Prickly Pete

Why do you always deflect to a different point? It's true, the Pats are surely cheating with PED's. EVERY team in the league is cheating with PED's, it's a given in my mind. Seattle probably leads the league in offenders that have been caught, yet no one at any point has suggested the types of punishments that they are now for the Pats.

The reason the NFL is dragging it's heels, is because they know it's an infraction that's worthy of a slap on the wrist, that is being blown completely out of proportion because it's the smug, hated Patriots (as opposed to say, Blake Bortles and the Jags). I don't care about Spygate, this is nowhere near that level of an infraction. The penalty ($25,000) that is already in place makes that clear. These days, a media frenzy is purposely developed over ANYTHING that can be construed as controversial (from actors, politicians, athletes), or anything that allows people to express their opinion, no matter how uninformed (and there is plenty of misinformation, and rumors being tossed around). It's a farce, and the NFL is waiting for the media to latch upon the next click bait fuel.

I consider PED's way more serious, and I believe that every NFL team has multiple players using them. If they want to get rid of them, I'm all for it. The penalties that people are suggesting (forfeiting the Indy game? year long suspension?) are way out of line for this type of offense. This would be the first time the league has penalized at team for this (as far as I know), so year long suspensions (even for a franchise with past transgressions for completely different infractions). The current penalty starts at $25.000, it's a huge leap from that, to year long suspensions, and game forfeiting.

I've never claimed it wasn't cheating, I claimed it's common practice, and that every game both teams have players or coaches or GM's that have cheated/ or are cheating. I don't consider it a serious transgression. The title is the writer's opinion. The content is from an actual manager, who claims it is common practice. SO how about an actual counter to the content of the article, smart guy? Do YOU believe it is common practice and happening in most NFL games?

AN article from 2013... http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/not-for-attribution/longtime-college-football-equipment-manager-everyone-cheats-deflates-184104713.html

If they have been doing this for seasons (like the fumble counters suggest) and if it is so easy and obvious when a ball is deflated, how could the officials miss it? An official handles the ball before every play. Wouldn't there at least have been a warning, or an official that rejected a ball to be re-inflated, or SOME kind of prior instance that an official would let the "League Office" know about at some point in the investigation? "Gee Boss, yeah, I remember a few times where I rejected a ball, because it didn't seem right". If there hasn't even been that kind of incident, then I really doubt they have been doing this for years on end. OR Maybe, just MAYBE, deflating the ball a little might just be a very common practice throughout the NFL (and college) that the officials turn a blind eye to, and the only reason the Pats got hassled is because a whiner like Harbaugh (those guys are just as insufferable as Belichick) made a big deal about it?

Cheaters.

Yeah, because he was the only guy that was trying, everyone else couldn't give a crap. IT's an exhibition game. He is not worthy of the HOF

They didn't suspend the coach AND player, did they? And regardless, I have made it clear REPEATEDLY, that I felt a suspension wouldn't be unreasonable. Like over, and over. (are you now going to go back, count them, and come back at me with "no, man. I got you right here...you only repeated it over once! Not "over and over"!)?

WHere?I have responded to the same questions about 5 times each. Here is my position.... First off, I was responding to someone's retort that the balls could be doctored on the field, using a pump pin, through sleight of hand. Go back and read it. I also mentioned that if it happened within the stadium (as opposed to the field area), there would be cameras showing activity where the balls are kept, and I definitely believe that security cameras are on by that time. If the officials are there, security cameras would be on. They are probably on 24/7. Even if they only show who enters the room where they are kept, it would at least narrow it down to those people. I never claimed that there wasn't enough time between when the officials test the balls and the game, to deflate them. I responded to the assertion that "it would only take a second" to accurately, and consistently deflate the balls during the game that quickly, and without there being some questioning of his motions at some point. There are tons of cameras on the field filming cheerleaders, the bench, the coaches, the HoF ex-players on the sidelines. Someone would have caught suspicious footage of a ballboy to bring forward. I assume that it was done off the field. Peter King mentioned that he spent a pregame with an official and noted how seriously they took watching over the gameballs. Maybe you know more about the pregame ball treatment. You appear to have inside knowledge of the procedure, please tell me where you sourced this information? You may be an expert on the subject...don't keep it secret. My position is that every NFL game has participants that are cheating on various levels. There are plenty of players using PED's, there coaches that have stolen signals, there are owners that have been in contact with other teams coaches, there are GM's that have been in contact with players approaching free agency, players that cheat on the concussion tests...on and on And I don't feel that deflating the ball rates high on the cheating scale.That's right, I don't believe that every cheat is equal. I don't think jaywalking is the equal to murder, and I don't believe deflating a ball is as serious as throwing games, or targeting a player for injury rewards. MY list looks about like this... 1. Throwing games, gambling. 2. Bribing officials 3. Conspiring to injure a player 4. Taping teams practices, bugging rooms... espionage. 5. Using PED's 6. Amplifying crowd noise through the PA 7. Negotiating with players, coaches, under contract to another team. 8. Fighting on the field ...... 15 Deflating the ball 16. Late Hits Do I believe someone from the Pats (probably Brady and his ballboy or the equipment manager. I don't think Belichick is involved) doctored the balls? I think that's most likely, but I certainly don't rule out a frame (or even a weird temperature change, I don't know the exact conditions for their balls at Gillette. They may be kept under different conditions than the opponents balls, too). The NFL is filled with guys just as driven as Belichick, that's why they have had all these kinds of rules in place...everyone is looking for an angle, and it's nothing new. Lawrence Taylor wrote about the opposition sending hookers and blow to his hotel room the night before games. Matt Bowen (ex-Bill) talks about teams sending people to scour the opposing teams hotel room for left behind game plans.That is the atmosphere that the people in the league operate in. Any negative comments from rivals and ex-players (particular from those competing for the "Best Ever" title) are hard to consider impartial, so I don't care what Mark Brunell, Jerry Rice (smuggest of all time), or Troy Aikman (America's Favorite Homer) say. So much jealousy, and pettiness there (just like the fans here). I feel a heavy fine would be enough, but if the league wants to satisfy the bloodlust of the crowd, a short suspension, or the loss of a draft pick or 2 would be fine. Disqualifying them from the Super Bowl...ridiculous. There is no proof that this was anything more than a single game transgression. In my opinion it is the officials responsibility to keep the ball regulation, and if they didn't catch them in the prior games, it's too late. There is already a fine in place for this transgression ( Starts at $25,000 someone said. That gives you a good idea where it ranks. This case is on the extreme end, but to leap from that, to "suspend the coach for a year", is way out of line) . If some want to strut around, and claim that the Pats were never that great, that is fine, but this doesn't change my opinion of them. I gain no pleasure from it. The only pleasure I will get is when the Bills stamp all over the Pats with Brady. If I find out later that EJM had deflated a ball, it won't take a bit of satisfaction away from me. It's the game within the game. Edited by HoF Watkins, Today, 03:13 AM.

No, I'm not. A guy gets caught with a corked bat a few times, they don't suspend the coach for a year, let alone the player. Or forfeit a series. Some of he penalties suggested have been way out of line. And this isn't anywhere near BountyGate. A game suspension (baseball has way more games, so it's relative) wouldn't be out of line, IF they could prove who did it. Yeah, that's fine. Read my posts first.

What are the penalties for those transgressions? Forfeiture? Season Suspension? A million dollar fine? Coaches fired? Player and coach suspended? Nah...

Now you guys can ramp up your bitterness a notch. Deep down, this is probably what you really wanted to happen.

First off, I was responding to someone's retort that the balls could be doctored on the field, using a pump pin, through sleight of hand. Go back and read it. I also mentioned that if it happened within the stadium (as opposed to the field area), there would be cameras showing activity where the balls are kept, and I definitely believe that security cameras are on by that time. If the officials are there, security cameras would be on. They are probably on 24/7. Even if they only show who enters the room where they are kept, it would at least narrow it down to those people. I never claimed that there wasn't enough time between when the officials test the balls and the game, to deflate them. I responded to the assertion that "it would only take a second" to accurately, and consistently deflate the balls during the game that quickly, and without there being some questioning of his motions at some point. There are tons of cameras on the field filming cheerleaders, the bench, the coaches, the HoF ex-players on the sidelines. Someone would have caught suspicious footage of a ballboy to bring forward. I assume that it was done off the field. Peter King mentioned that he spent a pregame with an official and noted how seriously they took watching over the gameballs. Maybe you know more about the pregame ball treatment. You appear to have inside knowledge of the procedure, please tell me where you sourced this information? You may be an expert on the subject...don't keep it secret. My position is that every NFL game has participants that are cheating on various levels. There are plenty of players using PED's, there coaches that have stolen signals, there are owners that have been in contact with other teams coaches, there are GM's that have been in contact with players approaching free agency, players that cheat on the concussion tests...on and on And I don't feel that deflating the ball rates high on the cheating scale.That's right, I don't believe that every cheat is equal. I don't think jaywalking is the equal to murder, and I don't believe deflating a ball is as serious as throwing games, or targeting a player for injury rewards. MY list looks about like this... 1. Throwing games, gambling. 2. Bribing officials 3. Conspiring to injure a player 4. Taping teams practices, bugging rooms... espionage. 5. Using PED's 6. Amplifying crowd noise through the PA 7. Negotiating with players, coaches, under contract to another team. 8. Fighting on the field ...... 15 Deflating the ball 16. Late Hits Do I believe someone from the Pats (probably Brady and his ballboy or the equipment manager. I don't think Belichick is involved) doctored the balls? I think that's most likely, but I certainly don't rule out a frame (or even a weird temperature change, I don't know the exact conditions for their balls at Gillette. They may be kept under different conditions than the opponents balls, too). The NFL is filled with guys just as driven as Belichick, that's why they have had all these kinds of rules in place...everyone is looking for an angle, and it's nothing new. Lawrence Taylor wrote about the opposition sending hookers and blow to his hotel room the night before games. Matt Bowen (ex-Bill) talks about teams sending people to scour the opposing teams hotel room for left behind game plans.That is the atmosphere that the people in the league operate in. Any negative comments from rivals and ex-players (particular from those competing for the "Best Ever" title) are hard to consider impartial, so I don't care what Mark Brunell, Jerry Rice (smuggest of all time), or Troy Aikman (America's Favorite Homer) say. So much jealousy, and pettiness there (just like the fans here). I feel a heavy fine would be enough, but if the league wants to satisfy the bloodlust of the crowd, a short suspension, or the loss of a draft pick or 2 would be fine. Disqualifying them from the Super Bowl...ridiculous. There is no proof that this was anything more than a single game transgression. In my opinion it is the officials responsibility to keep the ball regulation, and if they didn't catch them in the prior games, it's too late. There is already a fine in place for this transgression ( Starts at $25,000 someone said. That gives you a good idea where it ranks. This case is on the extreme end, but to leap from that, to "suspend the coach for a year", is way out of line) . If some want to strut around, and claim that the Pats were never that great, that is fine, but this doesn't change my opinion of them. I gain no pleasure from it. The only pleasure I will get is when the Bills stamp all over the Pats with Brady. If I find out later that EJM had deflated a ball, it won't take a bit of satisfaction away from me. It's the game within the game.

Nope, this guy did... Nope. It's hard to keep up with posters coming at me with weak arguments ,and diversions. Give them to me one by one.

Another diversion.

There would still be footage of a guy doing something to the ball, even if what he is doing is hidden, and there is plenty of archived footage.

TO quote another poster "If it's not an advantage, then why do they do it, and why is it against the rules?"

THen there would be footage from a wide angle, of him doing something on the downlow.

Still, it's a guy standing with these 12 balls, doing this and he is supposed to go unnoticed by cameras, AND officials? If this is happening on the sidelines, there has to be footage. And if it's happening inside the halls, there has to be footage of someone entering the area, if not in the room.

Would they disqualify a team from the World Series for a corked bat? What exactly is the punishment for a corked bat, or even the same team using corked bats? Fines, Ejection? Suspensions? Managers suspended? I think the corked bat is a worse transgression, but let's call them equal.

Yeah, but supposedly the balls are all deflated to the same pressure.

Right. A guy going around ball to ball, or standing next to them (not sure how they are stored), trying to act nonchalant, every game, every season, and it wouldn't look suspicious watching it now? And no one, not a fan in the stands, or any of the cameras have that scene recorded?

THen they should be easy to deflate.

My point is that that every team would be penalized, and every coach suspended because they all have had PED users caught. But you want to start now, with the Pats. Fair enough, let's see how the BIlls fair under those conditions...