ThurmasThoman

i could not agree more, i would take jackson over thigpen in a heartbeat. apparently, thigpen will never see the light of day though. so we can save that 6th round draft pick.

this is what i mean. "thigpen? really?" you know for an absolute, 100%, book it, put it in ink, tattoo it on your forehead, lock it down, rack it fact that fitzpatrick is NOT the answer. therefor, its time to bench him. thigpen would not do any worse. this "genius" playbook that were running has been good for 13-27 over the last 3 years, and fitz gets all his yards on screens and slants. there isnt a d1 quarterback, much less a pro quarterback, who couldnt make these throws. it is absolutely disgusting how bad ryan fitzpatrick is--i dont think people are comprehending how good our offense could be without him. ANYONE could make the throws he makes, and the difference is, fitzy CANT make the throws that most qbs can. he needs to go. immediately. he needs to be benched.

for today's nfl, that was a phenomenal defensive performance, on the road, against a team that can absolutely light it up. i have been mad at wanny all season, but to be mad at a rookie corner for not getting physical on the line with the best wideout in the game? come on, he SURELY would have been flagged. its not 1996 anymore, you cant d up all world wideouts anymore. speaking of the way the modern-day NFL works... what a coincidence that with a god awful quarterback under center who cant protect the ball and cant throw it further than 20 yards, we are 13-27 the last 3 years. what a coincidence.

all i can say, is fitz needs to be benched immediately. his numbers looked "good" because he barely escaped pressure 2 times, and got off some screen passes (like always.) he had 1 or 2 professional grade throws today--one to nelson over the middle, and one to jones on the sideline. its absolutely the most frustrating part of being a bills fan right now--that and the fact that some people still think fitz ISNT the problem. just turn to ANY other game on sunday, literally ANY game, and watch a series. every quarterback in the league is better than fitz. every single one. he does not have the tools to succeed on the nfl level. he never has. he didnt in college either, he was a not so great qb against second tier competition. hes a great guy, but hes a terrible qb. yes--if we switch to thigpen next week, we will be exponentially better. our season would be saved. i just hope the coaching staff feels the same sense of urgency i do.

Hmmmm... this is quite remarkable, never knew this to be the case. I think there are 2 ways one could look at this data: either a) winning a championship is an incredibly lucky conflux of the right qb, the right coach, the right coordinators, the right schedule, the right division, the right season, the right calls by the refs, and the right bounces of a ball--something that a "system" may be able to recreate several times (ie, a dynasty, like the early 2000 patriots) but something that is nearly impossible to recreate in difference scenarios (like scott pioli, from said patriots dynasty, going to the chiefs.) or b) this is just a random statistical anomoly, one that has occurred because coaches have either retired shortly after winning a ring (vermiel,) have stuck around for awhile with the same team after winning a ring, but never wanted to go elsewhere (shula,) or, have taken over incredibly bad teams because of their "i can fix anything and win anywhere" ego, and because the teams have been so bad, they were behind the 8 ball from the get go. I tend to think it's more of a "b" scenario, and eventually, the odds will even out, and a coach who has won a super bowl with one team, will win one with a different organization. its sort of like walking into a casino, sitting down at the roulette table, and hearing that the number 23 has never, EVER, hit. wouldnt you put a good deal of chips on 23? because of that, it behooves us to go after a super bowl winning coach.

i find it hard to believe that gailey is going to be here next year, UNLESS this team hovers around .500 for the remainder of the season, and plays like they did against kansas city and cleveland 4 or 5 more times in these last 9 games. ive said it before, and ill say it again. i think marty ball is coming to buffalo in 2013. with that said, there are 2 scenarios here: either a) gailey has lost the team, and the players have tuned him out or b) gailey has not lost the team, and the players have not tuned him out if it is scenario a, it would be clear as day to anyone who stepped foot on the sideline, in the locker room, or watched 5 minutes of practice. exit interviews at the end of the season with guys like jackson, scott, and barnett would reveal that to be the case, and nix would can gailey. IN THAT SCENARIO, if he suspects that to be the case already, what could possibly be gained by announcing that RIGHT NOW? The entire roster would know theyre playing for a lame duck coach, the season would be over, and our 3-4 bills, who sit 1 game back from the playoffs, would be done for the year, despite still having how many home games that need to be sold out? Just a terrible decision all around, and one that no manager on this side of michael scott would ever make. in scenario b, if these guys still like him, its the elephant in the room-ryan fitzpatrick and dave wannstedt are costing us games. now, theres a lot of bills fans that i wish nix could fire, but if we start next season with gailey, a new qb, and a new defensive coordinator? then yes, i will be extremely optimistic. i know thats "illegal," and considered "drinking the kool aid," but christ almighty is there talent on this roster. and in our garbage division, if you think we are that far away from not only making the playoffs, but hosting a playoff game, idk what to tell you. brady isnt getting any younger, the jets arent going anywhere, and if you think miami is a juggernaut in the making, i recomend you get nfl sunday ticket and watch a game of theirs - they suck. the future is bright in buffalo, of this i am sure.

Great post. I wish this entire board was more like you. It would be great in the morning to come here and read articles and posts that are somewhat optimistic--or even a spirited give and take with the "realists." Instead, sadly, it has turned into a place where every thread is either a) about Mario Williams needing to be cut after the season b) about how, if 16-0 is off the table, we should start shooting for 0-16 so we can draft a franchise quarterback and/or c) how we'll be the los angeles bills when ralph dies, so none of it matters anyways Now I too have had my moments of doubt this season--hell, if we cut fitz as I'm writing this post, I'm going to X out of this window, call out of work, pop open some champagne, and post smiley faces on here all day to celebrate--but with that being said, maybe "no one circles the wagons like the buffalo bills," but "no one pisses and moans and makes the football season less fun" than a buffalo bills fan. To me, as bad as the defense has been, the talent is there. And as bad as fitz has been, the points have been scored. And really, its been 1 bad half against the Jets, 1 bad quarter against the pats, 1 bad half against the 9ers, and 1 bad play against the titans. YOU CAN NOT CHANGE THE PAST, BUT... if spiller doesnt fumble against the pats to end the half, and the titans dont score that TD... we're 5-2, looking at a first round bye. Were healthy, were 1 game back from the playoffs, and in 9 days, the hardest part of our schedule is over.. EVEN IF... EVEN IF... we get absolutely steamrolled these next 2 weeks, the furthest back from the wildcard we could be is 3 games--with 7 to go. but if the steelers lose to the giants this week? The furthest back we could be from a wildcard is only 2 games. And those last 2 sentences I just wrote? That's what kills me about this board right now. No ones looking at other teams schedules, no ones looking at the standings, no ones having FUN following the buffalo bills. I dont have anyone to talk to (I live out of market) about how important the steelers/giants game is to the bills playoff hopes, because if you say something like that on here, you get run out of town for being a "kool aid drinker." Halfway through the season, the bills with the best o line theyve ever had, 2 all world running backs, all the talent in the world on d, and an easy schedule, 1 game back from a wildcard, and this place looks like one of those crashes on the atlanta thruway you talked about. Great post man, I wish everyone had some optimism and could have some fun following the bills again. "Bills are going to get smoked on sunday" Who CARES--look at the standings, not the box scores, it makes it more fun. PS: Giants went 9-7 last year, were 6-6 after 12 games, and had the 27th ranked defense. And won the super bowl. It's a different NFL than when we were kids. Parity reigns supreme, and on any given Sunday, any team can look like the best team in the league, or the worst. At the end of the day, a team that loses just as many games as it wins can win the super bowl - You never know when the season youre bitching about could turn out to be the season you want to remember forever.

The way I see it is like this: 1) as bills fans, collectively, we know that ryan fitzpatrick is NOT a great quarterback, and will never win us a superbowl. the nfl nation, collectively, looks at ryan fitzpatricks stats, says "hes a good quarterback," and therefore assumes the bills have a higher ceiling than they actually do. 2) as bills fans, collectively, we know that chan gailey is NOT a good game manager, and is outcoached in divisional games, and flustered late in games in general. the nfl nation, collectively, looks at our offensive output "sporadically" and assumes that we can put up points, and win some games. OK, with that being said... if you look at the bills season, it is the story of 3 halves. meaning: the first half against the jets, the second half against the pats, and the second half against the niners. other than that, we have played "wild-card" level football. as much as i hate fitz, as much as i hate gailey, you have to have to have to look at the talent we have on d, the talent we have on offense, the easy schedule we have in the second half, and the fact that were only 1 game back from a wildcard, and think (if youre a non-affiliated observer) "this team could make a run." HOWEVER, being bills fans, watching this team, knowing this team... its a long shot they make the playoffs. 9 wins gets a wildcard. right now, 6 seed is only 1 game over .500, and thats 8 weeks in. too short of a timeframe left for 2 (wildcard) teams to deviate that far away from .500, especially with so many games against one another. for example, dolphins are in 5th place at 4-3, colts are in 6th at 4-3, they both play each other this weekend, and pittsburgh goes to the giants, meaning theres a good chances that 4-4 is good for a wildcard halfway through the season. even if bills lose to texans to go 3-5, they would still just be 1 back from the 6 seed. not saying the bills get a wildcard, but no way 10-6 is the record of the 6 seed. not in a million years.

i see it more as, get a good qb, win some games, begin 15 year sell out streak. the best part is, if we go on to dominate for 12 years like the pats have, and brady and beliceck retire, and kraft dies, do the pats move??

Next time a pats fan calls us the toronto bills http://articles.baltimoresun.com/1993-08-06/news/1993218111_1_patriots-orthwein-expansion-franchise crazy how much things can change in the NFL landscape.

hopefully not. when mario signed here, the conversation in the national media was that it changed the perception of the city of buffalo in the eyes of free agents. we were committed to winning, and it was akin to reggie white signing with green bay. if people around the league start hearing that we want to run mario out of town because a) he keeps a fridge in his locker, and b) ONLY has 3.5 sacks despite playing injured for us, then we will never get anyone to sign here again, kind of like how every significant free agent WE have had for the last 15 years has bailed for greener pastures.

the facts that every article that has ever mentioned a team leaving to play in LA has NEVER included the buffalo bills? the fact that if you look at a list of cities that had teams when the NFL was formed, each city (aside from LA) still has a team, meaning LA is the only city in the history of the National Football League to permanently lose a team? (but will be getting one back...) the facts that people step forward every other month to say theyre willing to pony up cash, and the bills need to stay in buffalo? the fact that the commish wants the team to stay in buffalo? or are there some OTHER facts that you alone are privy to that you would care to share with us?

damn, if only there was someone within the colts organization who could have corrected the problem of not having the right coach to win a super bowl? it sucks that polian, as a gm, had to put up with that handicap. im just glad something like that has never happened to the bills. it would be terrible to have a team loaded with super bowl talent, but to have a coach who was, maybe, buddy buddy with the gm, and stuck around longer than he should have, and prevented that team from becoming a dynasty. we need a strong gm in buffalo to make sure that never happens.

ha, far from it my friend. its not exactly like the patriots have done much of consequence since 04... yeah, theyve played in the super bowl twice, and went 16-0... but were looking at it from the perspective of a team in the afc east.. we fear them, because they win our division, but its not like they are some OVERWHELMING force in professional football that wins the super bowl year in and year out. my only point to that last paragraph.. the patriots are "good" but theyre not "unparalled in afc east history, dominate the division for a decade" good. in the pre-2001-realignment NFL, they would be like... the minnesota vikings with warren moon. a good/very good team who posted good records with easy schedules, but could never get it done in the playoffs. kind of what they are now, except for the fact that they get the same schedule as their competition year in and year out, so they never fall out of place in the division. with regards to a bunch of lightweights making the playoffs, i would speculate that it would have the exact opposite effect. you would expect the bottom half of the league to beat up on each other, with maybe one or 2 average teams rising up from the fray to snatch wild cards... in the truest sense of the word, they would be "wild cards" because no one would know what to expect of them in the playoffs. at the top of the conferences, the teams would generally beat up on each other, with 1 or 2 rising to the top and getting those homefield advantage/bye slots. not to mention, you would STILL play 6 division games, so if the pats were head and shoulders above the rest of the east, they could/should go 6-0 in the division, and build an insurmountable lead right then and there.

I HATE the way the nfl constructs its schedule. i honestly think its a big part of why the bills havent made the playoffs in 12 years - coincidently, the league realigned 11 years ago. you know, (6) games against your division, (4) against the NFC, (4) against one division in your conference, and (2) within your conference based on the previous years standings. Just watching the Patriots pick apart the Rams... its absolutely ridiculous that in a league with 32 teams, 6 divisions, and only 16 games, were playing basically the same schedule as them, save for 2 games. The schedule just feels so... bland, and unfair. The patriots have to play ONE less road game, and get to play the rams, on a neutral field. but yet, they represented our conference in the super bowl last year. I think a big big reason that the patriots have owned the division since the league switched to this new scheduling procedure, is year over year, there is no way to catch the patriots if theyre playing the same games as us. right? does that make sense? i mean, they get to draft too. they get to sign free agents too. they get to hire new coordinators too. the ONLY way to weaken them is to make their schedule harder then the teams in their division. its just crazy. a "hard" schedule for us, is a "hard" schedule for them. an "easy" schedule for us is an "easy" schedule for them. My solution: try to stay with me. instead of every afc east team playing every nfc west team, you play the teams in the opposing conference that finished in the same place as you the previous year. (4 games) instead of every afc east team playing every afc south team, if you finish first or second, you play all the first and second place teams in your conference. if you finish 3rd or 4th, you play all the 3rd and fourth place teams in your conference. (6 games) still a home and away against your division. our schedule this year would be (with home/away games made up, but just for fun, lets pretend) ne @ ne nyj @nyj mia @mia cle @ cin jax @ ind oak @kc was @ min tb @stl new england, on the other hand, would be looking at buf @ buf nyj @nyj mia @mia nyg @gb no @sf bal @ pit hous @ ten den @ sd doesnt that seem more fair? more balanced? arent you instantly filled with hope that we could win the division, looking at that schedule, compared to theirs? doesnt a decade and a half of doom and gloom get replaced with optimism? do you think that maybe the fact that we play the same schedule as these !@#$s every year has anything to do with the fact that not just us, but our entire division hasnt been able to make up any ground on them for the past 12 years as well? sure, we get a wild card every now and then from our division, but thats about it...

also, it's kind of funny how the bills operate: we would bring this guy back. just to play devils advocate for a second: polians teams were never dominant forces in the league. they were always really good in really bad conferences/divisions. his bills teams: were dominated in the superbowls. absolutely dominated. his colts teams: they won ONE superbowl with peyton manning (maybe the best qb to ever play the game.) ONE superbowl. in all honesty, i think manning was such a good qb, no matter what team you put him on, they would win one superbowl every 10 years, just because manning is the qb. i mean, he was a really GOOD gm... but his teams, they were never GREAT. i would rather have scott pioli, who looks to be out in KC soon. he drafted brady, he built the defense from the ground up that won 3 superbowls. ok, so he had a dry run in kansas city--who cares. his track record in 5 years with the pats is better than polians 30 years in the league. idk man. sounds like when we brought back marv.

exactly. mario accomplishes more in getting out of bed in the morning and brushing his teeth than gailey, fitz, and 90% of our team have COMBINED in their ENTIRE nfl careers. not to say he shouldnt have told the coach, but whats gailey gonna say? "who are you? oh. well. dont tell me maryo, walk up to the press box and tell wanny, i think hes doing his morning soduku up there. you know i dont care about the defensive side of the ball." team doctors probably told him he tore his acl or had turf toe when he showed them his wrist anyways.

this seems like a stretch. how could la-whoever know that our GM is in trouble? the only person that can make that decision is ralph, and if he hasnt even gone to a home game yet this year, am i supposed to believe he is tweeting this la fellow inside news? pure speculation. now, thats not to say i dont think it wont happen. hell, i think EVERY bills fan knows at the bare minimum wannstedt is gone, probably gailey too, if we continue to struggle. but i think these "insiders" really just spend their time actually READING all the local papers and message boards, as opposed to collecting a paycheck. they have the same info as anyone on this board, and can use relative conjecture to come up with a story like this.

i used to want tebow as far away from orchard park as possible. i used to think fitz was the answer. fitz isnt the answer. tebow could be the spark that does so much for this organizations. next year - prime time games? probably 4 of them. playoffs - almost a certainty. i mean... fitz as a starter for the bills: 4 win season, 6 win season, 3-4 right now. tebow as starter for the broncos - divisional round of the playoffs. i dont care what it looks like, im a believer. get him here, lets make the playoffs.

anything else youd like to share with us, nostradamus?

seriously. "I wouldnt piss on him to put him out if he was on fire" wtf?? guy injures his wrist in the preseason finale. wears a cast (is he faking it?) STILL manages 3.5 sacks, with a bad wrist, under a defensive coordinator who only blitzes on 11% of the snaps, meaning mario is creating this pressure on his own... what are his alternatives? imagine if he had said "im injured, im not playing" and sat out? hes playing through injury. he took a flier and came to an organization that hasnt done ANYTHING for a decade and a half... granted we paid him a lot... but still... jimbo pitches him on how great the fans are, and people ready to cut him after 7 games that he played injured and STILL put up decent numbers. and you wonder why he "doesnt care" what the fans think? maybe its because the fans have no concept of what the situation is. fans not even smart enough to use google to figure out if there is such a thing as a simple wrist procedure, but are some how better qualified to say what this grown man should be capable of doing, medically, and professionally? and because the bills are bad, they wouldnt piss on him if he was on fire?? why dont MORE nfl players/coaches want to be associated with this organization?

http://www.ehow.com/about_6301041_orthopedic-wrist-surgery.html arthroscopic procedures to remove bone spurs, typically a very minor incision, recovery time of a few days. UNLESS he's faking it, and this is all a ruse so he doesnt have to play houston!

hmmmm, what an interesting thread. I would say that the worst regular season loss i have experienced in the last 20 years of following the bills was the loss at cleveland in 2008. something about that team... i cant explain it, but the jauron bills seemed *different* that year. it was almost as if THAT was the year that we were supposed to break the playoff streak, but for whatever reason, we just... didnt? we SHOULD have beat the broncos that year... we SHOULD have beat the cowboys that year... and we SHOULD have beat the browns that year. and i know, looking at the standings now, that game doesnt make a difference, because we were out of the playoffs by a long shot... but there was just something about that game.. the lead in to it, the cbs graphics showing us as alive for a wildcard... the fact that there was snow in the air, it was christmas time... and all they had to do was win that game to stay alive... and we freaking lost 8 to nothing. the most meaningless, pointless, embarassing score ever. eight to freaking nothing. what a weird year that was. actually... kind of looks like this one. close losses to bad teams, absolutely BLOWN OUT by better teams (56-10 new england, 38-7 new england, 26-3 pittsburgh,) and win just enough games to stay in the conversation. interestingly, we were 3-4 after 7 games then too...

yeah this loss was bad. what was worse for me was the alarming lack of excitement i had going into it. 3 years ago, i used to be pumped to watch the bills, and that was when we were 0-6, 0-7, 0-8... it just seemed like a young team, fighting, scrapping, getting better every week. going into the next season (last season) on a 4-4 streak to finish the season after going 0-8... anything seemed possible. that 5-2 start didnt seem like a fluke, it felt like the bills had arrived. and it was easy going into this year to say "well, injuries derailed us last year--fitz was injured, freddy, our o line... hell, stevie even battled an injury for most of last year." not to mention the talent we acquired on the defensive side of the ball. we looked like a young team, loaded with talent, and a proven defensive coordinator (ouch.) even after week 1, i felt like we were going in the right direction, and those week 2 and 3 wins over kansas city and cleveland really had me believing. we looked like a team that was going in the right direction--the playoffs. but at some point in that san francisco game... i lost "it." and that point was chandlers fumble at the end of the first half, to put san fran up 14-3, instead of us taking a knee to go into the half down 7-3, getting the ball back. that just felt like the proverbial "heads need to roll" moment... and no heads rolled. ever since then, ive had MORE fun scanning espn.com, buffalorumblings.com and our front page to see if either a) wanny has been fired, b) fitzy has been benched, or c) chan has been canned. but nothing has happened. in arizona, the offense was pathetic. i watched the game, but i truly expected fitz to be pulled. nothing. now tennessee - i 100% expected wanny to be fired yesterday. but nothing. so now, we have 2 weeks off, then travel across the country to play houston... and it feels like a loss already. so its very hard to get excited about bills football right now. very hard. 9 games left, were half a game out of a wild card, and anything is possible, and i know a win in one of our next 2 games will have me "billieving" again. but even as the wheels were coming off last year, they were a more fun team to watch than this.

"you're delusional" "that's crazy, never going to happen" "you said it yourself so i won't say it" "what planet are you living on" i think i just said every response that's coming my way, so just spare yourself the time. BUT, with that being said.... 99.9999999999999999% of me KNOWS the bills are going to lose, whether its by a touchdown, or 5 touchdowns. yet a small, small, insignificant, .000000000000000000000000001% of me has this image, of the bills coming out of the bye week, and shocking the world. and the only reason for this, is a column that bill simmons wrote following the red sox first world series win in 04. that franchise, as im sure you know, had bad luck - maybe worse than the bills. and he said when they went down 0-3 to the yankees in the ALCS, they had bottomed out. it was like, so bad, that you knew it was the worst it could ever be. nothing else could be worse. kind of like us losing to tennessee, at home, after loading up our defense this offseason, and having the worst defense in the league, and fitz throwing that pick, after putting up 34 points... it was just so totally expected from the jaded fanbase, that were all throwing in the towel on the season (as we should.) but what IF... we shock the world in houston, and then new england? i know, i know, its impossible. but what if?