Mango

Bob Woods Justin Hunter- I thought he did OK, provides depth Z.Brown Gilmore- Price tag aside, he is much better than he is given credit for. Also creates a giant hole at CB, especially given Darby's down year.

Did we just figure out Russ Brandon's username?

I didn't really TT through the season. Didn't think we should keep him but wouldn't be upset if we did. Team looked terrible on Sunday. Part of me thinks he earned 17mil next year by not playing... BUT.... You DO NOT BAIL on your team because you don't like your situation. That's exactly what he did and I have zero respect for that. Fine, coaches and th FO showed little faith. But if you're the leader you don't run home and cry to the media. You continue to lead, and he didn't.

Did you just use impatience to describe the judgement of TT after 6 years in the NFL? In fact TT is a product of the exact progression you are looking for. The NFL has given him 6 years. But no he hasn't progressed a noticeable amount. Tight throws, mid range ball placement, reading defenses, and ability to see the middle of the field did not move the needle very much.

Perspective. We are basically 8-8 with EJ, Orton, and Tyrod. Are we really making it worse, or do we have a more exciting (scrambling/mobile) version of mediocre?

Flame away all you like, but in selection of elite athletes in all sorts of sports, a lot of places consider "no credit being better than bad credit". This is exactly right. You either go the Caughlin/Manning route, and have a staunch supporter in your corner while you complete less than 50% of your passes for 2 years. Or you sit until you are close to ready. He isn't close to ready.

I'm actually think part of the issue is the new CBA. These guys aren't allowed to practice. It's kind of rediculous. For a guy that relies so heavily on scheme and x's/o's, it makes things really tough to implement. Schwartz kind of figured it out. Simplify and play fast. Rex has not. In the next CBA I hope the NFL drops weed in exchange for going back to the same practice times/team contact rules. I'm fine with keeping the padded practices or contact practices down. But there is no reason for these guys to have as limited work as they get with their teams. It's a huge reason play across the league has been a bit trash.

If TT is smart, he'll find a way to get hurt via Cleveland, and never work again.

Not sure if this is sarcastic. They allowed 18 points a game. While very good, is not lucky to get 2 scores?

He was literally our GM at one point, after Marv left. So there is that. He was also pretty open about being the one for the Marrone pick. Our own GM has said Rex was not his first choice, and Russ told the owner not to let Rex leave the building without a contract. Soooo. Tell me more about how he isn't involved in football operations. He may not be responsible for 20 years of suck. But he is for atleast 10.

This is it. And it was the problem in the Ralph era as well. Be involved, give input, learn as an owner. But ultimately let the professionals do their job

I do not disagree with you, in getting outside help to hire a GM. I also don't think we need to fire a GM who doesn't get to pick the HC. We don't have an idea of how good or bad our GM is, because he doesn't have full control. Christ our GM hasn't hired either of the two HC's he has had. Also, this is directly correlated to the QB position. If your GM does not have full football control, don't be surprised when your roster isn't what you would like. Give your GM the keys to the car, rather than have him read off directions from the GPS, because that is what this organization has been for nearly 20 years now.

The biggest thing wrong with the organization in the drought is not letting football people make football decisions. Post Donahoe. The same thing is happening now. Let your GM control football. That is it. Done deal. We do not do that in the least. When you come out of a coaching interview, and your marketing guy is even present. Then has the freedom to say, "don't let this guy leave without a contract", and he is not your GM's first choice. Then you give him 5 years. That is what is wrong with the organization. Whaley has been slightly better than average overall as a GM. That encompasses the draft, resigning, trades, and FA. That might be his ceiling. He may also be trying to do his job a bit hamstrung. We won't know until internally that structure changes. If you need a consultant to come in, or a czar, just hire a new effing GM.

If you're going to do it for TT, make sure you add Dak, Newton, Rogers, Dalton, Smith,Bree's, Flacco, and Mariotta. About half of those are already ahead of TT. You can't add to one and not the group.

Not defending Rex here, but for somebody who spent a lot of years at the Oly Training center, with physiologists from all over the country and world, I am torn. 1. Being really strong, dynamic, and explosive make you predisposed to being very tight. It's actually what makes them strong, dynamic, and explosive. I used to work with a stretching specialist, who worked as a private "stretcher" for a lot of MLB pitchers. He would talk a lot about how being very personal with all of them, made it easier, but only carried a few clients, because treatment is so personal. He would rarely do much work on the pitching arm because that tightness is what created their velocity. He focused a lot on making sure the rest of the body stayed balanced, otherwise it would fail the throwing shoulder. 2. That said, many of these things are somewhat preventable. Long warm ups and pre-stretching actually reduce max power output, increase aerobic output, and help prevent injury. I think these guys are predisposed to this stuff, but given coming from big programs, natural physiology, and then NFL funding, they take whatever time they get with the trainer as gospel. As a guy who worked in a non-funded sport for a long time, you realize it's about personal accountability and finding your right prescription.<<<<this is basically the reason Tom Brady is better than everybody else.

Also in plays of note you list in order 1. Unforced 2.unforced 3. Unforced 4. Coverage sack 5. Excellent play by TT 6. OT blew it 7. OT blew it 8. OL false start 9. TT excellent 10. OL beat 11. OL beat 12. Unforced 13. Bad route In a game where your numbers show the line held up about 83% of the time, your notable plays list them at double the rate. Actually 7 of the 13 notable plays are listed as somebody else's failure other than the QB, when your data is showing they are right in line with their more successful games as a unit. Meanwhile your number of times TT blew it are about a 1/3. Plus one good play. It just doesn't make sense. The numbers above show that these number should be flipped around.

Not to nitpick. And yes, I am the occasional poster. .... But how are you providing stats on unforced errors, forced errors, no separation, and QB errors, while at the same time saying things like, "many times there was nobody open." If you are collecting data,that isn't a true response to data collection. Also note the only video analysis offered was Corday Glenn. If you're watching every play, taking notes, and making references. It doesn't seem just to identify a single player only. Not only that, he wasn't the worst player on the lin le by your grades. Just asking to stick to your measurements and data is all. Be she this ain't that. All the criticism above said. I know this is message board. Thanks for your time and effort in posting. It's much appreciated. Regardless of criticism.

I'm I the only one who saw that INT, and thought that Woods sat down in a soft spot in the zone. It was a good play by the WR, and close your eyes and chuck it by the QB. The pre snap read on the defense was way off there. Especially against a team that plays a lot of 3 deep zone. Woods found the perfect spot to sit down in against coverage, TT chucked it right at the coverage. Poor pre and post snap read from the QB.

The first time or two was polite. And I was still threatened, after the first time of asking nicely. A guy walking in the other direction even interjected "dude is being pretty nice, just stop being an ass"/ But yes I was more vulgar and stern than the post may imply after the pushing continued. But no, no name calling, no questioning of parenting. This was also after threatening me to punch me, after being nice. Just sticking up for myself after being threatened. I've instigated a number of situations in my early 20's. I can ensure you this isn't one of them. And I wasn't drunk. I'm a tall, skinny, jovial guy. Again, I don't have anything to prove anymore. I've won 12 national championships, of good size. I don't have to prove my "worth" to anybody at a bills game I am Willing to take a lot on the chin but not an absurd amount. Especially that which starts to question my own integrity.

Fully agree. I met a woman I am seeing. Had she been with me and/or getting pushed I would have ended up in Bills jail. I'm a tall guy with a good athletic prowess. At this point in my life I have nothing to prove on my own. But even if I saw you purposefully spit on a female, stranger or not, I don't think I could control myself, nor should I. I am sorry that happened. Wit wiz all day!!! I agree, no wiz, and I deserve more than a punch in the face

I would have been pissed but laughed pretty hard about it later. I like your style. A real Mother Theresa.

I don't fully disagree. But at some point people are just sh*tty. Thy needs to resolved. We can ban whatever we want. But people can suck. I agree with an earlier post, the drinking culture is getting out of hand. I enjoy craft beer. Used to manage a brewery (in OKC), enjoy good wine. But he'll. My poor drunk behavior at 20 didn't compare to the nonsense of that incident today.

There was no impeding. I was shoulder to shoulder with everybody around me, and offered the right of way. I don't understand the rationalization for the incident by you or him. You wouldn't carry 2 8" trays through your own house?

I don't disagree about the fans....or the planning for food and drink. But it's not like I was leaving 8' of space between me and the person infront of me. We were all sardines. All the others around me were joking about all the stuff I had. So yes he fan base was supportive. My 15 years is my adult experience. My grandparents had seasons growing up and I started going to games at 6ish. Never have I experienced this. I'm barely over 30 now. But this was absurd. In all honesty, I haven't always been the model fan at games, especially in my youth, though never violent or aggressive like this. This was unprovoked and rediculous. I don't care if I was carrying a couch through the causeway, this isn't how adults react.

I really don't mind the ribbing, vulgarities, and roasting of other (visiting) fans. (Typo in OP) BUT you can't get physical, you can't make people feel unsafe. This was a single dude (me) trying to walk to his seat with 4 people's worth of food and drink, asking not to be pushed from behind, and even offered the go ahead. God forbid I stick up for myself without being assaulted. This was totally uncalled for. I truly am embarrassed by the product at the stadium, both on and off the field. I know the plural of anecdote is not data, but still.....