NoSaint

I mean we see good players start with hand injuries that would prevent grabbing. So in theory this kid could still play at a high level- and he’d be totally comfortable in the technique. Its an interesting situation

Lets be real, if it was an accusation against any patriot player, doc would be passing out pitchforks. He’s not suddenly super principled- he just likes this one disappearing

Or he realized that he didn’t actually want that distraction for himself and his team so he put the lid back on. Ultimately, we don’t know much of what happened. I think it would be strange to fabricate it completely, but I’m not going to riot against incognito either We don’t even know the first part. Just that no one was motivated to expose it if he did. But with the bills on offense, there’s a chance it was while it was loud - and who knows how loud it may have been said. maybe it happened, maybe it didn’t - no need to rush to say one way or the other. Doesn’t hurt to simply leave it as we don’t know.

Frankly, as should we. There’s a reason a lot of us were upset we didn’t take more shots. Catch- good pi- good interception- not bad (like a punt) at some one point you have to create chunk yardage. Especially when putting up only 3 points like a quarter of the weeks you play

I think it’s dicey. But also a guy that joined the firm 10 years after the contract finished and the league almost 10 more years later, right? It’s not like a guy that directly worked on the deal In any way shape or form? of the conflicts out there I thought a former falcons player reffing the saints falcons game was a worse example. the league would be well served to avoid these optics even if there’s no documented issue.

This honestly doesn’t bother me as long as there are some boundaries. I don’t want Tom to be playing golf with the guy 3 times a week all offseason- but these are humans in close contact with other humans and ideally all with a shared passion for the game. I don’t mind a “good game” moment or chatting pregame, or throwing a comment after a big play. i likewise don’t get fired up when coaches or players are friendly with opponents. but I get how it all can run people the wrong way.

Ill buy the “Jordan effect” or other subconscious biases. I don’t think it’s a league directive by any means though. Yes, I think they are favored to a degree though. I also think theres some truth to various other factors though. I think they are a well coached team that gets its players prepped for situations as well as any team in the league. I think that fans here are eager to remember the calls the pats get and forgot the calls that go against them. Yes, some go against them and I’d venture most flat remember none. Part of that is they are a good team and still win. Part is people want to believe in the conspiracy. i think people have started pointing at good calls as proof of bias. When you are so riled up that every call is proof even when it’s the right call — it certainly feels like they are always getting the breaks. When you add up a natural bias from refs towards stars, bias of our fans against them, and also them just being really good— things start feeling really skewed when they are probably just a little off kilter

Meh. I’m not denying pride and work ethic are big. But I think it’s hard to get 53 high talent, big, fast, smart, healthy, self motivated guys under the cap. So do you get less talent? Or take risks elsewhere? I tend to think the best teams keep some rough around the edges guys and count on the fact that when you are in the big moments they will show up. A guy that’s a trouble maker on a 6-10 squad can be a super bowl mvp on a 13-3 team kind of thing. ultimately there is a balance though. If the EJ pick worked, I don’t think we run into as much trouble with motivation. You’d have guys winning, in a scheme they were suited to play in for coaches they signed up to play for... im hoping that McD finds his couple of explosive guys that come cheaper than they should because of trouble but drink the kool aid while they are here

It’s a long shot, but any given Sunday. I always like to put these in perspective with looking at it like a playoff series almost If they played a full 7 games head to head — i think I put the over under at 4.5 pats wins, and likely bet the over still? Really I think 5 out of 7 would be the magic number.

Ha! I’m sneaky like that. Im not even sure our pick will be better, but we have to take a shot. Find a guy and go get him- however is needed. Hopefully what appears to be a more stable franchise will help be a better foundation for whoever that pick is.... but we need to go hard for someone the coaches/scouts think have a shot

I think it’s fair. I think you have to acknowledge the coaching dynamic- but that doesn’t excuse him. His inability to obtain the power one needs to succeed is as much of a strike against him as picking the wrong coach would be. When the guy that is supposed to be in charge is willing to be complacent and defer major decisions instead of making the case to his boss for how things need to be— that’s a failure. but I think that it’s hard to argue that outside of qb the marrone/schwartz team had a fantastic 50 other players assembled. Likewise, for as often as we switched scheme- we kept talent levels high. i will always be curious about the discussions about qb (draft and free agency) that happened behind closed doors.

I don’t think you understand my opinions on Tyrod any more than you understand QB play. Ive long said a Tyrod (or Orton, or fitz) could get a team there. I don’t believe the playoffs are some insurmountable accomplishment - which makes the last two decades all the more frustrating. I’ve even argued Tyrod could win some playoff games but that I don’t think he has much of a shot to string together the type of run that a super bowl requires... or the type of play that gets you to the playoffs year in and year out. i likewise think there’s a good chance that Tyrod plus a first rounder would make the most sense unless we get a good deal or surprise opportunity. I am capable of reconciling that he’s not good enough with the fact that he’s better than many and there are cap implications to a move. But we need to open up the offense and have him make plays. As was, the situation made little sense moving forward. With the new oc- maybe. yup, I too think the peterman gang is crazy But alas, it’s your whacky obsession with him where we diverge. I find it amusing and will throw a joke your way now and again. No real harm or animosity meant- but I’m going to occasionally tease you for starting so many threads about him or pointing fingers at the third string TE when we score 3 points. Our offense needed a change and production at qb has been a major problem. That’s several factors contributing but the biggest is qb.

Cheers to that, and wasn’t meaning to hit you with the melt comment as much as a general tone from many — enjoy your evening!

Foles is going to get the over on yards, and win, I think

Schwartz runs a very similar defense. Invest in the front 4. Have a disrupter inside.

On his good days he looks good on his bad days he looks bad he has a few too many bad its not a complicated discussion, simply that you can’t just take him at his best and expect it consistently

I get it- I’m not a huge fan of officiating changing on big stages. I’d rather it be the same on the first and last play of the season. Just arguing that as long as it’s generally consistent between teams it’s hard to justify melting down that it was fixed

Ill keep an eye out for a replay - but think it’s relevant to continue to echo that only one hold was called all day (when a player was taken to the ground and laid on top of when he had a path to the qb) im not arguing neither team held but that the refs made it clear that they weren’t really tossing flags on either team. I’d guess with the same focus you find jags holding uncalled too, no? Mid your standard for refs is perfection- I’m not sure why you ever enjoyed football. One questionable call in the first half is a banner day for officiating.

Yea, I qualified post snap. Did you see any procedural stuff missed? A delay of game and not getting set on a hurry up aren’t really all that meaningful to this debate they? and yea, 1 questionable PI in the first half... that’s not a substantial issue with officiating.

4 gameplay fouls vs 1 is nearly nothing called. If you want to jump in and change the discussion, I’m glad to go back that direction— but you’ve heard my take. the call in the first half I only half saw and didn’t see a replay... I read a mixed bag on it the dpi in the second half the guy got there considerably early, grabbed and twisted effecting the upper body on a very catchable ball. If we are down to one questionable dpi - the refs had a stellar day. There are calls and games I won’t defend but if that same exact game happened but Steelers vs jags instead, the board would be generally praising it.

Honestly, I’m not going to dive into comparing non calls right now. It makes for terrible conversation here (much easier in person, unless we both have video cued up). ill stand by that they called nearly nothing on either team post snap. The refs kept the flags tucked, and generally got right turnovers, catches, etc... if you want to make a case that there was substantial no calls the pats got away with that the jags didn’t, id almost ask you if the jags should’ve pushed further too (but I obviously don’t think this one was poorly officiated)

I mean, if we are down to one bad PI call, and the rest called pretty even— I’d venture that the issue is expectations if calling it beyond terrible

Exactly. You pull the obvious and non debatable pre snap calls and there were very few calls on either team. A H2H hit that knocked out the pats best receiver was a fair call. Taking down a defender and laying on top of him was the only hold on either team. The PI before the half I didn’t see a replay but the one after the half obvious (way early and involved both grabbing and twisting the upper body effecting the catch on a very catchable ball) it wasnt like one side got hit hit with Ticky tack calls or it was terribly inconsistent. The only way your truly angry about officials in that game is if you were angry before the game started.

Jax only got called for one hold and it was both obvious and impacted the play. It’s not like they killed the jags with holding flags

The ramsey PI was obvious, the hit on gronk was a penalty, the delay of game was real, the hold was very legit. That leaves the one PI that I didn’t catch replays of that I can’t comment on Come on promo