Dan

What you fail to understand or acknowledge is that Welker eats us up with those 7 yard passes because the defense has to defend the entire field. Brady readily throws to Moss deep down the field, so you've typically got 2 guys deep with him' perhaps even a 3rd guy on the other side of the field that relatively deep as well. That leaves a lot of room underneath for Welker to catch and run with the ball. When you QB refuses to throw the ball beyond 10-15 yards. The defense plays closer to the line and all that room underneath disappears. So the odds of routinely catching dumpoffs and turning them into big gains is greatly diminished without a long ball threat. This is exactly what we've seen for years and is largely responsible for why our offense is inept.

The only disturbing thing about the game, IMO, is that Trent did not even attempt a pass more than 10 yards down the field. Not even an attempt. It's one thing to not have any downfiled completions. But, to not even try? I mean there's really no excuse. It makes me wonder can we even call him the QB if he's not willing to throw the ball?

He certainly had a few opportunities in the game and failed in each instance. Johnson can't be any worse, can he?

Do you really think Trent hasn't had enough time to throw the ball? Granted the protection hasn't been super great, but he's had enough time on enough pass attempts to move the ball. Trent just refuses to throw the ball.

Edwards going to get himself killed if he doesn't start throwing the ball downfield. He's got more than enough time to drop back and throw it downfield. The problem is... he drops back and looks indecisively about before dumping the ball to the closest guy to him. He's' got to stretch the field and slow down the rush. To this point, for whatever reason, he looks scared and hesitant back there. Watch the game. Half of Big Ben's throws were to receivers that were well covered. But, Ben threw it without hesitation and guess what... his receivers made some great plays on the ball. Trent, on the other hand, refuses to throw the ball.

...the next one.

Again, I don't really dispute any of that. However, as eball stated, "3 of the top 4 picks this year were on the lines". In the last 2 years, the FO has brought in a couple of quality players AND drafted for the lines. So perhaps Brandon is starting to get it? To simply write Owens' acquisition off as a marketing move is to ignore the fact that the FO was actively seeking a FA WR long before Owens was released. So, obviously the move was not all about marketing. Perhaps its a nice side effect, but by no means was the genesis of the idea for bringing him here. And, yes, I agree Stroud was not a FA; but the results are the same. Whether the FO makes a trade for a player or signs a FA (restricted or unrestricted) the end result is the same - they sought out and acquired players from somewhere else. So, I agree, Stroud shouldn't count in the strictest sense as FA signing, but I still think the FO should get some credit for bringing in a good player to help the team.

I don't disagree with any of that, but you said you'd just like to see them bring in 1 or 2 quality players each year rather than the usual bums (I'm paraphrasing). So, I pointed out that they've done exactly that each of the last 2 years.

Last year: Stroud and Mitchel brought in. This year: Owens and Rhodes brought in.

Gotcha.

Isn't McCargo a DT? I don't get it.

Hah beat ya by 30 seconds! But, yeah, that's my wonder. If you mover Walker back to LT and Butler back to RG; then that puts Wood at LG. But, I'm not sure you want to do that to a rookie that been learning the RG spot all summer. I'd be inclined to move Walker over and have Butler the odd man out. Of course, this all assumes Bell is able to get healthy quick and continue to impress whoever it is that he's impressing.

Very interesting revelation, indeed. Wouldn't you know it, Bell gets injured and slows his progress. You have to wonder how much that will impact the situation. The big problem here was putting Wood at RG to begin with. If you put Bell in at LT, it only makes sense to put Walker back to RT. But, then do you shift everyone around.. Butler back to RG, Wood to LG? Or do you leave Wood at RG and take the better of Levitre or Butler at LG? I'm not sure how tough it would be for Wood to switch from RG to LG, but I'd think it's preferable to not switch the guy around every other month. So, does it just leave Butler out in the cold?

Of the regular season? You and I both know there will be a plethora of posts by the end of the 1st quarter tomorrow claiming he's slow/undersized/lost and we should have drafted Orapko. I'm certain any pleas for rational thought will fall on deaf ears.

Apparently, Jauron is still the coach. Who else goes for a field goal with time running out and your down by 4?

Maybe you're reading the wrong board?

You have to remember that whatever the Bills do is wrong. If they trade a disgruntled player, that gives half effort for a first round draft pick; then they're fools for caving in and giving the player what he wants. If they sign the player to a large contract and he continues to give half hearted effort; then they're fools for not seeing this. The only potential winning scenario for the Bills would have been to keep Peters on the team, but don't rework his contract. That way when he keeps sulking, at least he won't be costing alot of money. Of course, the team is wasting a roster spot on someone that's underperfoming and will eventually cut/trade him for next to nothing. But at least they showed him, huh. Of course, in 2 years these same people will denigrate the FO for not trading him when they had a chance to get a 1st round pick. See, so the FO really did screw up after all.

Drop one safety to run deep with Evans and the CB. That leaves 9 guys to crowd the LOS. Hence, no running lanes, no YAC for WR screens and checkdowns, plenty of sacks/QB hurries, and one of the worst offenses in the league. Why our coaching staff can't see this and make the appropriate changes is beyond me. As others have said, when all you do is take what the defense gives you, you're playing right into their hands. Ahhhhh... does it really even matter? At this point, its like putting the ball on a tee and the kid still striking out. Some kids just shouldn't be playing.

I think tonight at 9:30.

Perhaps. But, can you see the humor in the current situation? JP was widely ridiculed because all he did was look for the long bomb and wouldn't use outlet receiver. (I'm not saying that's true, just saying that was what was being said.) Trent was built up and seen as the next great thing. Now, he's being ridiculed because all he does is look for the checkdown, out receiver and doesn't throw it long enough. (And, unfortunately, that is quite factual.) It's kinda like that old saying... be careful what you ask for, because you just might get it. Well, we all got it.

I thought about starting a new thread and just posting this. Absolutely, spot on, IMO.

What happens on Sunday?

What does that have to do with anything? Can say, without any doubts, that if Ngata were a Bill he'd have as many interceptions as he currently does? All I'm suggesting is that too many people are comparing apples to oranges. Not only do the 2 players play different positions, but they're on different teams. The only link between them is that many here thought we should have drafted one over the other. Hence, my suggestion that this discussion is more appropriate for a do you think the FO knows what its doing-type question. Why don't we argue that Whitner sucks because Mangold is better? The truth is many people just want to validate that they were right and Ngata would have been a better pick. He may have been; although until he suits up for the Bills its all speculation. And I contend that it has nothing to do with Whitner's value to the team.

IMO, Ngata should be left out of any discussion of Whitner. Whitner's play on the field has absolutely nothing to do with Ngata's play in Baltimore. If anyone is upset about not selecting Ngata in the draft, that should be saved for a different poll. Do you think the FO screwed up not taking Ngata (for ex.)? But, remember, football is a team sport and very few players have ever played in a vacuum being able to single handedly improve the fortunes of a franchise. Yes, in Baltimore, Ngata looks great. However, there's absolutely nothing to guarantee that he'd be playing anywhere remotely the same had he been in Buffalo these last few years. Given the talent around him and the coaching staff around him, I'd bet he'd look very average. For evidence to support my claim, look no further than Jim Leonhard. So, how good has Whitner been for the Bills? Let me answer with another question. How good does anyone look on this poorly coached team?

Don't worry... some of us got it. Man it's shaping up to be a long season.