hondo in seattle

This is a depressing thread. We haven't had a good OL since Josh has been here. And it doesn't seem likely we'll have one in 2023. Just not enough resources.

The Bills were built for the passing game. On D, our biggest contracts are for a pass rusher and a pass defender. On O, our biggest contracts are for a passer and a pass catcher. The problem is, Miller notwithstanding, Beane has been focused on the skill positions and has not succeeded in the trenches. All our offensive linemen are rated in the bottom half of the league. Our defensive linemen, without Miller in the lineup to draw attention and elevate their game, are meh. I don't view the front office is cocky. I just think they're wrong too often. I heard Rom Wolf once say that every draft should produce one All-Pro. It might be in the 1st round, it might be in the 3rd - drafting is an inexact science - but you need one. Drafting starters isn't good enough. Every team has 22 starters. What a championship team needs is difference-makers. Better yet, difference-makers on rookie contracts. So, I agree, we need Beane to build through the draft - and that means picking more playmakers instead of JAGs.

None of us had 9 turnovers. We don't need the painful reminders.

How do we pay for OBJ and an upgraded offensive line? At the same time? Not to mention some help for the secondary.

Payton went to and won one SB in 15 years with a HOF QB. His playoff record is 9-8.

I like Edmunds better than most but, man, we need OL help. A better OL means a better running attack, which means a less predictable offense, which means a better passing attack too. And a better OL means a healthier Allen. They guys is getting beat up and we're asking him to do too much. He needs capable bodyguards.

I don't trust PFF enough to conclude that Kromer is failing. Just watching our guys get manhandled some games tells me the quality of the players - regardless of the coaching - just isn't good enough. Better blocking schemes might have made them look a little better. Better passing schemes (that got receivers open and got the ball out quickly) for sure would have made them look better. But they're just not very good.

I'm going to quibble a bit... Buffalo is a 4-2 team, not a 4-3 team. We rarely trot out 3 LBs. But this detail doesn't change the argument. It's still 4 down linemen.

I really hope I'm wrong... But I don't see Beane making dramatic improvements. Other than Josh, Beane mostly finds role players in the draft, not diference-makers. He's done better with free agency but doesn't have the resources to do much this year. Sadly, at this point in the offseason, I think the Bills make the playoffs in 2023 but fail yet again to make it to the Super Bowl.

Beane helped transform the Bills from a team that didn't go to the playoffs to one that does. Overrated? I don't know. That's a real accomplishment. But he has not built a Super Bowl caliber roster thus far. And with our lack of offseason resources, I doubt his ability to build one in 2023. Beane's been good. But we need him to be better.

Carry grudges much? That happened in 1972. "Forgiveness is the greatest gift you can give yourself." ~ Maya Angelou

Coaching is partly what gets the Bills into the playoffs. Is the Bills roster as talented as the rosters of the teams still in the hunt? I don't think so.

I agree that these have all been disappointing picks. But I think the analysis is somewhat flawed. The "NFL draft industry" may have been wrong about some of these picks but who cares? Most draft gurus are one-man shops. An NFL team like the Bills employs a team of scouts, interviews college coaches, hires investigators, and overall put far more man-hours and money into draft research than Mel Kiper or anyone else. So the Bills ought to be get picks right when the media gurus get them wrong. In all these cases, other teams passed on guys we picked. Maybe they were smarter than us, did more due diligence, used better criteria when evaluating players. Of course, drafting is an inexact science. Every team has both hits and misses. You want to have more hits and fewer misses than other teams. I'm not sure Beane is achieving that if you look past Josh.

Here's our offense: Josh drops back. He starts running around because either (A) the passpro breaks down quickly or (B) the receivers aren't open. Eventually Josh makes a great play - or doesn't. It's not a sustainable offense. A good WR would help us. But what I really want to see is a better offensive scheme that includes a better running attack and more quick hitting passes. Whatever kind of offense we run would benefit from better offensive linemen. That's the big change I hope to see.

I think our biggest need is on the OL, but if the next Bruce Smith is available when we pick you don't pass him up.

All year long I've thought our safeties were uncharacteristically being caught out of position. While I attributed that to the Dynamic Duo being hurt, I also wondered about the coaching. Coaches can't make guys more athletic. But they should effectively coach guys to make the right reads and be in the right place. That didn't seem to be happening with Salgado. But who knows why he was fired. Maybe he was argumentative in meetings. Or a disloyal back-stabber. Or lazy. Or a cokehead. I really doubt that Sean fired him simply because the backups didn't perform as well as Hyde and Poyer. But who knows - maybe he was fired unjustly. Since none of us know what's happening behind the curtain, I think it's kind of silly to speculate or judge.

I agree. But I'll be so disappointed if the Bills don't find some significant help for OL this offseason.

If you don't have a good offensive line, you must have a good short passing game. It does seem like we had decent weapons for Josh to throw short to. We just didn't utilize them. Hines in particular had 63 catches just a couple years ago. He has hands that can catch and he has jets on his feet. Dorsey schemes were hard to understand at times.

I love the optimism! But I don't entirely share it... #1. Fingers crossed. #2. Finger crossed - but the 'shelf-life' comment above might have some merit. #3. Davis and Oliver are who they are. They won't play better next year. #4. Josh is a beast but his skills are negated to some extent by poor pass protection, dropped passes, and receivers who have trouble gaining separation. #5. Careful with this one. Staffold's replacement could be even worse and may be just as bad. #6. Okay. There's some real hope with this Elam, Shakir, and Cook. At least one of them will be better next year - hopefully all 3. #7. Von's not getting younger. #8. Beane's only produced one "stud playmaker" with a first round pick. I'm really hoping this year he nabs his second. With the holes we have, Beane really needs to have a superior offseason.

Sadly, I believe every team still alive in the playoffs is more talented than the Bills. McD isn't perfect. But we just don't have SB talent.

I'm torn on this. On the one hand, I appreciate these guys are humans with human frailties and emotions. There was a lot going on this season. On the other hand, as an old soldier, I can't stand the out-of-gas mentality. If a soldier told me that, he'd be out of my unit in a hurry. When there's a battle to be fought, you fight with everything you have. You do it for a lot of reasons but mostly for the love you have for your brothers (and sisters). I wouldn't want to go to war with anyone who's going to let out-of-gas considerations enter their mind. Deal with your feelings after the battle. Before the fight - during the fight - it's full throttle. That's how warriors think and behave. Despite my efforts to be a compassionate, understanding person, I have to admit I'm disappointed to hear the out-of-gas sentiments coming from the Bills locker room.

I agree with you, and don't. I do think this Bills squad needs to be more physical, especially in the trenches. But I don't think that the McD's emphasis on culture and process precludes that. As a former soldier, I can tell you we talked a lot about culture and process (SOPs, etc.) and did not typically condone bending rules. At the same time, we could be very physical. When it was time to hit, we hit hard. That was part of the culture. In a violent profession, it needs to be. I don't think McD is on the wrong track at all. I do think he needs better linemen on both sides of the ball who can push people around and aggressively assert themselves. That's a task for Brandon Beane.

There's a lot of things contributing to our disappointments this year but, yeah, Hyde was part of it. The thing about Hyde and Poyer is that the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. These two guys weren't stars before they came to Buffalo but became stars here because they played so well together. They communicate well. And they're interchangeable. Either can play deep, or cover a TE, or move up for run support. They used their interchangeability to help disguise the coverage. Opposing QBs often didn't know whether we were zone or man or 2 high or 1. We lost all that synergy when we lost Hyde.

I hope not - not those guys. We need more talent, not less. Any of those guys would be a big loss. I am a bit worried about Tre, though. I think his knee is going to be find but that's not a proven fact at this point. He didn't play much this year and when he did, he wasn't the lock-down goalie of the past. Mimic the 49ers is easier said than done. But, yep, I wish our overall roster was that strong except that we had Josh under center instead of their trio. That's a fantasy to drool over.

It makes no sense to fire Frazier. He just helps McD come up with the game plan and prepare the defense. But it's ultimately McD's D. I'm really disappointed in Dorsey. Some of his game plans and play calls were head scratchers - regardless of what the end-of-year stats tell us. And then there's Beane. You've got to give the man credit - he's built a playoff roster. But the remaining holes are maddening, especially his failure to build a good OL. I'm not hot to fire anyone.