane has #47 to the Giants) - I had a defensive tackle here but I considered safety too. Xavier McKinney is a free agent and probably won't be retained. I considered Bullard for the Bills pick at #61 (was a toss up between him and Bullock) and had I carried on to the third round he'd have come off the board within the first few picks. One of the better guys I just didn't find a home for. Cooper Beebe - G, Kansas State (Dane has #48 to the Jaguars) - I liked Beebe when he was potentially coming out last year but maybe not quite this high. More like a third rounder. I haven't circled back to him to look at his 2023 performance yet so maybe I'd bump him up once I have. I think the Jags have too many potential needs at premium spots to spend a mid-second rounder on a guard (we both gave them Brian Thomas in round 1). Junior Colson - LB, Michigan (Dane has #50 to the Eagles) - Obviously know the name from watching Michigan games on tv but haven't really looked at him at all yet as a draft prospect so don't have a strong view. I thought he was more of a MLB, which would mean shifting Nakobe Dean to WLB. Maybe that's the plan? They definitely need depth at linebacker. Zach Frazier - C, West Virginia (Dane has #51 to the Steelers) - I had Pittsburgh going linebacker and I do think that is a bigger need. But they could upgrade Mason Cole at center. Frazier was a guy I was trying to get into round 2 but he is strictly a gap scheme player and so many places as soon as you look at oline they are running a Shanahan type scheme and you are looking for zone blockers. I do think he goes round 2 though, so I like this pick from Dane (kinda wish I'd thought of it!) Kalen King - CB, Penn State (Dane has #58 to the Packers) - As with his previous Packers pick I had the same position, different player at this spot. Coming into this season I would have said King was a lock to go in the first two rounds of the draft but he reminds me a bit of Kristian Fulton and Kelee Ringo in previous cycles in that his final year in college was his worst. Fulton still squeaked into the end of round 2. Ringo fell to round 4. My gut says King is gonna slide further than this spot. Malachi Corley - WR, Western Kentucky (Dane has #59 to the Texans) - I had the Texans adding a tight end (and I dunno it feels a bit to me like Dane was really trying to get that tight end to fall to Kansas City) and I still think that makes more sense. Corley would be competing for snaps with Tank Dell who was electric for them as a rookie. I also think it is too early for Corley but there could be what I'm going to call "the inverse Jonathan Mingo effect." Last year's WR draft class was so full of slot receivers and YAC guys that a big downfield type like Mingo got artificially inflated because there was a lack of that type of receiver. This year's class is full of vertical receivers near the top and fewer slot / YAC specialists so it wouldn't surprise me if a team looking for that type reached a bit on a Corley or a Roman Wilson or a Jacob Cowing in round 2. Kiran Amegadjie - OT, Yale (Dane has #63 to the 49ers) - I had the 9ers taking a tackle in round 1 and a guard in round 2... Dane has it the other way around. I have heard a lot of people talking this kid up but I have not seen a single snap of him playing football, so he won't be on my board for that reason. I was expecting him to be at the Senior Bowl but injury is going to keep him out. The combination of small school and big injury make me think he might slide further down the draft through. Darius Robinson - DE, Missouri (Dane has #64 to the Ravens) - I went running back here for the Ravens having gone pass rusher in round one. Robinson is more a round 3 type to me. I think his appeal to 4-3 teams will be limited but I do see the fit for Baltimore because he could play OLB in base and then reduce down and play with his hand in the dirt in obvious passing situations. May well be that Nix ends up the 4th guy in round one and Penix is a day two guy. I haven't really dug into the Quarterbacks at all yet.

It's because Kansas City and San Francisco and Denver (in the 80s for the Browns) are/were better teams.

So would I... but really the advantage in mock drafts is they give you a chance to work through scenarios. I did not go into this expecting to pick a safety for the Bills in round 2. I expected to be picking a defensive lineman. But as the round unfolded the run on DL had happened ahead of the Bills. I never try and "save" a player for the Bills I try and treat every team seriously and look at realistic options for what they might do. What ended up happening was the defensive line talent was hollowed out and when I looked at where the next cluster of players was on the board there were 2 or 3 safeties there among the best remaining. Maybe in the real world the Bills would trade back, I don't know, but here it felt like I'd have been forcing it to take a DL and a safety was the logical pick.

Genuinely, me too. Last year I felt like all our best players were older. But the younger guys have emerged this year. Sure there isn't a lot of cap dollars to get better but there are 10 draft picks plus the natural development that should come from the likes of Kincaid, Cook, Shakir, Bernard and Benford having been true starters for the first time in 2023. I expect all those guys to be even better for the experience in 2024. Sure, there are some question marks. WR, DL, Secondary... but I don't look at where we are and see problems. I see solutions.

MVS did, sure. And I'd take MVS over Sherfield and Harty obviously. But he isn't the Sherfield and Harty equivalent he is the Gabe Davis equivalent. Their depth receivers have been no shows. Skyy Moore has yet to touch the ball. Mercole Hardman had a fumble that if the Bills had executed at the end would have cost them the game and Toney's contribution these playoffs has been to rant his way out of the NFL on twitter.

Well he was off the board HERE. Could he still be there for real? Sure. But here in this mock he was already gone. Understood. Personally I think explosiveness is the #1 need, but hands is #2.

He can play as a defensive end too.

Yes. Leslie is a good coach though. He'd be a good hire for Miami. And their personnel is pretty transferrable for the most part.

Yea I like him. Testing will be big for where he lands.

Yea Mitchell is good. And he has arguably the best hands in the class. He just leaves me a bit cold. I think he is really solid. But not sure I see the ceiling of some of the other guys. The one year point on Legette is totally fair.

There is something to #1. I think he can definitely improve his release against press. Honestly I don't see #2 at all personally.

I did consider Bullard as well. He would be a legitimate choice there. I disagre with you on the receivers but I accept I am probably higher on Legette than the consensus. I think he is a stud. My issue with Mitchell is I don't see much pop. He is a bit one paced for my liking. Great hands but certainly as a Bills fit we need explosion. 1. He is already off the board here. 2. He isn't completely the same type. Thomas is strictly a vertical receiver. Legette can do that but has more wiggle IMO to be involved in the short and intermediate game.

Nah I started watching the NFL in 2002 and watching it really religiously from 2007. Matt Schaub was a game manager (to believe otherwise you have to believe he fell off a cliff at 31 once the influence of Shanhan and Kubiak was removed) Jimmy G was a game manager. They were both made to look better by the system. Matt Ryan was a very good Quarterback. A top 10 guy. But he was made to look elite in that system and he was not elite. I think Brock is a good Quarterback. He has proven he can play in the NFL. But he is on a really good team with loads of talent and a scheme with a history of elevating Quarterbacks. And through the Green Bay game and the first half last night I was not particularly impressed. As I say I haven't seen the 2nd half.

Even if he does he doesn't play that fast. I watched 4 full games of us and dropped him after every game. Really came into it expecting to like him based on my tv exposure to Florida State in season too. One of the most disappointing tape evaluations.

It isn't what I want to happen so much as asking what makes sense with the board falling that way? There is no edge value left. The DTs that I think are second round value and a scheme fit are all gone. There isn't an offensive tackle I like enough.... Zach Frazier the center out of West Virginia was the other guy I considered but I am not sure they are spending a second round pick on a low value position when that guy isn't seeing the field as a rookie unless there are injuries. If somehow Morse were to shake free before the draft.... maybe then.

No we can't.

I think he separates plenty. I haven't heard that as the knock on him. If it is that is surprising to me. I don't see that on film.

I hold my hands up on him this year. He has completely changed my opinion. He has had a great year.

Yea absolutely. You don't have to be an exceptional scout to be a good general manager. The job is more than that. Yea I am not in love with the Bullock pick. But not sure where else I'd go given that board. And yes on Thomas. I do think he will run faster than 4.47.

I don't think he is a reach. He is my WR4. He seems to be going early 2nd in mocks I have seen but I know some have him going later and a few who have him earlier. Personally I think he will have a good week this week at the senior bowl, he will blow up the combine and he will be a first round pick. The questions on him are mainly - 1 year of production and why did it all click suddenly age 22 (old in college terms)? But the 2023 tape is excellent. If he backs that up in the process I think he goes day 1.

I saw the White Stripes at Blackpool Winter Gardens. One of the best live gigs I have ever been to. Aso for the people who don't think it is a classic... well I'm gonna fight 'em off, a seven nation army couldn't hold me back!

I feel a bit for Greg. I think he has got better each year he has been on the job. He was certainly an upgrade on Troy Aikman. But there was just always something about him that didn't seem to carry the gavitas of a big network #1 color guy. I have no idea how Brady will be. Greg should go to Prime and do the Thursday Night gig. Because my word Kirb is unlistenable.