PDaDdy

This is sort of my point. Nobody can define a franchise QB so therefore nobody can AGREE on what a franchise QB is. Basically you gave 12 QBs in the last 18 or so years. See what I mean? You only listed 3 Franchise QBs that are currently playing in the league. Rodgers and Brees are currently going to be watching the superbowl from home because they were beaten by good defenses or at least defenses that played REALLY well that day. Look at the talent and teams those guys have around them? I watched the probowl. Brady and Rogers have lineman in the probowl and have probowl WRs/TEs playing with them. Most if not all had offensive lineman in the probowl. Drew Brees in particular had 4 repeat FOUR of his offensive lineman playing at one point in the probowl. When Fitz has even close to that level of talent around him then we can make a decision whether he is good enough or not. Fitz is 29. Give the guy an actual off season, OTA and training camp, keep his WRs, his LTs and Center healthy and we'll see the performance from him we saw through week 6 when he was the best QB in the league and the Bills had the best record in the league. Our team is rebuilding. You trade up for a first round pick to try to get a QB to put on the bench to groom. You move up for a slam dunk franchise starter. Let's address this teams TRUE and much BIGGER problems first and you will see we can be a much better team without panicking about our signal caller. Why would we? Best player available at a position of need given Lynches impending exist and Jackson being over 30.

Sorry. It doesn't work like that. The league has become more offense heavy yes. ALL QBs have benefited from this not just the "franchise" QBs. Can you define statistically what a franchise QB looks like? TDs? INTs? Completion percentage? Yards? QB rating (old or new version)? Once you answer those questions you will find your answer. Franchise QBs are as much a product of the talent around them, the scheme they are in and the support given to them as they are born. Franchise QB by most peoples estimation Drew Brees had 4, repeat FOUR, of his offensive lineman playing in the probowl. He had his TE playing in the probowl and who knows who else on a team with a defense that is light years ahead of ours on the other side of the ball. Do you think the talent around a QB has an impact on the less observant fan's assessment of their value? I DOUBLE DOG DARE YOU TO DEFINE WHAT A FRANCHISE QB IS WITH NUMBERS? Nobody has accepted the challenge to date. You know why? Because then they can't B word about not having one. They will then either realize that almost none exist in the league or people that they whine about not being franchise really are.

We have literally one of the worst defenses in the league statistically. Why would we trade up to draft a QB when it isn't anywhere near one of our biggest needs? Who would they throw to? Who would protect their backside?

EXACTLY! I love KW but I think he is being wasted a bit at NT because he IS a great penetrater. We need a guy that can play the zero technique and push the Center back into the QBs face if he is single blocked or shade to either side and penetrate. We need a 350 lb fat bastard, with short area quickness and a good motor!

I heard we ran both almost equally. Really does't matter.

The one year wonder might be there for us in the second round.

I also noticed that franchise QB Drew Brees currently has 4 of his offensive lineman playing for the NFC right now. Wonder how good he would look behind our line. We gave up the least sacks in the league but have nobody in the probowl. I wonder how that is? Our line is awesome.

Our defense was ranked last in the league and barely improved. Dareus and Byrd were rare bright spots on that side of the ball. Our offense would have been just fine without the multiple injuries and/or lack of talent at WR, LT and C. Netwon, and Miller weren't even options for us so no use sweating it. Hell, most of our outstanding talent evaluaters on this board didn't even want Newton anyway and some threatened to stop being fans if we drafted him as they thought he was terrible. Blaine Gabert should have been our pick! LOL. Don't you know that probowls don't mean anything! Just ask the Jason Peters haters! One thing I did notice was the ex bills playing in the probowl. I also noticed that a team that made the AFC championship game 2 of the last 3 years had 2 offensive lineman blocking in the probowl. If their center didn't go down for the year they would have likely had 3 of the 5 AFC offensive lineman.

But SJ is a true #1 that made Lee Evans expendable!!!!

Either one of those guys would be huge upgrades. Buddy basically speaks his mind about the draft if you just listen to him. In a strange way he is the most deceptive because instead of spreading misinformation he basically tells you what he is going to do and nobody believes him. I would **** myself if we got V. Jackson. It would be the first time we would have 2 good WR on the team at the same time with a QB that has some balls to get rid of it. TO, Evans and SJ before he broke out was such a waste with Trent Deadwards at the helm. It could also explain the delay with getting a deal done for SJ as they are probably trying to figure out their WR budget. GO BILLS!!

Screwed? He's still under contract! If he sits out I wonder if Bills fans will give him the Jason Peters treatment. ROFLOL. I would love to keep FJ and make him happy for 2 or 3 years as part of a deadly 1 - 2 punch but he will be 31 and is coming off a broken leg.

But he sucks! FJ is better. LOL. Not knocking FJ just pointing out that both guys were very good. I never could figure out why fans loved one and hated the other. Idiots! We love to run talent out of town.

Must be an Upshaw fan...LOL....zing! Ahhh...another Upshaw fan. Only the Bills fans can turn good performance into a negative. LOL.

Or a team whose defense didn't at least play well when it counted in the playoffs.

Please statistically define what a elite QB is? Please tell us how many QBs meet this criteria? I also have to add you have it all backward. Every year you attempt to build a team. If a slam dunk elite QB comes along which nobody has accepted my challenge to define then you get him. Otherwise you run the risk that your elite QB gets killed or gets run out of town before you can build a team around him if you wait to build a team.

No my point is that before he got lucky and the starter went down in St Louis we might still not know who he was. He had years of terrible to no nfl performance to start his career. He had success and failure after he finally stuck in the national football league. The only things that changed were he was given a chance and at certain times he had the right talent, the right situation and right scheme working for him. These people with blinders on like to point to Fitz past as being mediocre which it generally was. We did however see what he could do when the poor talent that we have to offer to put around was healthy. He was leading the league and so were Bills. His WRs started dropping like flies as did his offensive lineman and all of a sudden people forgot he was a MVP candidate and playing step for step with the best QBs in the league. I'm really trying not to insult these people's intelligence but come on! They need to open their eyes. How can you ignore what this team was accomplishing and his role in it the first 3rd of this year? That is what he and this team can achieve WHEN IT IS HEALTHY. We are still just beginning our rebuilding and we don't have the depth much less the starting talent to keep the juggernaut rolling when key starters especially a lot of key starters at the same position go down. They are so misguided that they would rather worry about replacing a probowl league leading QB through week 6 when the team was healthy instead of worrying about the 30th ranked defense in the league. I mean how dense are these people?

Sadly +1. If the NFL rules were as offensive and QB friendly as they now are I dare say we would have 4 super bowl wins. I'm 1000% serious about that. Jim Kelly got hammered every play and our WRs got mugged all over the field in the superbowls.

Very cool article. I'm not in the slightest bit surprised. Basically you have to be really good at one and not terrible at the other WHEN IT COUNTS! Some mediocre regular season defenses have played well in the play offs and some mediocre regular season offenses have played well in the play offs. I am REALLY REALLY interested though to see what these guys take is specifically on playing good defense in the playoffs. They seem to only reference regular season defensive performance where in this thread I am focusing on post season defensive performance. In other words good post season defense wins championships. Another catch phrase that many have heard is that the season starts over when the play offs begin and the regular season means nothing. My discussion centers around the combination of thase two tenants. Absolutely! People seem to forget and they look at the QB position in a vacuum and ignore who he is or isn't throwing to or how much time he has to throw it or they only focus on one side of the ball. When the play offs begin everyone is 0 - 0 and the regular season doesn't matter. An interesting point is that the two super bowl contenders bring the #2 and #4 post season defenses. They do also bring in reverse order the #2 and #4 offenses. Hrmmm....maybe balance and team effort are really the answer not a single side of the ball or a single position oh say for example QB?

This is a very real question. It was sparked of course by a well timed post by another member that proclaimed that there were no first round RBs left in the playoffs at the conference championship level. Of course this was a back handed stab at teams like the Bills that select best player available which happened to be a RB instead of playing the lottery every year and trying to find the elusive and undefinable franchise QB. It did get me thinking though. What I found is that there seems to be something of a correlation between teams that are playing GREAT defense in the POST season and continued success in the play offs. What was interesting as a poster pointed out is that the Patriots in the regular season had a horrible defense statistically but have been GREAT in the post season. The whoopin' they put on the Ravens offense was what won the game for them as Brady, their elite, messiah, franchise QB failed them. Vince Wilfork was almost literally unstoppable. Small sample size? Yes. But without those great defensive performances Tom "Franchise" Brady would be sitting at home thinking about next year. Last year Green Bay's defense was lights out in their superbowl victory run. Good teams that make the playoffs play good defense when it counts. I am just bringing up another view of one of the MANY factors that come into play trying to get deep into the play offs. People have become so ridiculously focused on the QB position to the exclusion of everything else it is almost unbelievable. Have things gotten so bad that we aren't even concerned with building a good team and addressing one of the worst defenses in the league that last 4 years? People are still whining about QB when there are so many and I really mean SOOOOOO many other problems that are so much more important to building THIS team. Any supposedly franchise QB, which nobody can quantitatively or qualitatively define, would fail without talent around them. We could bring in anyone's favorite "elite QB" and they would fail with the talent on this team. The way some people talk you would think that games are decided by a single man on each team, the QB, lining up against each other and a contest of passing drills wins the day while ignoring who they have to pass to and who is attempting to prevent the other QB from scoring.

Just thought this was REALLY interesting. Everyone likes to talk about the need for a franchise QB but three....repeat THREE of the top 4 defenses in the post season made it to the divisional championship round. Two out of 3 of those defenses will play in the superbowl. There are some really good QBs that left in the first round of the play offs that are going to be watching from home a couple sundays from now. Basically if you don't have a franchise post season defense you don't have a shot. Apparently defense might still win championships

But but but he was franchise QB with a superbowl ring? He's in hall of fame discussions!

WHAT IS A FRANCHISE QB!?!??!?!?!? FOR THE LOVE OF FREAKIN' GOD CAN SOMEONE STATISTICALLY DEFINE WHAT A FRANCHISE QB IS? This term is complete and total BS as NO ONE and I mean NO ONE can define what that is or even tries for that matter. "Stop the insanity!"

1st Coples DE/OLB 2nd Mercilus OLB That would be a pretty decent start in my opinion. Our defenses is our biggest problem. People need to stop whining about Fitz and focus on our real problems.

Dude. I just hope that the Dolphins don't draft Coples. As much as some people are down on him I would hate to see that beast line up against us twice a year.

What would you have said of Warner's career up to the point where he was a back up to the actual starter in St Louis? He had YEARS of poor performance being picked up by the Packers and getting cut before the season. He had years of NO performance stocking shelves. He had a year of poor performance in St Louis his first year. With fans like you Warner would have never gotten a chance because he didn't have a ring and you could base your opinion on his career not of mediocrity but his career of horrible to NO performance. Everyone is an expert in evaluating talent in hindsite. Very few can see it before it is given a chance to blossom. I guess I can't blame you for not having the vision to see that Fitz is more than good enough if we put talent around him and keep that talent healthy. Continue the man-hate for Fitz. It's your opinion. Hopefully people like you with little vision won't run him out of town before he shows enough, long enough to shut people like you up. Then you will of course make up excuses for your lack of vision if we actually obtain success. I will reserve judgement until we actually have some talent at WR not named SJ, they stay healthy and we have more than a second to last place defense on the other side of the ball.