PDaDdy

Seriously man. Jauron is no hall of fame coach but continually blaming him isn't the answer. It prevents us from laying proper blame at the feet of the actual players who epically failed on Sunday. Jauron is a defensive coordinator. Do you think the offense is his doing? If he's guilty of anything it's sticking with Trent Edwards or not hitting him with a club every time he checks down when there is an opportunity to go down field. Because Trent is given the latitude to call audible at the line of scrimmage I don't know that I can properly assess blame as far as AVP goes. Some quote of AVP shows he's trying to protect his QB but I don't know how much I can lay at his feet. According to Thurman Thomas Edwards was not even seeing open WR down field. I'll take Hall of Famer, Probowler and experienced as they come veteran's opinion on that one I guess. Stop making excuses for Trent and it will be easier to deal with this rough period. Until I see two things from Edwards we are DOOMED. 1) He needs to start hitting WR down field and in stride. Under thrown or the new one the over thrown ball yesterday screw up what could be TDs if he had some accuracy and arm strength. 2) He needs to trust his WRs and throw them some 50/50 balls. I like Lee Evans but I'm talking more about our 6'2" + guys. Give a guy like Owens a chance to out muscle and out jump a 5'9" DB instead a dump off for a 3 yard gain on 3rd and long. Until he can do these two things on a consistent basis people...WE WILL GO NOWHERE!!!!

Does Jauron call 5 yard pass plays all day? Does Jauron call a run play the vast majority of time he audibles at the line? Does Jauron over throw the WR by 4 yards on a 15 yard route the only time they tried it all day I think? Did Jauron snap the ball at Trent's feet the entire second half of the game?

You can't coach balls!

As stated earlier it was a colossal failure for the ENTIRE offense and Trent was Captain Checkdown running the ship. This approach is dangerous in my mind with the blame everyone else and sometimes a problem with society. No personal accountability. It's someone's parents fault, where they were brought up, some circumstance outside of their control. You tell me. What was TRENT responsible for? I want to hear it from you succinctly. Did Trent do anything wrong or was it everyone else? If I was QB we would REALLY be in trouble. LOL. I tell you what though. I think I could make up my mind in the 3+ seconds Trent was afforded and throw it easily as far as old rubber arm does JUST SAY NO to swinging from Trent's junk! Addiction isn't pretty. Admitting there is a problem and over coming denial is the first step. Don't lose your mind over this. Just a funny statement I think of when I hear apologies in the face of observed poor performance. My opinion of course. I know what you are trying to say with winning and not losing being the same thing. Truthfully I think you are REALLY missing the point of the "playing not to lose" statement. It speaks to a philosophical approach to your game plan, attitude and strategy regardless of the game you play. You can take your shots, you can play aggressive, you do what you need to do to win. Play the best you can to put points on the board. Instead I think we played to not let the New Orleans offense get on the field which they seemed to do quite easily with our offensive ineptitude. I understand that you don't like the phrase. I used to have a problem ..."give it 110%". Makes no logical sense. How can someone give you more than their all? Well it also speaks to asking more of yourself. Giving more than you have been giving because nobody can truly ever really say they gave 100%. Let's not get hung up on phraseology. I'm not a Jauron hater. I don't think that he called up AVP and said lets stick to passes under 10 yards. Do you? Do you think Trent was SO harassed that in the entire game he was afforded one down field look to a WR? We destroyed Byron Leftwich of Tampa Bay and he was heaving it up all over the place.

Agreed 100%. This is how bad it's gotten for me. I consider Trent throwing over 15 yards down field a deep ball. *SIGH*

You're probably right but if he takes enough sacks maybe he will be unable to QB the team and someone else that actually requires a jock strap to play the game could try to get the job done.

Nope RBs too. Put Jackson and or Lynch up on the line empty backfield and off to the races!!!! As Trent sees the asses of his eligible receivers shirking as they fly down the field he will need to put it up over 15 yards in the air or eat the ball. Despite playing decently here and there this was another one of those games where it appears Trent just isn't the guy. I think he should be given the whole year to succeed or fail if not for anything else just to shut up the Trent appolgists that would complain until kingdom come about how he wasn't given a fair shot. It would be ironic indeed as I believe many of the Trent appolgists were not so adamant about giving JP the same chance under even worse conditions. I'm not sure if it's worth it to risk the rest of the season on a guy who loses his nerve and doesn't trust his own arm. OH BUT WAIT... I forgot he doesn't have a weak arm according to some. lol. If Trent doesn't trust his own arm why should I?? MAN I just don't know if it is worth potentially wasting the rest of the season just to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Trent is not the guy. Might be time to give Fitzpatrick a shot or go after a veteran QB who could actually manage and make use of all of the talent we have on offense in the skill positions.

We looked terrible in a defeat where our QB looked scared, made check down after check down and over threw TO by 4 - 5 yards on the one ball over 10 yards he attempted. After crying myself to sleep at how utterly ball-less our offense was it came to me this morning. I don't think it's any secret now that Trent is the problem when it comes to NOT getting the ball down field. Some might not be able to but I have just accepted that. Here's how we fix it. AVP needs to call fly patterns for all WRs!!!!! 999. If Captain Checkdown doesn't HAVE any one running short routes HE'LL HAVE NO ONE TO CHECK DOWN TO!!!!! Either let him throw it up deep or get sacked and knocked out to give someone else with some sack a shot. Either way it moves us in the right direction. Yes it was a colossal offensive TEAM failure but Trent was captaining the ship both figuratively and literally. I think we came back to reality with our patchwork offensive line this week. Let's hope they can play at a higher level next week. I feel sorry for the defense. They kept an awesome offense at bay most of the game until they just couldn't do it anymore because our offense was DETERMINED to play NOT to lose as opposed to PLAYING TO FREAKIN' WIN!!

Perhaps you're right. There were definitely more bigger names and veteran free agents. I don't know if McGahee actually played that year and I thought that it was prices last year not Lee Evans rookie year. Don't feel like going to look it up though. I think we can agree though that team is probably the 1st OR 2nd most talented team we have had since the Kelly era. Still no more room for excuses with Trent in my mind. PS. That must also mean that someone thinks that Donahoe was our best GM since the early 90's because if I'm not mistaken he put that team together for the most part.

To be sure that is the one year that is in the running for a QB having the best supporting cast. But I think it is this year because TO Evans, is better than Moulds Price, our RB tandem is better than Travis Henry and I think we have TEs that are going to be more productive than what Drew had. Definitely close though.

What I don't believe is that both things can be true. I think Trent could be a smart quick decision maker. Posssibly more is made of it than is really the case but he's pretty decent at it. I should have been more specific to take the wind out of post nit pickers like you. I am specifically referring to Trent's deep ball. Trent is off to a great start and his QB rating reflects that. What is of greater importance is how many TDs he has being 4 and INTs only 1 as you point out. and when you say: Lets review the logic here. 1) "Trent is an accurate passer" CHECK 2) "Arm strength is not a problem" CHECK 3) Under throws or throws late to WR on deep routes ...CHECK!!!!!!! Please explain a scenario where these 3 things can be true? You can't both be accurate, have adequate arm strength AND frequently under throw WRs on deep routes! AND YES, timing is part of accuracy. If you're trying to hit a moving target (a WR) and you throw the ball late or early..YOU HAVE MISSED YOUR MARK AND BY DEFINITION WERE NOT ACCURATE!!!! Listen up moron! If it took you 50 times to see the play and still managed to not see it properly I wouldn't be bragging about it. We have different definitions of what a good accurate pass is. "Catchable" is one thing, a good pass hitting a WR in stride is far superior. Take a look at those passes again. Now imagine them thrown 2 or 3 yards deeper. See it now? WR catches ball uncontested in stride. THAT IS ACCURACY!!!! The TO drop was DEFINITELY his best ball and was an accurate perfect pass. That one is on TO 100%., Again your math is wrong because of your assumptions. He threw 3, 3.5 out 4 catchable balls as you put it. HOWEVER he threw 3 out of 4 bad inaccurate balls. Get the difference? Truly because this is perhaps at the center of our disagreement. Bad inaccurate balls can be catchable. IT DOESN'T MAKE THEM GOOD PASSES!! If you are relying on your WR to bail you out on bad balls you aren't taking ownership and responsibility for delivering the best ball you can. 50/50 balls to your WRs are when you are making something out of nothing by throwing it up there. Throwing short when a WR could be catching it uncontested and streaking to the end zone untouched is NOT the same thing. Your asking your WR to make up for your bad ball. Again talking about Trent's deep ball. His short and intermediate game seems to be working really well so far.

LOL. How long have you been waiting to try to get back for that one? What I mean by those "who know anything" is people that don't attribute it to solar flares, concussions, WR running to fast or two slow or not fighting for the ball etc. People who aren't wearing rose colored glasses and see actual room for improvement on his deep ball. I'm not talking about people who see those things and minimize there importance or say he will grow out of it. I'm talking about people who don't think his deep balls are under thrown. To take a page from your book, "are we clear now?". LOL. In my case however I REALLY DO want you to understand what I meant by that because it wasn't that old tactic of taking a shot at people who disagree with me by talking about people who "know anything".

QUOTE (H2o @ Sep 25 2009, 06:50 PM) * Trent is an accurate passer and his arm strength is not the problem. His problem is having the patience to let the deeper routes develope and trusting that his receivers will make it to the opening that WILL be there. That extra half second can make all the world of difference, but that comes with time and building a chemistry with the guys on the field. He has to trust that the line is going to protect him, he has to trust that the WR is going to run the correct route, and he has to trust himself that he can get the ball there. I think Trent has shown major improvement thus far and against a 3-4 defense right out the gate. Lets review the logic here. 1) "Trent is an accurate passer" CHECK 2) "Arm strength is not a problem" CHECK 3) Under throws or throws late to WR on deep routes ...CHECK!!!!!!! Please explain a scenario where these 3 things can be true? You can't both be accurate, have adequate arm strength AND frequently under throw WRs on deep routes! AND YES, timing is part of accuracy. If you're trying to hit a moving target (a WR) and you throw the ball late or early..YOU HAVE MISSED YOUR MARK AND BY DEFINITION WERE NOT ACCURATE!!!!

Tell that to Phillip Rivers, Ben Rothlisberger, Jay Cutler, Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco and Mark Sanchez.

We're all seeing the same thing I guess but just come up with different interpretations. The seam route he tried to hit Evans on a great example. He doesn't have that deep ball down the middle. Anything he throws deep is to the outside. 1) Yes Trent can throw 50 - 60 yards in the air via a high arching rainbow pass not a laser. 2) "Staying in there" only to deliver the ball late is not good QB play. Either this means Trent doesn't make quick decisions and get the ball out quickly OR he doesn't have the arm strength to deliver the deep ball such that the WR doesn't have to slow down for it. ONE OF THESE THINGS MUST BE TRUE!!!! 3) What more do I need? I don't need anything but more arm strength gives a QB more options on how to deliver the ball. 4) VERY common response but no one has said a big arm guarantees success in the NFL nor that a small arm guarantees failure. 5) We have had a few guys that could have been the "Best QB we've had since Kelly". Edwards by far has the best supporting cast of those candidates. I think Edwards CAN be that guy and he should. No excuses anymore.

There is some truth to what you say. I feel that this rehashed argument comes down to two camps for the people that know anything. Timing vs arm strength. Some like myself say that he doesn't have a strong arm. Some say he throws the ball late. TRUE if he did throw the ball earlier and trust his WR he would be better at hitting them in stride at the distance that his arm IS capable of. I am personally in the "not strong" arm camp because I constantly hear how Trent is so smart, makes quick decisions and gets the ball out quickly. WEEELLLLLLLL if this is really the case then how can throwing the ball late and timing be his issue? Sounds like a contradiction to me. Trent being a smart, quick decisions maker who gets the ball out quickly but doesn't have a strong arm and throws short makes more sense as those two statements don't contradict each other.

WRONG!!!! I did watch last weeks games and I saw under thrown deep balls. What is getting REALLY old is people trying to defend his arm strength!!! You don't need to be able to throw a football through a wall to be a good NFL QB. Trent could end up being our starter for MANY years and do a great job at it, but PLEASE, stop saying he has a strong arm!!! He doesn't! He throws rainbows down field that are generally under thrown not LASERS like the big boys. There are weaker arms than Trent's but there are several more that are stronger.

10 Million a year!?!?!?!?!? ARE YOU HIGH!?!?!?!?!?! If we wouldn't pay a pro bowl LT his due why would we pay an adequate QB 10 mil a year??

Absolutely!!! Being a former JP supporter coaching and the offensive coordinator you are working with can make a HUGE difference. Trent actually looks like an NFL QB this year. Previously he did nothing to impress and actually regressed the second half of last season. AVP steps in, we get TO, an athletic line and suddenly Trent looks competent with some promise of things to come. If he cleans up his deep ball, which he tends to under throw or throw late depending on if you think his problem is arm strength or timing, we could have something here.

He's probably just echoing a mantra of the JP haters out there. When Losman was replaced as a starter and Trent took over for a while, JP actually had a better QB rating, more TDs per game and I think a better completion percentage. Trent supporters always used to throw out that Trent had a better win loss record. Of course they didn't bother to mention that through the first MANY games of Edwards career he never beat a team that ended up with a winning record. I didn't buy the argument then that win loss record was the defining statistic for a QB for exactly the reason you point out. Teams win games not QBs.

I'm pickin' up what you're layin' down and I won't quibble on the percentage that passing represents of a TE's duties. He was however pretty good at that part of the job. He wasn't fast, he wasn't incredibly athletic he just somehow got open and caught passes. Blocking is VERY important to the TE position or they would just be big slow WRs. I was not impressed with Schouman as a blocker so I don't know that Stupar or Nelson could be any worse.

Our previous "GMs" didn't hit on every draft pick or free agent pickup to be sure but nothing is guaranteed. Russ has made some TOUGH decisions and I haven't agreed with everyone of them I can tell ya that. As I have said before, so far so good!

How does an actor become president?

Sounds like Russ Brandon to me!!!!....Well ultimately I think the hiring and firing of coaches is Ralphie but other than that it sounds like what Brandon does. I guess the point is ... what's in a name?

I beg to differ. Byrd is seeing playing time and being burned for TDs.