Dan

I don't either. But, if we have another 6 win season, will a new owner feel the same way? My guess is they start making serious changes unless this iteration of FO, coaches, players start to show some real progress in the win/loss column.

And this is exactly why everyone needs to hope like all hell that EJ and Marrone are good and we have a winning season. Because if not... the new owner will almost certainly blow up the entire FO, coaching staff, then players are gone. Do that much overhaul in the NFL and you're talking years.. 5? before we can even hope for a winning record.

The fact that the bid process is still ongoing would indicate that it's not that simple. Either Pegula wasn't the highest bid, or the highest in the history of the league, or something about the bid made them think someone doesn't want to keep the team in Buffalo, or there's something none of us know about the process being played out. In the end, all any of us have is speculation at this point.

Let's slow down now.... no one is claiming Tuel has the chroise! He might be improving and lookin ok, but chroisen he is not.

Maybe the trust did that to make it easier to disqualify bids that they don't want? Makes perfect sense if their primary interest is to approve sale to someone they like (that will keep the team in Buffalo) and not sell to the highest bidder.

Thank you.

Certainly a good case for optimism regarding EJ. Conversely, a case for... why did we trade Stevie again?

I don't understand how Thad is any smarter than Tuel? He has won real games, a couple, ok. But, he's also had the opportunity to play in more games than Tuel. And yes, he has a nice arm that he often uses to over throw his receivers. Again, I just don't see how either one is significantly better than the other. They both have looked good at times and looked bad at times. Neither is starting material. Where I do see a difference is in last night's game - Tuel seems to have improved in his grasp of the offense over last season, while Thad hasn't (and may have regressed). Again, I'm not saying one is that much better than the other. But, I think Tuel has a legitimate shot to be the #2 QB come day 1 over Thad.

If Thad is adequate, then so is Tuel. I just don't see that much difference in their game to put one significantly above the other. And I agree, we have an overall QB issue.

Precisely. From my couch, Tuel seems to have progressed, while EJ still seems to be thinking about it all. And for the anti-Tuel crowd.... I'm not suggesting Tuel start and we cut EJ. I'm just suggesting that to my eye, Tuel has gotten better since last year and EJ is still pressing. That's what's concerning. I want to see EJ progress and I'm not sure we've seen that to this point.

I suggest that it was a preseason game; hence, the right time to tinker. I was ondering the same thing... why is Woods playing so late in the game? But, if they really are considering Hogan for the team, why not play him with the first stringers and see how he compares? The biggest knock we always hear is... yeah so and so looked good, but it was against 3rd stringers. Well, Hogan got his chance against ones. But, to do that, someone has to play against the 2s and 3s. Last night that was Woods. I would expect as the preseason progresses, we'll see that change.

I genuinely watched last night's game with the idea that it's preseason, week 1 football. By that very nature, you can only expect to see so much good when you're talking about rookies and 2nd year players. Regarding EJ, I liked that his deep sideline pass was actually in the field of play. Seems basic but that is an improvement from last year. However, my take away was pretty much exactly what GG said. And that's the area of EJ's game that I want to see the most improvment in. I know its crazy talk, but Tuel looks like he has a better feel for the game right now than EJ. Yes, he makes mistakes too and all that stuff, but he looks more in control of the game to my untrained eye.

Andre is the man! That was an awesome speech. And I loved that he mentioned Talley. Hard to believe all those years ago that Kelly, Thomas, Lofton, Bruce, Marv and now Reed would ALL be in the HOF. Just amazing group of people. Is it just me, or do the Bills players refer to their team and town they play for as a family more than any others?

It does suck, I agree. But sometimes life does suck

How many fans wouldn't attend games in Toronta if they were paid $10,000 pre game to attend (or some such figure)? Ask yourself if you would turn that down, on principle, before deciding that Andre is turning his back on anyone. Its hard to judge a guy trying to earn a dollar, IMO.

The list seems brutal, because we're only considering playoff teams that year as quality teams. That very much limits the field. So there's only 12 quality teams in total each year? And the Bills play about 3 to 6 of those, not necessarily on the road. The year the Pats went 11-5 and did not make the palyoffs, were they not a quality team? Not saying we best them, just suggesting that quality teams could be defined by more than just playoff teams.

That's the problem. The whole team is average, starting with the coaches going right to the QB. Until we get a coaching staff that has a clue about how to call a game, game plan for specific opponents, and utilize the talent they have; and a QB that can perform at an NFL level... we'll see the same thing. All while we continue to run good players out of town, only to watch them play very well for other teams.

Best post in the thread, and pretty much ends the discussion. However, I will add... It seems to me WNY suffers from plain old normal depression more than economic depression. The saddest part of reading this thread are all the posters that have simply given up. We're too poor, not big enough, nothing good will ever happen here... so why even try, just give in and let the world pass us by, we can't ever be better.

2 questions... Why is this going all in on this year? I can't recall the last time a rookie WR was the final piece to take a perrenial 6-10 team to the playoffs. Why does this signal the end of Stevie? It seems TJ, Hogan and just about all the other scrubs should be worried. But, you certainly don't build a team by cutting your top players the second you draft someone. And before everyone chimes in on how bad Stevie is... he's easily one of the best WRs ...on the Bills' team. This was a bold move, no doubt. But, I does it completely change this franchise? I'm not so sure about that. EJ's success, or lack of, will do that

I agree. ...with both of you. I think Marrone and Whaley et al. are here til we get a new owner regardless of the record, even if that takes 5yrs. However, if a quick sale goes down, this could very well be their last season ...especially if they don't turn the team around. IMO, the only way a new owner doesn't put his stamp on the team immediately by replacing the FO is if they're winning. and even then its still likely to happen.

It's about all we can do

And Lynch was run out of town for his off field actions, one strike from being suspended, good riddance. All he's done is play hard every year since leaving Buffalo and help another team win the Super Bowl. I'm not say.... I'm just sayin.

If Marrone is coming off a losing season, and you fire him, you have to replace him. However, if the team does not have new ownership, who is going to want to take the job? Everyone knows that a new owner almost certainly means an entirely new organization.. President, GM, Coaches, you name it. So who's going to want that job? Hacket maybe.

I agree. Look no further than the Browns for an example of fan support being neglected by an owner wanting to move. However, a winning, play off team seems harder to move than a 6-10 team. With all that said, my point in starting this thread wasn't so much to start another "the Bills may move" thread, but more a "Russ, Whaley and Marrone are likely here for the duration" thread. Like it or not, this is the core of the team manangement and no matter the record, I can't see any of them getting fired until a new owner comes in, whether that be 1, 2. or 3 years from now. And if they manage to get this team winning again... soon... they'll give the new owner and the league something extra to consider. I'd imagine.

They may hold the Bills' future in their hands. With the Bills going into a trust, to be sold at some point in the future, they (and the rest of the FO) are here to build this team and try to make it a winner for at least a couple more years. No chance Marrone gets canned as long as this team is in trust. If they do build a winning team, with a play off appearance, I think it changes everything when a new owner comes in. Conversely, it's easier to move if the team tanks it from here out. You gotta wonder... will they develop an us against the league mentality and pull closer together to do all they can with this one shot or will they ride it out?