simpleman

I already listed 4 possible QBs to draft in #46 of this thread. I was replying to your post stating how hopeless it appeared to be to draft a QB beyond the first few top picks of the draft. You listed a number of busts in past history. I listed a number of current successful starting QBs in the league showing that it was not at all hopeless to draft a quality QB beyond the first few draft positions.BTW those who want to stay with TT, 180.

Yes QB is a huge gamble. They come from many rounds. Current starting QBs I would rather have than TT: Wilson 75 Carr 36 Prescott 135 A young Romo undrafted Bradey 199 Even Dalton 35

Just staying where we are we have a good chance of getting either Trubisky or Watson in the first. If not, we could even trade down, get a potential starting WR or S in the late first or early 2nd, plus an extra pick in the 2nd or 3rd and get Kizer or Kayaa with that extra pick. No need to trade up to get a top 5 QB. And for good measure even spend a late rounder to grab Kelly for the dreamers and sentimentalists. No need to trade up.

Some things you can coach up. You can use repetition to build muscle memory, you can point out mistakes and hope the player is open to changing their patterns. In this evaluation from Walter Football, throwing EJ to the fire early may have aggravated the weakness of allowing himself to panic. But some things are just not coach-able. If a QB just does not have the natural instincts between the ears, you can not develop those instincts. It appeared EJ was open to coaching. He was willing to work hard, he gave it everything he could. He just did not have the instincts there that could be honed. Some have them, some don't. You can develop the skills you are born with, but you can't develop what you you do not have. EJ failed not because he was thrown to the fire too early, he just did not have "it". Yes, he might have been a little better with the right coaching and slower development, but he ultimately still would not have had "it", even if everything had gone right for his development. . Weaknesses: Not a natural passer Decision-making Field vision Struggles to work through progressions Runs to quickly Spotty accuracy Can panic at times Didn't play as well against good defenses

So you are saying that every other possible vet QB out there is not as good as EJ or equal to him. I can't agree on that. EJ is BADDD!

Unfortunately everyone knows this, but Football is a business first. The owners want to maximize their profits by minimizing expenses like farm teams. It is better for business and profits to leave it to the colleges. It doesn't make the game of Football better, it just makes it more profitable. The reality is that it is "All about the money." Players want to minimize their risks of injury by limiting contact so they can make more money over a longer career. That is great for talented vets, but is a blockade for rookies fighting to break into the league. Again, for the successful vets it is "All about the money."

:thumbsup: A coach is there to be a objective observer of what you do right and wrong, they point it out and suggest ways to correct your mistakes and motivate you to do more of what you do right. As a player it is up to you to use their guidance to get better. If you are unwilling to listen and put in the effort to get better you will never get better.

I admit I never played QB in College, much less high school. But in any sport I have ever played the only way I truly ever got better was actually playing the game. I remember classes in bowling. I was above average before I was forced to completely redo my footwork and release. I ultimately had a nice approach and release to watch, but I still had about the same average. I just looked better doing it according to the pros. I spent hours hitting the ball into the wall in tennis in practice. I increased my strength and speed, but the only way I actually got better in the game (meaning winning) was playing in as many real games as I could against decent players. I keep hearing about development as spending years on the bench. I find it tough to believe that watching and waiting is the best way to get better. Spending time watching and being mentored by a Brady or a Manning may help. But sitting a bench watching a mediocre vet being mediocre or being coached by someone who never WAS an outstanding QB does not seem to be the best way to develop a QB. You need to PLAY to get better. To develop, CJ needs to play with first team talent. If he really has the brains and the desire, he needs to learn by doing against top NFL talent. He needs practice, practice, practice. If he has the drive, desire and is able to accept and process the valid critiques of what he does wrong and is willing to correct his mistakes, his ceiling will be sky high. If not, sitting on the bench for 20 years will not improve his game. Let him compete in the preseason in an open competition for the starting position, simply success or failure. People are not fine wine that ages simply by sitting for a long time. Book learning and watching over and over again are not how you learn. He has done that for a year in Buffalo. He did that in college. You learn by doing, period. This talk about ruining him by pushing him is bull. Either he has it or he doesn't.

I was not disappointed in what I saw in him in the brief stint in the game. He was no Tom Brady, but I thought he had promise. Did anyone look at the ALL22 on his game? I'm curious about how accurate he was. His throws did not seem WAY off the mark like a lot of EJs throws and many of TTs are. He threw all over the field. I thought both a throw to Watkins & Glass both could have been catch-able. His interception was a real gift to Revis, it was tipped way across the field to to him, not thrown toward him. Cardale just seemed to have a little too much trust in his own abilities. Considering how little time he has had to develop chemistry with the first string I was not too discouraged. I think he has to learn to dial back the gunslinger mentality a little, he could be a turnover machine if he doesn't get a little more careful. But I like his aggressiveness and cocky attitude. Just dial it back a little. Looking forward to seeing what he has and seeing if there is real progression in his decision making. His arm seemed just fine. I would love to see him work out before the season on his own with Watkins(if he is healed enough) , and our younger receivers to try to build some chemistry and mutual trust in each others abilities before camp.

Exactly! The Jets have even more reason to lose today than we do. The most competent team today will be the team that loses. Anyone who would judge Lynn or EJ on today's game is seriously delusional.

Lawyers out there. Is the fact that the exception is included along with the guarantee reduction paragraph, rather than in a separate paragraph by itself make it apply only to the reduction. Even though it states it refers to paragrah 5 clause in the actual text?

Am I reading it right to say that if the Bills release him before the 4th day of the NFL 2017 season, and he is not a member of the 90 man roster on that day, there is no guarantee ?

Regression in real Quantitative objective numbers, not in your personal subjective definition of regression. TT Regression: despite playing in one less game in 2015 than 2016 Down in completion percentage Down in total yards Down in TD % Down in # of TDs Down in Yards per attempt Down in Adjusted yards Down in Yards per carry Down in Yards per game Down 10% in QB rating Up in number of times sacked As far as QBs and rookies. Rookies are always a crap shoot, but the great ones can be great because in part because they rose up immediately when given their first real chance. Brady, Manning, Luck, Ryan, Marino, Newton, Wilson, Big Ben all had great years the first year they were given a chance. Many other not so greats like Dalton, Winston & others had good first years with their teams. Even RGIII Pre-injury. Many teams had much better records with a first year rookie than they had the previous year with a poor to mediocre vet. The best pro scouts never know for sure before the QB actually plays, but it does happen that first year. All rookie are gambles, even the top rated ones in the draft. I don’t have the answer for the QB next year, but they are out there to take a gamble on. It is the management’s job to find the Qb, not me. There are always options besides TT. And it is not about simply saving money by not overpaying for a mediocre TT. It is about using that extra cap space to build the rest of the team up. If a lesser player can get similar results and we use the money to build the rest of the team up and get us closer to the promised land of the playoffs, we are at least ahead for the future. I simply do not see TT as being the one who will get us to the playoffs. If like me, you don’t believe TT can get this team to the playoffs, and that TT is definitely not the long term solution; why would you not let him go and use the cap space to continue to build a better team for the future. Find a less costly mediocre QB that also can get you close, but not close enough, just like TT would. You end up with a better team built for the future when you finally do find the right QB. It is about finding the best options when faced with an unfavorable situation.

Exactly why I would like him back. If you are building a team with young players and rookies you need someone who is good at teaching and coaching them up. Developing players instead of hurting their development. With the cap, it just isn't reasonable to expect to bring in expensive FA at every position. Draft & Develop. Which Donnie sure seemed to have a good record as doing. .

I understand your view of reality, but I see it differently. I see more regression than I see progression. He was in a prove it year. and failed to prove he was not already at his ceiling. He is a simply passable, average, mediocre QB. You may be happy with an average mediocre football team that consistently is mediocre and average, like the Bills have been for so many years. To me constant years of 7-9, 6-9, 8-8 with a peak of 9-7 are not good enough. I don't expect the Bills to win the SB, but I want to actually have the excitement of being in the playoffs and thinking "wow, we could somehow make it",even if for only one game. I view the NFL as three seasons. Preseason, where you select your players and build your team. The regular season, where the teams fight to get a chance to play for the actual goal of the game, being the best. And the real season, the playoffs. The regular season is just the elimination round when teams fight to qualify to play the real games. If we are not in the playoffs,we are just the unworthy has beens who are not good enough to qualify for the real thing. TT is not good enough to make a mediocre team worthy. If all you want is mediocre, than pay the guy way too much just to remain a mediocre,not good enough team.I want a real team to root for. Not one who can beat other mediocre teams, but falls apart when they play real teams.

oops meant DB, thanks.

Now that Rex is gone, maybe we can bring back Henderson. He did a great job as DB coach.

:thumbsup:

Absolutely not. If people get over their cult of Pegula worship for NOT moving the team, their history with both the Sabres and the Bills so far has been horrible. Forget faith, hope and promises. Speaking the right words and making those bright promises may sound great, but the reality tells a different story.Their black and white record speaks sadly for itself.

OP, this is pretty close to a Trolling post. We all know you understand the cap and its realities. None of us cares if Pegula foolishly throws all his fortune into cornering the used Pet Rock market. But we do understand that there are so many major holes in the Bills roster, and we are so sick of all the excuses the team gives us for not putting together a winning professional roster that will give we fans a playoff team for the first time in 18 years. "We can't afford it under the cap". "If it wasn't for the cap...", "It was strictly a cap issue". With a fixed cap, throwing a huge chunk of that cap toward a mediocre game manager QB who has already reached his ceiling, who shows little improvement after two full seasons and 6 years in the league, and who will not get us to the playoffs means we will continue you hear the cap excuse from the Bills for years into the future. "We would have liked to sign him, but we can't afford (player X) under the cap". It affects us as fans directly. It is fine that you think Tyrod is way better than many of us do. We all can have our differing opinions on the value of Tyrod to the Bills finally making the playoffs after the longest playoff drought in the NFL. That is the real issue here. How capable does one think Tyrod is of leading the Bills fans to the promised land of the playoffs.You know it is not about the money being spent out of Pegula's personal fortune, it is about the cap. And you know that. Shame, Shame, Shame.

Time to treat this like the last preseason game. A loss is the best thing possible, but the Jets would be fools to allow us to lose to them. They have even more to gain from losing. This is truly a game where the winner is the loser, and the loser is the winner. Sit all the regulars and evaluate the backups for next year. Cardale should start.

So complains the 99% of Corporate upper and mid level management as they deal with exactly this reality. You deal with it.

Not that I am agreeing with the OP at all. But putting down his idea as stupid and silly that team management couldn't select the best OC, or DC, and a HC, rather than hiring a HC and trusting his judgement to select them all is a little harsh. I have always felt that the qualities of being a great OC or DC did not necessarily equate to the qualities of being a great HC. Maybe redefining exactly what a HC does and what qualities makes a great HC needs to be considered. It may not currently be done, but just maybe thinking outside the box and being innovative might just work. Like 17 years of doing the same thing has worked so well for the Bills. Just because something has not been done that way before does not automatically mean it would not work. Football tactics, plays, management methods evolve every year. Someone once took a chance and allowed minorities to play Pro sports, it had not been done before. Human history shows that advancements only happen when someone tries something different, and if they succeed, we all move forward. The Wright Brothers were laughed at in the beginning, Henry Ford was laughed at. Changing the way things are done on coach selections could fail miserably, but also it might not. I would not be upset if the ownership dared to try something new and innovative. After all,17 YEARS of doing the same thing has worked so well for the Bills! I would prefer that and failure to doing exactly the same thing again and yet another year of failure. At least the failure would have amounted to an effort instead of just another repeat performance I'm not agreeing with the specifics of the OP, just saying trying something new is not necessarily always a bad thing just because it has never been tried before.

I can't agree on this at all. Do you really think AW will still be at Safety with his health issues? Graham is really starting to show the effects of wear and tear. So we are in trouble at Safety. We most likely will not be able to afford to keep Gilmore at CB. CB is a question mark. We likely will not be able to afford to keep Woods, so beyond Sammy we have what quality at WR? The right side of the O line is still a tire fire at RT, and while Miller has become passable and average, he is is never going to be strong enough to overcome and compensate for a weak RT on that side. I'm not sure how secure Clay is with his cap and his performance next season. Behind him I'm not confident in TE. We obviously will need to use a high draft pick on QB. There is little available for a FA QB signing. At the least we need serious help at S & WR. Depth help all over the place. And are you really content on trusting Carpenter for another season? It is not just QB,

Calling KC a smoke and mirrors team is the highest complement to a coaching staff. Great coaching gets extraordinary results out of the ordinary. It's all about coaching! Although I think people have always underestimate Smith at QB. He may not be flashy or a Brady, but he simply gets the job done. What is his win loss record over the past few years?