enlightener

wow way to miss the point entirely. guess you didnt read more than one line in what i wrote and then restated the argument to make sense only to yourself. Did you read or understand anything about being perfect and not losing, period? Also Brady has played more seasons than montana and his defense won his last superbowl for him in the last 2 minutes. Who are you to assign the values to afc championships? no one cares about those really, or superbowl losers. If you hadnt ever noticed, the Bills are looked down on for their appearances only to lose, its judged as a completely negative accomplishment even though it actually isnt. But again the argument is greates qbs. If a qb can make sure a superbowl you arrived at is won, and he did it with some proficient offensive output...it is a bigger accomplishment than going only to end up losing once there. Last point. Would Montana have looked better had he made it back with the cheifs and lost? NO, he would have come off as too old and flawed, instead of Joe montana- worlds greatest QB. if you cant accept this logic, i dont know what more i can tell you to fix your flawed perspective on this.

FIrst I want to point out Beerball and I have the same opinion on this...interesting. Second, While you claim its hard for us to be impartial to Brady on here, You are the one who is being partial to Jim Kelly and afc championships, which is how you derive your opinion on brady being better than montana. For us to discount bradies 2 SB loses and give Joe credit for not having made it to another 2 SB's It would mean we would also be discrediting all of Kellys SB's And we rightly should if we're judging "greatest of all time" This honor would have to go to someone who has won a superbowl..or 4 and has nothing to to with just being great, like Kelly was. You can judge kelly on his probowls, stats and afc championships etc. But for greatest of all time you certainly should look at 2 losses where Brady couldnt figure out how to make a win happen with relatively very little points on the board from the other teams. He almost had a third loss which his defense handed to him as a last second victory, then theres was the cheating to get to 4. But back to the two losses. Lots of teams make it to the SB, lose and are forgotten. Lots of teams go and win and the QB is forgotten because he was a nobody and the teams defense and skill players won the SB for them more than they did as QB. Brady lost two SBs while having a hall of fame coach and many all pro defenders in tow. Also having continuity of a system year after year and a couple studs on offense at times too. Randy Moss, Corey DIllon, wes welker. Since its a team sport we cant know for sure who really lost those 2 SBs for the Pats but I saw Brady sucking in those games and with Joe...no one ever has to wonder. Perfection in winning is harder than consistent winning. It has a synergy makes those wins larger in value than 4. Its a perfect 4. Could have been a perfect 3 and I still might say Joe is better than a boring, safe throw making Superbowl losing QB like Brady. I dont think Brady is nearly as "great" as Joe for many reasons actually, but the 2 losses,to me, detract and are a negative to his legacy. Now you know, and knowing is half the battle, Yo JOE!

ok had to step in here....he is still second to montana. Montana had no losses in superbowls which trumps 2 losses. Second, montana wasnt accused of cheating (except by his wife) so bradys last bowl was an asterisk win which in my book counts as less than a win. I give brady 3.9 wins minus 2 losses =1.9 vs Joes 4.0 its still not close. neither player can account for their teams talent aside from their own, so not a factor. Pats D was better than san frans anyway. Pats also lost last game of a perfect season scoring what 14pts? Joe didnt ever even sweat. If you ever read my post on this youd know only one person can sell his soul and be the "greatest of all time" and Joe did that way before Brady tried.

First ,while yes we lead the league in rushing and tyrod set a record for ya da ya da ...he did that to the detriment of about 100 passing plays that went for qb rushes instead. What good is leading the league in rushing if you are often behind, trying to pass, and scrambling instead? I dont get "amazed" anymore by all his running around. Its highly frustrating and annoying. A good rushing team needs to run with its running backs to hold a lead and play out the clock. Not lose to the giants, chiefs, eagles, pats, and skins while your qb dorks around throwing bombs on third and 3 or worse-3 yard flares on third and 10! Or worse yet -scrambling for 14 yards on 3rd and 15 that get called back for holding anyways. Lets be honest, with his slow release and inability to read the middle of the field, we are stuck with a qb who plays it safe and does everything ( i mean everything ) outside the hash marks. Will tightwad throw a 10 yarder to a tight end crossing? Nope. Will he hit anyone crossing the middle, ever? nope. How many slants were thrown this year? I think about zero. How are the rac yards for receivers on this team? Crap. The only middle type pass he throws is to a rb that hooks for 2 yards. But the player has to be stopped. He hit watkins and hogan for 2 nice stop routes last sunday. Both stopped, and on the sideline. His tds a few weeks ago, a fade to watkins, a hook out to woods, both on the outside. see the pattern yet? his other tds, almost all deep sideline passes. He tried exactly 2 deep posts down the middle this year. missed bad on one and connected on the other in double coverage. His sideline deep ball last week was in double coverage too, he still throws em, doesnt read it (or care?). watkins had to fight off the cb enough to get offensive PI. Ill admit he has great touch so its safe and watkins may catch it. He started the year doing this to harvin with some success. But this is all he has. When hes not going deep sideline hes throwing annoying little flares to the tight end or back. Always diagonal and outside the hash and for 3-4 yards. Usually results in a quick tackle on third and long. No first down. He doesnt care, its safe and maybe the receiver will break it. Do they? Nope. His other lame asset, running, has given us a ton of garbage time points, and yes a few game winners. But the problem is even his scrambles, almost every single one, are to the outside. He wont just shoot through the middle. With the middle WIDE OPEN, he stops, deeks backwards then runs sideways often losing ground and barely getting it back at the sideline. When he has a choice to cut back these outside runs, he doesnt. He just fakes in, but always goes outside, always and often short of the marker. And should we talk about all the holding penalties we got when he did this weird stop-go backwards and run outside move? They looked nice and all, til the flag got thrown. I think we had about 10 like that. Maybe its Roman. I tried to just focus on the middle of the field last week to see if any receivers crossed at all. Sme plays didnt have anyone, so maybe its not all the qbs fault. But this doesnt excuse his lame style of jumping backwards and trying to run around the Defensive End everytime he gets nervous in the pocket. Its decision making. Like his decisions to throw deep balls on third and short. Or the plays he SHOULD and COULD have scrambled on since he cant seem to throw an easy 5 yarder to someone. All year he would to go deep on 3rd and short, short on third and long, and run on third and very long. Bottom line is hes playing it safe, and his pretty deep ball passes cover up a huge hole in his game. His unwillingness to even try running up the middle bothers me and makes me question his courage. I watched itty bitty Kellen Moore hang in there and hang in there and deliver all kinds of passes all over the field. Especially third down passes. He was a better qb last week in his first start that tightwad was in week 16. Id take him straight up for "t mobile" ( where all calls must be either long distance or you can hand walk a letter) Time to switch carriers, we need a new QB next year.

not as dumb as saying sj was better than lee evans was because he had 1000 yard seasons. I guess reed and moulds werent that good either.

yes for sure YES! wait i thought it said $3 dollars. So no then. ....and advice-use a poll.

badol, i told you stats and evidence like this go right over the heads of the posters in this thread. Yes its true, i think shady would have gotten 15 yards on that play, not the go ahead td, and would have ran some plays to the sideline that karlos and g.lie took for 10+. numbers dont lie. Just people. People who defend their favorite starters no matter what....until they are cut or traded at the end of the season.

as usual, one line saying nothing, only ripping someone who doesnt like your guy, with nothing to back up your opinion. except going with maybe one unrelated element like "duuuuuuh shadys goin to duh pro bowl" and here with "yup" strong argument! see my post "shady trade will set this team back for years" written 5 months ago

oh you mean mckoy right? rookie. ya, they miss then miss again, then he gets 1 yard, cj did that too.

No it wasnt....yes it scored alot but its deceiving....it lead the league in 3 and outs....especially in a row. This allowed teams to gain momentum, tire out our defense and get ahead on the scoreboard. Tyrod would throw a few garbage time tds but never enough. We lost to kc, Washington, the first pat's game, Cincinnati, and the giants from this. The second pats game, second half of the jets game and the titans game all suffered from poor offense as well. Had we lost the jets game or titans which we barely won, the season would have been over much sooner. That and alot those points came against teams we lost to inc the jags and from two miami wins...id rather beat alot of teams close and sustain some long drives than pile up points in garbage time and against bad teams.

[quote name="Ryan L Billz" post="3819020" He didn't deserve pro bowl ? Bills lead league in rushing at 148 yards a game. They did one thing right. ooooh lead the league so mckoy did all that himself right? It wasnt gillislie williams or the qb who will set the team record for rushing yards this year?....So when our substandard qb cant read the field and takes off running, you give credit to the oft injured running back and then the whole orginization like its a good thing? Your takes are weak and your stats irrelevant. Ypa is the important stat and qb scrambles are a unintended way to inflate that stat. But at least you finally used a stat,or even had a take... Finally

i dont know you but i like how you think...but you just cant attack a starter on the board. Even with logic and evidence aside from the stats....the mouthbreathers will ignore it all to flame your thread. I had many a fight and thread locked for attacking players here a year or two before it was popular. Winners like trent edwards, TO, SJ, Mckelvin, CJ and Mario williams. ALL of whom were defended as top flight premier pro bowler. Where did any end up after the bills? How are mario and mckelvin looking these days? Now im on watkins for dropping down on purpose and losing focus on balls in traffic. I just have to wait another year so it can all seem like what im saying was "their idea"

Im confused how he couldnt get 1 yard on 3 tries in a game we needed to stay in the playoff hunt. 3 runs where he carried no one forward and some how brought the ball straight down into the turf....3 prowbowl short yardage plays....is this the impact he was supposed to have?Something doesn't make sense here. Is the pro bowl for the underperformers or the best at their position ? Who to enlighten?

agree and I noticed shady looking alot like cj spiller the last few games. also, even his 100 yard games were lacking the homerun, alot of 15 -20 yard carries, which is nice...but 8 mil $ a year nice? I saw gillislie and williams take em to the house alot of times on precious few carries when shady would have just juked and jived for 15 yards. Plus shady helped us lose in phili, with all his antics pumping up a team that beat us by just 3. And speaking of injury, has shady been durable? wasnt this the knock on Goodwin and Watkins too for a while? what good is a top tier back if hes out half the games? Shady is proving a bit fragile. i made a post BEFORE the season that the shady trade would set this team back for years, just based on the players involved and contract. I waited after shady started the season hurt (from training camp) Now i see him running like spiller, shooting off his mouth, hurt again. Now I can say he hasnt been anymore helpful at winning games than CJ and Fred were. In fact williams and gillislie look more effective and better for our offense than the juking jiving stopped for a loss runner shady is becoming. PS I said it before the season so that counts even when he had his big games...big games that resulted in about 3-4 wins. Maybe not everyones a troll because they dont worship the top starters on a team. Who dont you like Ryan?? anyone? well wecan have our opinions, Still backing SJ by the way? Hes doing real good since leaving.

Did mario ever call out a coach before rex? Its not like he has ahistroy of this....laziness yes, but not pointing the finger.