starrymessenger

I know. It means absolutely nothing because of the differences between what Wentz was asked to do, and did, and what Allen's responsibilities were. If you think Allen is as polished and pro ready as Wentz was you are mistaken. Some of the differences are accounted for by the fact that Wentz, though also playing for a small school, had a much better team than Allen had, especially the 2017 WYO team. The difference in talent between Mac and Nate on the one hand and Allen on the other is impossible to miss. Allen dwarfs them in terms of physical ability, that's readily apparent. Allen may well also give you the best chance of winning in the short term but becoming a franchise player is a longer term proposition. Thats entirely possible. But a few months is almost certainly not long enuf to properly prepare him. It took AR three years. Mahomes got a year.

JMO but I have concerns about JA starting at this time in the regular season. I have a hard time believing that he has cleaned up the problems that were so evident in his college tape in the few months since he was drafted. It took AR three years to work out the kinks in his game - and they were fewer and less serious than Allen's. More recently a more accurate passer (under the tutelage of Andy Reid no less), P. Mahomes, was given a year to straighten out his footwork. JA brings as much physical ability to the table as Cam Newton or Andrew Luck. But he is a lot less polished than they were when they came into the league. JA is not Carson Wentz either. Wentz was fully in control of a pro style offence. Allen's offence may have featured pro style sets, but it's not just lining up under centre that makes it a pro offence. Unlike Wentz, Allen was given simplified half field read responsibilities where he threw to his receivers if and when they were open not unlike in a typical college spread system. He did not run a true pro style timing offence. My concern is not that starting him early will destroy his confidence. He may at this time actually have too much of that. My concern is that starting him now behind a porous line will make it much more difficult for the coaches to work on correcting his flaws and bad tendencies, even if he gives the team the best chance of winning in the short term. Unless that stuff gets cleaned up he will never become franchise transforming player we all want him to be. My guess is that the braintrust will resist fan and media pressure to start him right away, meaning that we are likely to see Peterman. With Mac out for what is now an indeterminate period the Bills are in a really tough spot as their options have been considerably limited.

Allen has also previously broken his collarbone.

Not the way teams usually go about things in preseason, but maybe the Bills now give JA the majority of first team reps and start him next week. If he does well they install him as starter for the season opener. If he struggles they start Peterman. JA is clearly the future and maybe the future is now but I'm a little nervous about throwing him to the wolves immediately. I'm not worried about his losing his confidence. He looks to be as strong mentally as he is physically. That said I might feel better if he got to start acclimating to the pro environment on the sidelines for a few games anyway. I think Peterman may have the wherewithal to develop into a good long term backup for the Bills. When it comes to arm strength I'm not that concerned about his long ball. The PI TD that he threw to Streater in game 1 travelled 40 yards in the air and was spot on target. I think he can probably be effective within a range of 50 yards. That's not JA or Mahomes range but it may stretch the field just enuf. I am more concerned about velocity on throws in the intermediate range. I suspect that he can throw a decent out to his left but has difficulting making that throw at the NFL level to his right. As a right handed QB this suggests to me that the problem may be partly mechanical. You can maybe get away with less than ideal mechanics if you have Allen's arm, but Peterman does not have that luxury (and there is WYO tape of Allen getting pick sixed on a shallow out as well, the problem there being misreading coverage more than lack of arm strength). Peterman not only has good chemistry with our # 1 but, for those who remember his Senior Bowl, with Zay as well. I think he has the smarts and the basic skill set to execute Daboll's offence competently. So I would not be against him getting the start against the Ravens. But if Allen does well against the 1s in practice and in game 3 it will be difficult to deny him the start, as he will have earned it.

It's in the past. A long football time ago.

I didn't see him winning that horse race either but I would have liked for him to have a fair shot. I don't think he got that tonight. Oh well, life ain't fair. It just is.

Not Mac's day I guess. Ball falls through kB's mitts to get started. Then he gets killed behind a completely overmatched O line. Sad.

Two minute drill.

Everything happens so much faster.

I don't know how many Superbowls he's going to win (if any). Some great QBs never did, as we all know. Nothing is guaranteed, but what I feel comfortable saying is that there is a palpable possibility that the Bills may have landed nothing less than a generational talent at the all important position. The only other rook I have felt that way about is Andrew Luck.

That's a play/throw that makes me uneasy because I don't see it translating well at all at the NFL level. He should throw it away rather than risk the turnover. But I will say this. He was under similar pressure a lot at WYO and I have seen him make the exact same play/throw in his college game tape, at least once for a TD and another time for a sizeable gain. So it's not a fluke. I find it incredible that he can manage the outcome on a throw like that enuf to make it a risk worth taking but hey maybe he can. His arm talent is simply amazing, we all know. If his field vision and ball placement can be so good as to permit that kind of throw to result in completions then his talent goes way beyond simple arm strength (whether he should be making that throw or not). In other words it strongly suggests that he is not just another Kyle Boller.

Peterman had a good, even maybe very good, showing against the Panthers. But it wasn't perfect. He's generally accurate and can throw with anticipation, but he wasn't pinpoint accurate. His first throw, the slant to Cadet, was behind the receiver. It resulted in a PI call and a first down but a pass like that can easily be picked off by a good slot corner. The pick on the throw to Ivory was also slightly behind the receiver. Sure Ivory should still have made the play but it's worth mentioning that both the Cadet and Ivory throws were on slants left to right, the only ones of that kind attempted, and both were slightly off target (the Cadet throw more than the one to Ivory). Peterman's best throw was the TD pass to Streater. It was so perfectly placed that without the push off the receiver would have been in great position to beat the corner. Thing to note about that pass is that it was 40 yards in the air and Peterman did not throw his arm out making it. In other words you could probably add another 10 yards or so if you were looking to fix Peterman's long ball range. A well placed 50 yard pass is pretty good, and certainly good enuf to say that Peterman can probably throw a good deep ball. Where I think we may like to see more zip on his throws is in the intermediate range, underneath patterns, outs and curls. He has to keep DBs from comfortably sitting on his throws with the certain knowledge that the play will remain in front of them with plenty of time to pick or immediately wrap up the receiver. If he can do those things even moderately well, and keep his composure in the pocket, he probably has a future in this league. If he continues to show well in preseason I would not be surprised if the Bills looked to move AJM. It would certainly be a refreshing change to have a talented starter (Allen) backup up by a capable backup both on rookie deals.

To me whether or not the Bills have a shot at fielding a decent and reasonably productive WR corps in 2018 depends much more on the condition of Kelvin Benjamin's knees than than on any other factor, more even than on who is taking snaps under centre. If he stays healthy in this his contract year he will not only have a 1000+ yard season but will open the door of opportunity for the other guys who make the roster. Important also not to lose sight of the impact of what looks to be a major upgrade at OC. If KB is good to go we could well see a significant improvement not only in the passing game but in the O overall.

Osweiler, Lynch...some GMs are just suckers for big bodies I guess. Lynch simply does not look to have a future in this league. Gives absolutely zero indication that he belongs on an NFL playing field. I don't know whether and how he will develop but Chad Kelly for sure has a chance. I knew about the injury and his being a head case and all but I had a hard time understanding why he was not drafted much earlier. I saw a fair number of his college games and it always seemed to me that the talent was definitely there. He may turn into a real steal for the Broncos. He will have to after the Lynch fiasco. There are a number of late round or undrafted youngsters who are looking pretty good so far this preseason - Fales, Kelly, Slotter, that kid who came in after Cam for Carolina.

I do think there is a meaningful distinction to be drawn between inaccuracy and inconsistency. Allen can be deadly accurate. He will make throws that only the greatest QBs playing the game today can make. And it's not an accident. He actually does it quite a lot. Inaccurate QBs simply "cannot do what [Allen] do" in the words of Chad Johnson. He just needs to learn to do it more often and the Bills have pushed a lot of chips on the square that says he can. I like the bet they made. I like it a lot.

The risk starting a young QB too early is irreparable damage to his confidence. It's a psychological thing. I'm starting to doubt that Allen is even capable of losing his confidence. His every action seems to show total self assurance. Combine that with talent that's just crazy and you could be looking at a prodigy. And that voodoo chemistry can be infectious - raise a lot of guys levels of play. If it looks like he can handle it (while understanding that he is going to make some mistakes) and if he outperforms the other guys through what's left of the preseason practices and games, then IMO he should get the start when the bullets start flying for real.

Excellent breakdown. Thanks for posting. Allen's talent is flat out ridiculous. I had projected him as potentially in the Elway mould, and I'm still comfortable with that comparison, but man the Favre likeness is compelling. No QB ever had as much insane confidence in his arm as Brett Favre - unless it's maybe Josh Allen. Ungodly testosterone. If as advertised he's also a really quick study, they should probably start him sooner rather than later. I'd try to accelerate his second and first team reps and live action and see how he does. If he handles it well I would turn him loose. This kid has the potential to be a dominant player at the all important position.

Allen's play on Thursday night was exactly identical to his WYO game tape, some eye-popping, some head scratching, some deadly accurate, some inaccurate. He prolly felt right at home behind that porous O-line.

Either he has a volcano in his belly or its his contract year. Its his contract year. He should be fun to watch this year. Hope he stays healthy.

66% is pretty darn good. Couple hundred a game - meh, sort of Joe Montanaish. He also had his share of 300 yard games. Chad was narrowly beaten out by Peyton as league MVP one year. Twice comeback player of the year. Played a long time in the league. If NP can morph into Chad I'll be deliriously happy. Turning a fifth round pick into the equivalent of 18th overall. Sure if Allen can develop into Elway, he's the starter and with Nate/Chad backing him up the Bills would prolly have the best tandem under centre league wide. The rap against Nate is arm strength. I defer to more knowledgeable posters on this but I'm not sure arm strength alone will be the reason he fails to make it in the NFL. Maybe a stupid question but is his arm that much weaker than Drew Brees? Or Joe Montana? For almost all QBs, including the great one, so much depends on scheme and offensive philosophy.

If he's Chad Pennington (the pre-injury Chad) the Bills have struck gold. Who wouldn't want CP as a long term backup. People don't seem to realize that CP was a good starting calibre QB. I'd say Nate has a lot to prove before he is worthy of that comparison. Assuming he wins the job I think we find out very soon whether he can play at this level or not. Ravens are a tough D with good young corners and tough veteran safeties.

Agreed. TO and JR dropped some balls. They all do. But needless to say those guys also knew to play the position at a high level. So far the rap sheet says Corey Coleman does not have the necessary skills/awareness to de successful. Hope he can turn it around Still an excellent move on spec by Beane. The raw talent and athleticism are there. NFL calibre specific receiver skillset has yet to make its appearance.

Yeah. Sorta like Mike Williams and Corey Davis in 2018. And I'd love to have either of those guys. Most young wideouts take a few years at least to acclimate, unless they are in a scheme that favours them and have a proven veteran passer throwing them the ball. And even then. A scheme thing. He was used as a possession receiver to be sure - but was that the best use of his skillset?

Except he was thought to be the best WR prospect in his class by many, not just Cleveland. And there is nothing unusual about a highly touted (and drafted) WR completely underwhelming his first couple of years in the league. There are so many examples, some close to home as well. And it can be for all sorts of reasons. Some eventually come around and realize their potential. Hopefully Coleman (and Zay) will wind up in that grouping. Great trade by Beane. Got something (raw talent and athleticism) for nothing.

Agreed. Turns out motivation, or more the lack thereof, has long been a problem. I remember Chan complaining bitterly about how his coaches always had to be on him. And that was before he cashed in (and checked out). Now that he's rolling in money there is nothing left to motivate him. Always disappointing to see a player with that much talent laze out but it happens. You aren't going to be good in this league unless you really want to be, no matter how gifted you are.