NoSaint

Ill keep on asking same player is on the jags and is offered up to the bills on a $2m contract... who doesnt take marcell at the cost of a 6th amd losimg 2m in cap space?

Its cap savings. If he was here our cap hit would be higher. We can now spend a modest bit more money on another player. Its such a baseline lack of understanding that it might deserve going to a pm or explain the salary cap type of thread though

Guarantees dont stay. Amortized bonus money that you already paid out gets accelerated The perk of trading instead of cutting is that the future guarantees go with the player instead of also having to be accounted for by you. Our dead space in the trade is just accounting for checks we paid previously but pushed back the hit on the books for.

Jax takes all future payments to him (2018 salary)

Right- if some team had dareus in a $2m deal and said they would take a 6th for him... every last one of us would jump on it.

Right. Once you account for the sunk costs to the cap... its would you trade a 6th for dareus on a $2m deal if you re-frame it I would bring in that talent at that. We just said no to it.

Kelly and McDaniels are the two that come to mind and both flashed for a minute before falling apart. Hopefully thats not the case here Kelly was 10-6 the first year too before feeling the repercussions of the moves. Its a fair parallel to point out to watch out for. Could go either way though.

How many times did this board discuss how we were .500 despite Rex and imagine what a competent coach wouldve gotten out of the roster. So was it the roster or rex that was holding us back?

And that nails it. You have to hit a home run with what you gained to even get mediocre dareus quality of play and have no chance at the elite dareus play. Essentially youve accepted all the downside and shipped out all the upside

Agreed. Now assigning dareus to the list of high draft picks purged- whos left that we drafted first or second round before this year? Wood, Shaq, and cordy(at least for now) Jettisoned since last season- dareus, sammy, EJ, Gilmore, Kujo, woods, Ragland, Darby and Aaron Williams? Granted some were natural but thats an astonishing couple of months

Its a term most people use without thinking twice. But when you are the white dude that runs a team with a lot of black dudes that feel unfairly targeted by police its pretty high on the list of dumb things to say. Frankly, as a boss talking about any employees in public its a pretty dumb thing to say.

And in context I was saying that if we held him just to spite him it would be dumb because we should take something, anything, that is offered

I think he might literally make the pats worse and would bet us something. Exactly. It's doing yourself a disservice just to get revenge that is totally unneeded

And that's the problem in categorizing guys in really simple absolutes. Smart people can do dumb things. Good people do bad things. It's easy to rationalize that a well intentioned 26 year old activist wears stupid pig socks without it being the hugest of huge deals (again, not saying it's good- I thought it far over the line too) Hell, beyond this, as a team you have to look at other things like his vegan diet or when he decided to wear dolphins gear while the San Fran starter. He's a tough guy to take a risk on. But if you can get him on a low risk contract he can be a decent reward and I don't think it'd be quite the circus (we tend to over rate the size of the sideshow when discussing stuff like this)

It is definitely making excuses for bad behavior. All of us have done stupid stuff. I think that was an incredibly dumb thing done by a generally smart guy... and my experience in the real world is that this isn't rare. He's young. He's on the new side of the being an activist. And suddenly he was the face of it for the entire nation. I'd be baffled if he didn't say or do some dumb things along the way. I agree he should own it. I don't think it makes him a disingenuous idiot though. Just like I'm trying to get your stance, I've spent some time trying to imagine what the last few years have been from his perspective too. And ignoring team leader, brand representative/ambassador -- I get that 100% and I'm not outraged by the dynamics of him not being on a team even if I think he'd make sense at a certain price and that some of the outrage is overdone

I think because he's a mid 20s dude that got caught up and being new-ish in the scene he was in probably wasn't mature enough to sort through a lot of the content around him. Again, just speculating but I suspect there was a sudden rush and a lot of people around him with an f the police attitude I saw a teaser on espn with the army vet but not the full segment so I can't say 100% but the gist was what I posted And I agree on the socks -- and think he probably realized what he actually did pretty quickly as we never saw THAT again

Wasn't it an army vet that wrote him a letter? He then invited the guy to come talk to him and the vet explained they kneel in honor of the fallen and he thought CK should do that as a show of respect to the troops while still making a statement

What do you think his end game is, if he's not trying to be an activist? Seems to me the NFL was his best chance of fame and money long term- so I tend to assume he's a dude that probably started well then got swept away with people in his ear and the moment getting so big so quick. Just my take.

Oh, and I don't think you and I are far off in our stances. Even the fences we are on opposite sides of - it doesn't seem to infuriate you. I think you catch that he's kind of a flawed human trying to do well, for the most part. Those that are super enraged I like to ask why... I figure if I expect them to try to get a guy like CK I should try to get them

I have got to ask- and I'm coming to this with it being a genuine question, not trying to expose you.... but why does a lot of this make you so angry? Stuff like the dude representing Cuba as the highest when they are actually 9th at 99.8% seems pretty basic off the cuff discussion and not an indictment on him being a liar or idiot... just a young dude trying to talk to reporters about investing in educating kids. Even if I don't agree on approaches, I find it hard to get upset. Am I missing something?

I mean, are we that worried that the locker room would revolt over his politics at this point?

Yup. I agree with some of his points, disagree with others. He's at times been immature... but the guys generally smart, even if he is sometimes outside the norm.

I think it'd be by definition a bit clumsy but truly of all the places to draw the line - a pro equality patch is the place you just cannot go?

Just skip his weekly Tyrod thread -

I don't think tyrods play has swung near as high and low as some here do... across 3 years I think most of his strengths remain stead, and his flaws pretty consistent when you step away from stats and look at skills on the field. He's a good player, but not a great player. If you chunk out the rankings into quarters (1-8, 9-16, 17-24, 25-32) I think most of the debate would be simply to put him slightly below or above average. Most years he's scored out above average... in part because he's stayed much healthier than I expected. Kudos to the guy, whether you put him at 13 or 19. At that point I think the rankings fall back to whatever version of the Nfl you enjoy the most