Mickey

Don't diminish the importance of a good kicker Mr. Norwood. The best kicker we have ever had was Christie and we didn't find him under a rock. We stole him from Tampa and paid him good money. He was worth every dime and then some. We could scour the world looking for a talent everyone else has missed or we could just go out and get a guy who had proved he is a stud kicker. Maybe that is Vinatieri, maybe it is a draft pick, maybe some one else. I don't care who it is but lets not skimp here, we need a sure thing. No gambles.

Of all the teams in the NFL, no team should appreciate how important a kicker is more than the Buffalo Bills. A solid kicker is worth his weight in gold. There is nothing better than needing a 47 yarder at the buzzer to win a game and knowing that your kicker is going to nail it. We had that for years with Christie, he was trouble and worry free. TD has tried to get by skimping at this position and it is time to admit that this has been a mistake and get a solid kicker in here. Vinatieri might not be the best option but if it comes down to him or Lindell, sign Vinatieri and don't look back. That being said, if there is another solid guy available either in the draft or in free agency, I have no objection to us going that route. Please TD, don't make us go through another season of Rian "the shank" Lindell.

Well, I did go way out on a limb when I said "Yeech" about his first game against Texas when he went 13-29 for 127 yards, threw 2 picks and was sacked 4 times. Obviously that was over-the-top pure bias for which I deeply apologize. I should have left out the "yeech" so that readers could reach their own conclusions but that would have interfered with my plan for world domination. Curses.

It's Friday, when I wasn't reading Tulane Athletic Dept. press releases, I was playing with the dog in the woods behind the office.

I'll buy that. That is one thing I wondered about when I was checking out the number of sacks. There was no way to tell much about the quality of the line from just reading about the games. I thought that simply given how much they had to play from behind, it was encouraging that he still didn't get sacked much.

Yeah, I gave it up myself recently and am sticking to football. I haven't tried the ignore button yet but I guess that is the next step.

That is fair enough. I guess what I am not sure about is what constitutes fumbling "a lot"?? Is that really more than most? Average? Less than most?

I think that is a valid comparison in the limited way you present it. I haven't really thought much about who he reminds me of but in terms of skills, Favre and JP are pretty similar. Strong arm, fearless, excitable, good movement in the pocket and a little pig headed. Kelly had some of those traits. One thing I worry about is that he is from southern California. It seems silly but I am RJ-shy when it comes to the surfing set.

Well, I can't argue with the eight ball, an unimpeachable source is an unimpeachable source. We will just have to wait and see. One thing for sure is that he is new and that is always exciting to watch. Going into next year, the biggest question mark on the team is the QB which is also the most important position on the team. I am hoping that Lee Evans and Moulds will make it easy on JP. That is a nice pair for a new QB to lean on.

Really? I forgot to count the fumbles but I don't think he really had very many. My take on those numbers is not that he is turnover prone at all, especially given how bad that defense was and how they had to play from behind a lot. If I had to sum it up, I'd say that the most encouraging trait he showed in college was the ability to put together a scoring drive in a hurry. I really didn't see anything jump out at me as really negative. If I had to pick one criticism it would be that he had good games against bad teams, bad games against good teams and so-so games against so-so teams. In short, he didn't seem to be able to hoist the team on his shoulders and pull one off mostly on his own. That is not very revealing, I know but that is the feeling I got after reading everything I could find on his college years. Tulane was such a mediocre program that it is really difficult to evaluate one guy. It always is in a team sport I guess but even more so with a team like that which was so good on offense, appalling on defense and with a schedule that ran the gamut from Texas to Louisiana-Monroe.

Well, he was on a team with an unbelievably bad defense. If you take that into account, I think averaging only two sacks a game shows that he can get around on his feet pretty well. Some people go over the top on that and talk as if he is the next Michael Vick. Not quite. Plus he had twice as many TDs as picks and that is not too shabby at all, again, given the team he was on. Of course, you can't listen to me because I am biased against Losman, even when I praise him, just ask KRC.

If you say it is so, it must be. I see that you have ignored the direct quote showing that your assertion that I "completely ignored the positive" was false. Just another case of where you are right even when you are demonstrably wrong.

Ken, do I really need to go back through the firts post and quote word for word each and every time I included positive information to demonstrate that your take that I pointed out the negative "...while completely ignoring the positive..." is totally wrong? Maybe one example will suffice: "In a C-USA showdown, Tulane loses to Houston 45-42. The game was made close by a furious comeback by Tulane who was down 28-7 at the half and 42-21 in the 3rd Q. JP goes 25-34, 264 and 1 pick. He throws for 3 and runs for 2 touchdowns and was only sacked once and that was on the last play of the game. He engineers an 84 yard drive in 8 plays that took only 1:41 off the clock. Even though he lost the game, I am willing to bet that of all his college games, this is the one that caught TD and MM’s eye more than any other he played. They were down and had to throw like crazy so Houston was after him and still, he made play after play. On top of that Houston was a good team that year, much better than Army." Completely ignoring the positive????

Actually, what I did was put his stats, good and bad in one place on a game by game basis with a little info on each taken from Tulane's own press clippings. Of course, that required that I actually read all of them including the linked play by play reports rather than just cut and paste a general summary with no context. That is why I was able to remark, for example, that despite making a mistake on one play, he came right back the next series to complete a long one. Never the less, by all means, feel free to mischaracterize the post as including only his negative plays. Why let the truth get in the way?

Now that JP is the man, lets take an in depth look at his college stats. He replaced the graduated Pat Ramsey in 2002 as the starter at Tulane. Here is the Reader’s Digest version of the life and times of one JP Losman: His 2002 season: He opens against Division I-AA Southern and pulls off a 37-19 win. He was 13 of 23 for 183 yards and ran 5 times for 37 yards including a 4 yard TD run. He had two TD passes of 18 and 44 yards. Midway through the second quarter, he was playing so bad they pulled him for a couple series to calm him down. I couldn’t find a play by play on this one or stats on sacks or fumbles. In his second start he gets a win against Houston, 34-13. He goes 14 of 25 for 208 with 1 int., 2 fumbles and 2 TD (37 and 28 yards). He was sacked 3 times. Of his 3 turnovers, Houston got a FG once and fumbled it back inside the Tulane 10 twice so JP got away with some goofs that time. He rushes 5 times for -14 yards. The following week against East Carolina, JP loses his first game 24-20 on the road in the rain. He goes 31-47 and 236 yards but throws a pick that led to a FG. No TD passes. He was sacked twice for -28. One of those came on 2nd and goal from the 6, a loss of 9 yards that forced Tulane to kick a FG instead of getting the TD. He rushes 7 times for minus 12. JP loses another one, this time to Memphis in a blow out, 38-10. He goes 21-31 for 188 and a pick with 1 TD pass late in the fourth after it was pretty much over. He was sacked 5 times for 39 backward yards. However, he does have one 22 yard run. His pick was in the first quarter and was returned 48 yards leading to a TD that put them behind 14-zip. He had a number of fumbles but at least two were recovered by his own guys. He was replaced in the 3rd quarter for two series before being put back in. Tulane and JP are next blown out 49-0 by Texas, then ranked 3rd in the nation. He was sacked 4 times for -41 yards and was 13-29 for only 127. He gained 40 yards on some runs to offset the 41 lost on the sacks. He threw two picks and overthrew an open receiver in the endzone. He also had a TD pass dropped. Yeech. JP has a field day against powerhouse Louisiana-Monroe and gets a win, 52-9. He goes 21-35 and 300 yards with 4 tds and only one pick and one sack. He fumbles once but his own guys get it. He runs only a few times for not much. JP gets another win, this time against Cincinnati, 35-17. He finishes 14-23 for 163 including 2 TDs and he runs for one as well. He is sacked 4 times and fumbles once. Five runs for 24 yards not including the negative yardage from the 4 sacks. JP gets another win as Tulane beats Alabama-Birmingham, then 3-4, by the score of 35-14. He goes 15-25 but for only 108 yards. He did throw for 2 TDs and ran for one, a 7 yard scamper on 4th and 1. He was sacked only once and had 5 runs for 24 yards. Tulane beats up on Navy (1-7) by the score of 51-30. JP has a great day going 25-35 for 329 yards and 5 TD passes against just one interception. No stats available to check on sacks. Tulane and JP get embarrassed by 1-9 Army, 14-10, at home no less. JP is sacked 5 times and goes 24-40 for only 172 yards with 2 interceptions including one at the Army 23 with 40 seconds left as Tulane was trying to finish off a potential game winning drive. He earlier threw one at the goal line on a 2nd and 10 play from the Army 24. No TD passes but he did run for one. Tulane finishes the season with a 31-10 win against 6-5 Southern Miss. JP goes 11-19 and 165 yards including a 64 yard TD pass on a 3rd and 12 play. He ran 5 times for 28 yards and was sacked only once for a 4 yard loss. No picks and no fumbles. Tulane beats Hawaii in the Hawaii bowl, 36-28. JP was 20-39 for 240 yards. He ran 12 times for 21 yards including two short TD runs. For the season, JP goes 205-327, 16 TD passes, 8 picks and approx 24 sacks. His 2003 season: Tulane opens with a loss to TCU 38-35. JP throws a pick just inside TCU territory in the middle of the 4th Q. with Tulane down 31-28. The pick leads to a TCU touchdown making it 38-28 with only 5 or 6 minutes left. Tulane scores but the ensuing onside kick is recovered by TCU. JP goes 25-42 for 303 and 2 TDs but throws 2 picks, is sacked 3 times and fumbled once but it was recovered by Tulane. He lost 27 yards on the sacks but gained 51 yards on 4 carries, netting him 24 yards on the ground. Tulane gets their first win of the season against Northwestern State winning in OT 27-24. This game was all but lost when NW State’s kicker missed a short field goal at the buzzer that would have won it. JP goes 29-48 for 353 and 4TDs to go against 1 pick, 1 fumble and 3 sacks for minus 27. The fumble was deep inside the opponents territory so that one hurt. JP has one of his best games as Tulane upsets Mississippi State 31-28. They were down 14 in the 4th when JP threw 3 of his 4 TD passes. He goes 29-47 for 4TDs, no picks, no fumbles and only 1 sack. He runs for 17 on 5 carries. Tulane and JP romp over Army, 50-33. He goes 26-34 for 350, no picks, no fumbles and 5, count ‘em, 5 TD passes. He is sacked twice and runs 6 times for 33 yards. This avenges their humiliating loss to Army in 2002. Texas obliterates Tulane, 68-18. JP has a pretty miserable day going 13-29 for 186, 2 picks, 1 fumble and only 1 TD. Down 7-0, he fumbled after being sacked on their first series turning it over to Texas at Tulane’s 13 yard line, Texas promptly makes it 14-0. However, JP shows his pluck by completing a 77 yard pass the very next series ultimately leading to a TD. That was, however, pretty much the only highlight of the day for Tulane. JP is also sacked 4 times. In a C-USA showdown, Tulane loses to Houston 45-42. The game was made close by a furious comeback by Tulane who was down 28-7 at the half and 42-21 in the 3rd Q. JP goes 25-34, 264 and 1 pick. He throws for 3 and runs for 2 touchdowns and was only sacked once and that was on the last play of the game. He engineers an 84 yard drive in 8 plays that took only 1:41 off the clock. Even though he lost the game, I am willing to bet that of all his college games, this is the one that caught TD and MM’s eye more than any other he played. They were down and had to throw like crazy so Houston was after him and still, he made play after play. On top of that Houston was a good team that year, much better than Army. Tulane’s ugly defense again lays an egg as Tulane loses to Louisville, 47-28. JP has a decent day going 16-29 for 243 and 3TDs but he also throws 2 picks and is sacked 3 times, losing 27, he had 5 runs for 28 yards. One pick is returned 33 yards for a TD. JP has his worst game of the year as Tulane gets dumped by Memphis, 41-9 to drop to 3-5 on the season. JP goes 12-32 for just 105 yards, is sacked 3 times losing 30 yards and throws 2 picks, one of which was returned for a touchdown in the second quarter. Things get worse for JP and Tulane as they go down to Navy 35-17. He goes 25-38 for 198 and for the third game in a row, throws 2 picks. He has only one TD pass and he is sacked twice. JP gets back on track against Alabama Birmingham, winning 38-24. He goes 16-33 for 255 and 3 TD against only one pick, zero sacks and he runs 4 times for 33. One TD pass is a 78 yarder. Tulane falls to 4-7 after losing to Southern Miss 28-14. JP has a good day going 21-36 for 244 and 2 TDs, no turnovers and only one sack. JP finishes his college career with a win against a very weak East Carolina team (they finished 1-10 that year). He goes 14-20 for 227 and 4 TDs against only 1 pick. He threw an 87 yard TD pass, the longest of his career. He also engineered a 7 play 80 yard drive in the 4th quarter that sealed the win. He was sacked 5 times losing 45 yards. For the season, he goes 251-422 with 27 TD passes, 13 picks and 24 sacks. Essentially, he finished his college career as a 60% passer with twice as many TDs as picks and averaged about 2 sacks a game and while he is no Vick, showed good mobility.

I hope you are right but you know something, JP is not exactly Michael Vick. More mobile than Drew? Sure he is but so is the stapler on my desk. I am not sure the sobriquet "mobile quarterback" really fits. You want to solve the sack problem, get an offensive line that can open holes on first down runs so we aren't facing 2nd and 11 all day long.

They didn't know better Bill. BB had Drew as his starter, only injury knocked him out and then, given how well Brady played, it was a no brainer to keep him. BB never concluded that DB stunk or that he couldn't win with him. All he did was recognize his good fortune in having Brady who turned out, to everyone's surprise including BB, to be the next Montana. There seems to be a myth on this board that NE dumped DB because they decided he was awful, that isn't what happened. They were forced to start Brady because of an injury and his performance, not any concerns about Drew, made the decision to keep one and not the other an easy one. If BB was so brilliant and DB so bad, Brady would have been starting that year instead of sitting on the bench waiting to get a lucky break. Brady starting wasn't a considered decision, it was the product of the fortunes of war.

...or are they more objective in weighing his performance and seeing both the good and the bad? Maybe they see that we were 3-13 without him and 9-7 with him and concluded that he was one of the reasons for the improvement as opposed to what the fans here see, that Bledsoe didn't make us 9-7, he prevented us from being 13-3 which, given how super we were before him is the only logical conclusion that can be drawn.

...or do we see the picks and not the win?

The question is whether he was better than the guy they could have taken with that first round pick, not whether he was better than AVP. You pick up able back-ups in the 4th round or later, you don't trade up in the second to get a back-up, solid or otherwise. Denney may be a lot closer to being off the roster than to ever being a starter. Besides, that isn't my opinion. The coaches themsleves must feel that way hence the Kelsay pick. Again, think of the people we could have had instead of the mediocre guy we ended up with. That is what separates the losers from the dynasties.

As bad as they were, they weren't as bad as the offense which positively reeked. So I stand corrected, they were not as much in shamble as the offense.

Sure its a crap shoot but that is what separates the also-rans from the legends, the mediocre from the great. The whole reason GM's are so important to a team and why they make the big bucks is to win those crap shoots.

Yeah, it still might all work out for TD and the team. He did a nice job on the defense but it wan't exactly in a shambles when he arrived. The offense was and up until the run at the end of last year, it hasn't improved much. If they had, Drew would still be here. It did not and TD knows it which is why he is making the move to JP. I think "Incomplete" is a fair grade. By now though, I was hoping for something better than that from a "genius". Seriously, I am no TD basher but by the same token, I don't see him as an untouchable genius. So far he has had mediocre results and he is running out of time to do better. Ironically, Ralph, the team, the GM and NFL football in Buffalo NY may all be running out of time.

4 years doesn't qualify as being patient? Any more patient and we would be indistinguishable from Bengals fans. Try their board, they are used to waiting patiently. As for complainers, the board is full of them, without complainers, for or against DB for example, there wouldn't be a board. I suppose you come here just to wave your pom-poms? Pointing out that Drew fumbled a snap or that Trey missed a block or whatever is no different than pointing out a trade or pick that didn't work out. Unless your position is that we can't complain about a missed field goal on a football message board or other such gaffes and blunders, your criticism of my post on that basis is inconsistent.

I don't think 4 years qualifies as "way too quick". Not in this league. Three was good enough for GW and Drew. Besides, I am not blaming him for anything. I am just pointing out that we spent two first rounders (one to Dallas and one to NE) and more, to try and get a QB who will get us to the SB. The result will be an untested, wet behind the ears mystery QB starting in year 5 of the TD era which thus far is devoid of post season play. That doesn't mean he should be fired but it does mean we should maybe put away the "genius" hat so many want to put on his head.