birdog1960

since it seems to be biography week here at ppp: i opened a solo practice 17 years ago. built it to 6 providers and sold it last year to a regional system. i'm now an employee. there was no one on my staff making less than $10 at the time of the sale and the system kept all employees at their current pay levels and seniority.

maybe you should ask facebook

i'd make sure to request capital from minority and women run banks like several other recent offerings? i don't know...how would you treat collagenous colitis?

are you mario balti(sp?)

or maybe we could get william cohan to speak.

which implies the desire to decieve...nice honest work if you can get it. maybe we need a speaker at one of our national conventions to explain the facts of life to us.

most nursing assistants/orderlies in nursing homes/rest homes i've met make minimum wage and no insurance. i recently found such a worker to have a positive ppd (tb test) and prescribed 9 months of the standard treatment. he couldn't afford it (and the required blood work to monitor therapy) nor would his employer pay for it despite the fact it was highly likely that he was exposed at his job. 25k at 7.25 is a lot of hours. but of course your familiar with that. me too. i could rebut the rest of your screed but it would only serve to inflame an already red hot nerve and what purpose would that serve? so i'll leave it at that.

no, it's obviously not. switzerland was, once again, used to illustrate a current example of a nation that has largely accomplished a living wage. as correctly pointed out, the us is in many ways dissimilar. what works for them won't necessarily work for us. that doesn't mean it can't be accomplished at all.

no, you really don't get it. who's gonna wipe your grandpas butt in the nursing home? that function has value. is it worth the cost of food and shelter and basic healthcare? i say it is. you say that worker needs more skills to deserve that compensation. i disagree but even if he/she does, then who will do the task. you? your premise is based on the foundations of our current "free market" economy. mine isn't limited by those constraints. and who is arguing that money has inherent value? GG's the one that argues that all switzerland's success lays at the feet of money manipulators (financial services guys).. i fail to see much inherent value there. i'm arguing against that very principle. and it wouldn't be so very punitive to the middle class if it was funded by surcharges on the wealthy. perhaps a significant luxury tax to subsidize the minimum wage. i'm confident a mechanism could be engineered. it's not impossible to devise a system that results in a more equitable division of wealth without entering into what a majority of observers would call socialism.

there are plenty of everyday folk as well. bus drivers, secretaries, maintenance workers, food workers, nurses, doctors, plumbersl, cashiers, farmers and electricians...everyone it takes to make things work for those financial services big shots. now your gonna tell me that it's all trickle down from the real producers - the money guys, right?

those numbers including the exchange rate come from the piece you linked.

it more closely approaches a living wage if costs go up less than wages. in the test tubes countries that have done this, i believe that's generally been the case.

swiss wages

the swiss franc and dollar are almost at par. 10% of swiss make less than 4000 francs/month or about $48000/year. those are numbers even the most ardent american liberal would be content with.

don't forget pharmaceuticals and cowbells and cuckoo clocks

ok then. as masters of the universe lets compromise: $10/hour for minimum wage and we can keep our individuality, not to mention OUR evil bankers.

i don't think you have to mimick the bad parts to have the good parts. but i think we'd do better in the us of a with a bit more adherence to the rules. yes?

yes, if you like being told not to let your foot touch the seat next to you on the train. there is a unsubstantiated story i heard from a relative in zurich. a couple were having a party and one of the neighbor guests left early. about 1/2 hour later the police arrived at the party. the guest that left had complained about the noise. i also saw a sign she posted on facebook that showed an accordion with a line through it - wouldn't think loud accordian music would be a major problem but that's the swiss.

they aren't there in great numbers: "miniscule underground economy". there will always be some cheaters. there not very well tolerated by the swiss however. they're rules people: think parochial school without the religion.

and? therefore?

yes, it's not a gordion knot. there is a point where wages meet a basic standard of living despite increased cost...like um, in switzerland.

and that recognition doesn't require low skilled workers to be paid at below the poverty level.

really? who's gonna flip your burgers? wipe your grandpas butt at the nursing home? pick your tomatoes? clean your hotel room or office? tend to your garden? etc., etc, etc.

i freely admitted that costs would increase for goods and services. they're artificially low because of exploitation of an entire underclass of people who you apparently believe don't deserve adequate shelter, health care or decent general living conditions.

i didn't say we had to mirror the swiss. i used them as a counterexample to s africa. nevertheless, i'll bet arguments similar to yours were used against the emancipation of the slaves. that worked out ok despite the obvious economic implications and besides that it was the right thing to do. we can't compete with chinese peasant wages now nor should we try.