Mango

This is one of those times where somebody totally effed the market. If you’re Cleveland or Baltimore there is no way you get close to that, right?

oh jeez. If this lasts for a few more hours I am going to have to call a doctor.

I would trade Eichel for Hightower or Hunter Henry, straight up. If we are going to gut the hockey team, at least maybe make the Bills better.

Josh in shorts? giggity giggity.

I would love to keep Kumerow just to keep pissing off Rodgers honestly.

It seems like the stadiums built to the cost of the Pegula ask are around the 30-40% publicly funded mark. I think that is part of the reason fans are offended.

Haha. Not even close. The America's Food Fund and Frontline Workers Fund are two of the largest GoFundMe's in history, both created to support families and healthcare workers during the pandemic, combined barely cracked $50M. The amount people say we are willing to support the stadium and the amount they are willing to give in reality are way way off.

I get where you are coming from. It makes total sense. But some (myself included) don't think any local government, just give any single private company anywhere $1B in tax payer subsidy. I am not dying on the hill of don't give them any money, even though I don't think we should. I get you aren't speaking to me directly either. To your point, it is part of our identity as WNY'ers. If the Pegulas build a $700M stadium with $300M. I don't love public money for private profit. But that falls within some reasonability. I think people are just largely offended by Pegula in regards to the ask. Had they asked in 2019 when the world was much less upside down, there would be a much less commotion. But people are struggling and we get this is the opening bid. But we are just so far away from reasonability. I really believe this was PSE/Jerruh's company trying to take the temperature of Bills fans as to whether or not they could use the community to rally against the state to get funding. It backfired terribly.

No, that math was just taking the $1.5B ask and dividing it by the 20M residents equally in the state. The bad math is if you divide the ask by the 900k residents in Erie County. That comes to about $1700 per person.

The math isn't actually terrible. It comes out to $75 per resident. But the math adds up quickly. Family with two kids, your house pays $300. I doubt taxes go up, we will just pull those resources from other places.

Just another rambling from me. Has it occurred to anybody, that a guy who pays his taxes in FL, is asking for $1.1B from the State of NY and Erie County? I get it, he has a business here. But he is also not asking for just a little scratch here. Maybe before Terry Pegula asks for money from our income taxes he can start paying his income tax in the state as well.

While I agree with you at face value. I am also sort of, "meh" on that. The Pegula's hired a firm partially for plausible deniability, but they hired the firm none the less, and the information re: Austin didn't blind side them. They were taking the temperature of the region, hoping that we would get our pitchforks and torches out and charge Albany to keep the team. We didn't, we came at the Pegula's themselves, who will now walk it back. But it doesn't make them anymore genuine. Honestly, if the Sabres were not a total dumpster fire for their entire tenure as owners, the region may have reacted differently. The Pegula's are largely tone deaf. But that is nothing new.

This times a million. The city will use money from the people actually using the stadium to actually push a price point that probably keeps a good deal of those people from using it regularly in the future. To even start the conversation about public funding for this I think PSE needs to halve the total cost of the build ($1.1B is absurd), add language that prohibits anything even vaguely similar to PSL's, and there has to be a dome. I want an outdoor stadium as much as anybody, but if we are going to subsidize the Pegula's, we need to get more than 10 days a year out of the place.

A new stadium doesn't benefit anybody except the Bills. It is public subsidy for private profit.

Right. But I still think that misses the mark. Just scrolling though comments on FB, Reddit, Insta, I think the Pegula’s missed on the temperature of the community. Just from the eye test, most comments are “Fine, GTFO”. Pegula’s bet that Buffalo would ferociously go to Albany to keep the team here now that they are competitive. But it turns out people feel slighted at the threat

I wasn’t pooping on McBeane. I was saying the hire by Pegula is like a clock being right twice a day. Not that those two in particular are bad at their jobs.

The Pegula’s are a tweet away from dispelling all of this. There’s no way they don’t know about it at this point. From people who were partners with TP well before he bought the Sabres, your second sentence isn’t necessarily correct. But it’s not wrong. Terry is an engineer first. I’ll leave it at that.

Again, I think this is a stupid bluff that I’m upset they made. But you had mentioned something along the lines of, “you’d have to be stupid”. And I basically responded with, they can be very stupid owners.

The Pegulas are not great owners. They extended Whaley, fired Whaley the next year, hired Rex, literally every move with the Sabres. I view McBeane as a broken clock being right twice a day.

Whatever. They proactively hired somebody to speak on their behalf. It doesn’t really matter. Right. We are on the same page.

Nobody thinks they’re going anywhere. People are offended by empty threat with an absurd asking price in the middle of an ongoing pandemic/pandemic recovery. I agree they’re not going anywhere. And if I am the state or the county, I am not returning any phone calls until the Pegula’s come to the table with something reasonable.

I am not against public spending on sports. I just look at it the same as stuff like the Albright Knox or the Philharmonic. They provided value but cost money. But if the Albright Knox was clearing $70M per year after expenses. (That is what GB cleared circa 2019) and told the city, county, and state, that unless they gave them an additional $1.5B (pandemic or not), they would pack up and go. We’d line the streets and wave them good bye and laughing as they jumped on the 90.

The developer class has very silently been its own special socio-economic group. It’s not nee. They just don’t try to hide it anymore. Can’t wait for the state to just give free money again to Savarino, Sinatra, Montante, Paladino, Ciminelli, etc.

Right. Which is why I lead with, “do I think they’re leaving? No”. And “if they call their bluff wrong? See ya later”. As in I don’t think they’re going anywhere. It’s a terrible ask. But if the ask happens to be real, I’ll help them load the trucks. But yes, TP isn’t leaving.