hondo in seattle

I sometimes forget this. Good point. We're not good enough to win the Super Bowl. But not bad enough to get good draft picks. It sucks being in the middle class.

Did the passing game weapons get weaker? Or did the scheme and playcalling get weaker? Or both?

This was my first thought. If I was the GM, I would never grant Dunne an interview request out of loyalty to McD. But I don't what dynamics are at play here.

I agree. I want Josh to play into his 40s. But his running abilities are unique and a real asset. So I think Brady needs to be strategic about it. Do it enough to get it on tape for DCs to worry about. And then only in big and/or close games.

Usually when I watch/listen to guys who cover the entire NFL, I learn nothing. Most of those guys are jacks of all trades, masters of none. I learn more from you guys than the national talking heads. But these guys were very good.

I think it's amusing in a twisted kind of way but I'm not sure why you find this hard to understand unless it's an intentional misunderstanding. An actor can be phenomenal at acting but still get up on stage and deliver a bad performance. Joey Chestnut might be the world's best hot dog eater but can still have a bad day/month/season eating hot dogs. James Bond might be a other-worldly lover but still suffer an evening that a blue pill might have helped. Sometimes the best guys don't deliver the best performances. Josh is a great QB but didn't deliver a Top Two performance last year. That's simply what the stats say. He wasn't Top Two in the most popular rating systems (btw, where he averaged 9th - 9th is not what I ranked him). He wasn't Top Two in key performance indicators like Passing Yards, Passing TDs, or Ints. In terms of talent, he's Top Two. In terms of last season's performance, he was not. I don't blame that on Josh as much as I blame it on Beane. Josh needs better talent around him. And that's why if we're going to upgrade OBD somewhere, I'd start with Beane. But I don't think it's time yet to pull that plug.

Here's literally what I wrote: "Josh is a unicorn and not all head coaches have a guy of that calibre. But there are guys lining up under center that also play the game pretty well. Josh was 16th in passer rating last year, 3rd in QBR. If you average that out, he had roughly the 9th best season for a QB last year." Contrary to what you wrote, I never said he was the 9th best QB in the league nor do I believe that. My considerable appreciation for Josh is clear in previous posts in this thread as well as others. Statistically, he underperformed this past year versus his talent/potential partially because Beane hasn't provided him with a quality supporting cast. Again, I wonder about ad hominem attacks. Why do you need to call me FireChan's "boy" and say I'm "lost?" I disagree with your evaluations but I don't disrespect you like that. Your insults don't add value to the board. They don't add any strength to your arguments. They're not funny. So I don't get the point. Maybe you can explain. As I recently posted somewhere else... We're all Bills fans. We've all suffered together through 1-win seasons, four SB losses, the Home Run Throwback, a 17-year drought, 13-seconds, and other calamities. Life throws enough sh*t at us. Why do we need to throw sh*t at each other?

So we know GoBills808 and some others think McD is a failure as a head coach and ought to be fired. On their side of the fence is Tyler Dunne and his largely anonymous crew of malcontents. I don’t think McD is a failure and should be fired. On this side of the fence are some insightful mafiosos like FireChans, the Bills locker room, and a couple of current/future Hall of Fame coaches. I like where I’m sitting... The Bills players rated their Head Coach an “A” in the most recent NFLPA poll. Only three head coaches received higher (A+) ratings. Bill Cowher: “I love Sean McDermott… [He] has done an incredible job putting that team together… You can see his stamp on this football team in terms of playing tough, smart football… I’m really impressed with Sean McDermott and what he’s been able to do there.” Andy Reid: “He’s one of the best coaches that’s ever coached the game.” GoBills808, maybe you should join us on this side. It's sunnier here.

No, not seriously because I never said that. I'm starting to wonder if you're intentionally misconstruing & misrepresenting what I've written. I said his "performance" was 9th best according to a blend of the rating systems. I think he has top 2 talent. I don't think his actual performance was top 2. That's what the stats tell us. Three QBs threw for more yards. Five QBs threw more TDs. Seven QBs had more passing yards per game. Ten QBs achieved higher completion percentages. Fifteen QBs achieved higher adjusted average yards per attempt. Nearly every starting QB in the NFL acheived a better Int/Att ratio. How does all that add up to a top 2 performance? It doesn't. And why weren't Josh's stats top 2? No elite offensive line. No elite RB. Only one elite receiver who was a malcontent and didn't play elite in the second half of the season or the playoffs. Those are all Beane problems. He drafted a generational QB and has since failed to give him the supporting cast he deserves. The scheme and playcalling weren't elite either. That's a McD problem.

McD's defenders are not saying that he has zero impact on the offense. I certainly haven't. I've said in this thread that he has a positive impact on the esprit de corps and commitment of the offensive players. But I think he's struggled with scheme & play calling because he's been poor at picking OCs. His offensive performance has been a mixed bag. And I certainly don't think coaching is unimportant. Just the opposite. If I was an owner, I'd be willing to pay my head coach as much as my QB - or more - if he was good. I happen to think McD is a good coach and - especially on the defensive side of the ball - gets players to execute and play well together. I don't think he's a super swell guy. I wouldn't fire him because I think the most likely consequence is that we'd end up with a worse head coach and I don't want the team to go backwards. I think the coaches demonstrably better than him are few in number and already well-employed.

Ending the drought and getting us into the playoffs every year except for the season when we had the lowest-paid roster in the league. It's kind of the chicken or the egg argument. Do we have a situation where good players make the coach look good? Or do we have a situation where a good coach develops the players and makes them look good? I think it's a little of both. On the defensive side, I think McD's scheme and his ability to get players to play as one unit makes some guys perform better here than they'd perform on other teams. When I watch our defense, I often think of the old saying, "The whole is greater than the sum of its parts." And that's because of McD. On offense, it's a different story. McD builds good esprit de corps and commitment but struggles with getting the right OC to implement a scheme that optimizes players' talents. Brady is his fourth OC. Only one worked out so far. McD and Daboll did a nice job developing Allen but now Allen carries the offense. Brady wasn't great last season but I'm waiting to see how he'll do this year with his own playbook before I pass judgment. You can't win the lottery unless you buy tickets. By getting us into the playoffs, McD is giving us a lottery ticket. Chances are, we'll eventually win. But I'd like our odds better if (1) Brady turns out to be the right OC - fingers crossed - or is replaced by someone who is, and/or (2) Beane builds a better roster.

Josh is a unicorn and not all head coaches have a guy of that calibre. But there are guys lining up under center that also play the game pretty well. Josh was 16th in passer rating last year, 3rd in QBR. If you average that out, he had roughly the 9th best season for a QB last year. Of course, you have to wonder if Josh would have played better if: #1 He had better coaching. We did fire our OC in the middle of the season. #2 He had a better team around him. I know the stats tell a different story but I didn't think the OL was elite. And the wideouts had trouble getting open. One analytics site had both Diggs and Davis below the NFL average in yards of separation/pass play. And, of course, we don't have a back of McCaffrey's caliber, for example, to take some heat off the QB. #1 is a McD thing and #2 is a Beane thing. I think probably both are true. I don't know enough about Staley to compare the two but I think it is fair to say that McD isn't at the Reid level (yet?). I think McD's playoff record at 5-6 is a pretty fair indication of how he's coached in the playoffs. In other words, he's been about average among coaches who get their teams into the playoffs. And I do 'blame' him. We need him to be better than average. But if I had a binary choice of replacing Beane or McD, I'd replace Beane. I think there's more upside on the roster side than the coaching side. Though I do think McD urgently needs to get the OC thing figured out - I hope Brady proves to be The Guy.

I think saying there's a "midseason malaise" every season is a little hyperbolic. When did we slump in McD's 13-3 years? But, yeah, McD is the coach and deserves to be blamed for whatever malaise the team suffered whenever it suffered it. But here's the thing. All other NFL teams, other than KC, lose even more regular season games than Buffalo. So their coaches must allow even more 'malaise' than McD. So who are you going to replace McD with? As far as I know, Andy Reid isn't looking for a job. I'll stick with the guy who sucks less than 30 other NFL coaches (based on W-L record since 2020).

You can lose a one-on-one battle because lack of technique. Coaches have to share in the blame if that's the case. But when a guy just can't physically compete with the guy across from him, that's a talent issue. We've seen this time and time again. Defensive linemen who can't beat their blocks. Offensive linemen who can't hold their blocks. Receivers who can't get separation. DBs who can't stick to their guys. Those are mostly not scheme or playcalling problems. Sometimes the other team just has better players.

I don't care if you think it's borderline laughable. It that was meant as an insult, sorry, it didn't land. Though I don't understand your need to be rude. TBD, and the world in general, would be a better place if people practiced kindness and respect. But to respond to your point. I don't think McD overperformed in any postseason so far. I think he performed about as well as you'd expect given the talent and health of the squad. And that, in itself, is disappointing. I want my coach to overperform when it matters most. I do think he overperformed in the second of last season with how banged up we were on defense. I think he overperformed in 2017 by getting that untalented squad into the playoffs. And I think 2018 was one of his best years despite the 6-10 record. We spent less on active players that season than any team in the NFL. Based on roster spending, we should have been the league's worst team. He took that crap roster and made it mildly competitive. That was an accomplishment. Since 2020, the Bills are the second-winningest team in the NFL. I wouldn't rate the Bills roster second-best over that span. McD's is outperforming a lot of other coaches.

Beane has limited what he can do in free agency with the three huge contracts he handed out: Josh. Worth every penny. Diggs. A productive player but a malcontent. And now we're paying him $31m to play for someone else. Miller. Not a malcontent but not a productive player. In the draft, we all know Beane's been hit-or-miss. Overall, Beane's built a good roster, not a great one. We lose too many one-on-one battles both on offense and defense, particularly in the playoffs. That's not poor coaching, that's a lack of player talent. Though, to be fair, Beane hasn't been helped by injuries.

Maybe I wasn't clear. I think coaches make a huge difference. The best coaches get the best out of their teams. They win more games than you'd expect given the strength of the roster. The worst coaches underperform vis-a-vis the roster. I think McD has performed at the level of his roster or above (depending on which season or postseason we want to talk about). I probably don't think the roster has been as good as you think. And I think it's unwise to fire a coach who tends to overperform just because he hasn't won a SB yet. Andy Reid would have been fired many times if that was the case. Years past, we've gone into seasons with a 0% chance of earning a Lombardi. With Beane & McD, I rate our chances every year at around 10% - among the league's best. To improve our chances, we need to build a better roster. We can either (1) allow Beane to grow into his job, or (2) replace him with someone better. I don't think firing McD is likely to improve our odds.

According to the prosecutor it was. Hennepin County Attorney Mike Freeman said at the time, “There are often conflicting versions of what happened and this case is no exception. In the interest of justice, there is inadequate evidence to fairly charge and prosecute this case.” Steveson's attorney said a change in legislation wouldn't have affected the outcome. The prosecutor didn't say anything one way or the other. Why do you say he'd likely be charged under today's law? Steveson said, "No charges were ever brought by anyone and the entire episode has been difficult for everyone involved … Going forward people who don’t know me will hopefully see that kindness, respect and empathy are virtues I take very seriously in my life. I hope that's true. Since the DA didn't proceed "in the interest of justice," I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt. apnews.com/general-news-1221944d273eb2cdb0d285de3d665b3f www.ringsidenews.com/2021/12/11/gable-steveson-clears-the-air-after-past-assault-allegation-resurfaces/

I don't think we've seen Allen's floor or ceiling yet. Think of the '68, '71 or '76 Bills. I watched those teams play. Even Allen couldn't have carried those inept squads to the playoffs. His basement is below wildcard because the rest of the roster matters. As for ceiling, let me ask: In what season did the Bills have the best roster in the NFL when entering the playoffs? Personally, I don't think that's happened yet. Not even close. So personally I don't understand why anyone is saying McD's coaching has capped the Bills playoff performance. McD usually exits the playoffs about where you'd expect, given the talent of the team that takes the field. I'd be happier if he overperformed in the playoffs but that hasn't happened yet. He has at times overperformed (vis-a-vis the strength of the roster) in the regular season. Beane still has some work to do. He drafted Allen and has built, overall, a good collection of players. But it's not a great one. It's not at the KC level.

I was one of the people worried about Diggs. In fact, I started a thread about it. But that was an attitude issue. Any time an attitude issue bubbles up, I worry about it. Execution in OTAs is not, however, something I worry about. Heck, the Super Bowl-era Bills sucked in preseason and yet dominated n the regular season. I don't worry about execution until September. www.twobillsdrive.com/community/topic/246881-the-allen-diggs-relationship-in-decline/#comment-8362163

Cook is a nice back but doesn't rank with the best of Bills history. Some of his stats - like yards per carry - are helped by the fact that he's a running back on a passing team. Opponents are almost exclusively focused on defending Josh. That's what they game plan for. They don't game plan for Cook. Cook, like Thomas before him, is a dual purpose back. But Thurm was better both as a receiver and runner. Defenses in those days had the unenviable tasks of trying to stop both Thurman and Kelly. Cook and Allen are not nearly as fearsome a duo. I agree that there might be 10 backs from Bills history that I'd take over Cook.

Yep - 2 years in the USFL. At his peak, he was fun to watch. But his peak didn't last long.

Elvis?

Before Josh came along, I used to say that we've been blessed at RB and cursed at QB.

My list based on personal observation (i.e. not an analysis of stats or highlights). I'm only considering the time they played in a Bills uni. (1) OJ. An other worldly runner. (2) Thurman. A great all-purpose back and a great fit for the offense he was in. (3) Freddy. Freddy is often underrated because he mostly played behind bad lines on bad teams. Great at getting something out of nothing. (4) Joe Cribbs. Excellent runner and receiver. (5) Shady. A bright spot on a bad team. I never watched him play live, but some old-timers might make a good case for Cookie Gilchrist. On a different day of the week, I might alter the order but I'd stick with these five with OJ on top. If we include their careers beyond the Bills, Marshawn probably moves into the Top Five and Shady moves up the list.