4thand1

Hey did you read that BB cheated for the last nine years in order to win. He might be the best person ever. Patriots record vs Bills since spygate: 4-0 Total points scored by both teams combined: Patriots 127, Bills 27 Good thing they don't have spygate holding them back anymore

Hey Matt, I just found out that Jarvis Green threw a bubble gum wrapper on the ground instead of throwing it into a trash can. He might be the worst person I've ever seen.

Matt, are you even a Bills fan? I think if a Patriots player took a dump and didn't flush the toilet you'd post it here and call him the worst human being ever.

I kind of feel bad for the Bills, it's really been one sided. I wouldn't mind the Patriots throwing them a bone, that way there won't be any undefeated talk to worry about. Patriots will probably go 15-1.

Apparently you didn't bother reading the article. A Patriots spokesman said he doubts Brady is aware of Paiva's situation. Police caught him on surveillance video. Shortly thereafter, Paiva said he received a call from a Boston police detective. We DO live in an age of pure and utter douchebaggery, where people throw out accusations and assumptions without knowing or bothering to read the whole story (that's right in front of them).

He should have retired after 2006. Retire already and let Guyton/Woods/Crable step up.

Don't you know? We all became Patriots fans on February 4th, 2002.

This is what they don't seem to get, no matter how many times you repeat it. And like I said a few pages back, their reputation isn't going to change much if their titles were stripped. Bills and Steelers fans would still be whining, while Saints and Bengals fans wouldn't care.

Being a janitor at Ralph Wilson stadium doesn't mean you're in the league, Matt. You still haven't answered my question about how the Bills fared against the Patriots in games that weren't after the bye week. And puking up links from Dr. Z and the New York times, wondering if the league was too light on Belichick, or maybe they did something else, or they were accused of this or that, is really impressive. You sure owned me. I don't think if I went to a Saints or Bengals website that they would care much about spygate anymore. Even Jets fans have mostly moved on. The owners have, as well. But no, let's ignore them, ignore Jay Fiedler, ignore Jimmy Johnson, ignore Herm Edwards, and let's go with the guys who really know what they're talking about. Dr Z, Arlen Specter, and a few angry Buffalo Bills fans.

Don't be silly, everyone else in the NFL is a perfect little angel. With the halo and everything. Only one evil scum organization can do anything wrong.

From what I've seen, the Jets are number 2 in most people's minds. The Dolphins are expected to regress. The Patriots (with all of their injuries) lost to the Dolphins 38-13 only to come back and beat them 48-28 (without a bye week). Division games are important, but the Patriots could bring out a QB with no arms and no legs and still beat the Bills, bye or no bye. How about this, what has the Bills record been against the Patriots in the other games played, not after the bye week? "Dr. Z" can wonder all he wants. Other organizations (you know, the guys who supposedly got "screwed" out of potentially millions of dollars) agreed with the investigation and are ready to move on. Heck, even Tim Graham said that Jay Fiedler had no problem with spygate, and that they wouldn't know the Dolphins calls anyways.

The Bills have been the biggest rival of the Patriots the last 4 years? Don't you have to win a game in that time span to be considered a rival? Unless the Patriots have had two bye weeks in a regular season, there is no reason for you to complain. Everyone in the NFL gets one bye week. And I'm sure it really hurt the Bills chances of winning against the Patriots. Just think, they may have only lost 52-10 instead of 56-10. They could beat the Bills in their sleep. If they had had a bye week each of the last 4 years with the Colts as the next game afterwards, then you might have a point.

Yeah, I looked it up briefly. I don't care what Marshawn did by the way, but Matt seems to hold a grudge against every thing every Patriots player ever did (I bet he's called Brady a deadbeat dad at some point), but Kaczur was busted and agreed to help get the dealer, Marshawn caught with a gun and marijuana was after he was involved in a hit and run and he only got 3 games for it anyways.

You've got to be kidding me. They haven't HAD to draft a difference maker on either line. Wilfork, Warren, and Seymour are all under 30 and good/great players. As for the o-line, they gave up 21 sacks in 2007. The 47 or so that they gave up in 2008 was as much Matt Cassel as it was them. In addition, once Stephen Neal came back I never noticed an issue with Cassel getting sacked often like he did earlier. Hmm...let's see. Painkillers VS carrying a concealed weapon and having marijuana AFTER he was involved in a hit and run. Yeah, let's crucify the guy with the painkillers. He's a Patriot, after all. And we all know only Patriots players do bad things. And after he was caught, Kaczur agreed to help bust a drug dealer or whatever. I don't know the details, but I'm sure you do. I also had to look up Marshawn's case because I really don't care otherwise, but yeah, you probably shouldn't be arguing about that.

Yep, you're right. Warren in 2003, Wilfork in 2004, Mankins and Kaczur in 2005. None of them are "worth a crap". Meriweather was a rookie in 2007. Meanwhile those stellar Bills drafts have ALMOST gotten you a .500 record.

Don't need a link, it's common sense. They went 11-5 with a ton of injuries. The Bills are healthy and they can't finish .500 Bad drafts? Yeah, Mayo aside...and Meriweather...and the whole o-line and d-lines, etc The Bills will win 34-0? They haven't even put up that many points in all 4 games combined the last two seasons against the Patriots. Nice dig about the Giants, go back to the 60's if you want to insult somebody like that.

It doesn't look like they'll be sucking anytime soon, so we don't have to worry about that.

And yet, other NFL organizations seemed satisfied with the investigation. Specter isn't a Patriots fan, he is an Eagles fan, though. You left out two more *'s on the last two "he's"

You probably should be locked away somewhere. The Bills have lost the last 4 games 56-10, 38-7, 20-10, and 13-0. Are you really complaining about officiating? Randy Moss was considered washed up, he was picked up on the cheap because the Raiders wanted nothing to do with him. Miking, turning off mics in opponents helmets? Sounds like some of the stuff from Matt's link. You know, the accusations that had no proof.

Probably because they ignored the memo that was sent out in 2006 warning teams against taping in certain locations. The Patriots blew leads in the 4th quarter of all 3 Super Bowl games, so I fail to see how it played a "large role". I mentioned the Panthers being on steroids because the only time anybody mentions the Panthers in regards to the Patriots is that they were cheated out of that Super Bowl. But yeah, I guess it's okay for the Panthers to break the rules. New life? Like Junior Seau coming back in 2008 and looking downright pathetic at times?

The committee heard accusations that the Patriots had taped opposing coaches’ signals, placed microphones on defensive players to steal quarterbacks’ audible signals and manipulated clocks and coach-to-quarterback radio systems. The league has handled the complaints internally, finding no proof for all but one, which was lodged by the Jets last year, said its chief spokesman, Greg Aiello. In the Jets case last fall, when the Patriots were caught using video cameras to film defensive signals, the team and its coach, Bill Belichick, were fined, and the team forfeited a first-round draft pick. Since then, a former team employee has sent the league videotapes containing evidence of similar spying dating to 2000. Okay, so these complaints were looked into, and found no proof for any of them except the taping against the Jets (and the Patriots were punished for this), and you still are claiming that they did these things? As far as the Steelers game goes, it was such a phantom call that there was no mention of it at all in the game summary. Let me guess, it was one of those phantom calls that really was the correct call, but because it negated a big play and had to do with the Patriots, it was a phantom call. Kind of like the Patriots O-Line getting away with holding on every play, even when they're on the sideline.

What evidence? The six spygate tapes that had Herm Edwards waving to the camera and the footage of the Chargers' cheerleaders cleavage and butts? This is the kind of guy I mentioned that would still think the Patriots were cheating even if a full scale investigation were to occur and they were found to have done nothing else.

Wouldn't the 4th quarter of the Super be a good situation to use that cheat sheet? Yet they blew a 14 point lead to the Rams, an 11 point lead to the Panthers (who by the way took steroids before that game, funny how nobody ever mentions that, I suppose it's because they aren't the Patriots), and giving up 7 and having to stop the Eagles on one more drive in SB39. The best I can do is look at the results of the games actually played, and for the most part, the games they won and lost don't match up with a team who knew what plays were coming. I'm all for a deeper investigation, if they get caught doing worse things, it wouldn't change anything, people like MattM think they're cheating in ways other than spygate anyways. But if nothing else happened, some, not all, would maybe get off their back. But even so, there would still be plenty of people who would say that the league and other still covering for the Patriots. That's right, the guys with millions of dollars on the line who were "cheated" out of that money, are still covering up for the benefit of the league.

Well, let's see. Folks already seem to feel it is like a WWF league. Robert Kraft has Goodell in his back pocket, right? Yet Super Bowls 42 and 43 were the most watched ever, I think. If the Patriots were wiped out completely, right now, would you keep watching? Although looking at your posting history MattM, about 90 percent of your posts have to do with the Patriots, so I should ask somebody else. Anyone else? Spygate is deemed the worst offense ever in sports, so the Patriots organization is done away with completely. Do you feel that it's now a WWF type league and you'll stop watching? What other cheating do you suspect they have done? And I don't know what "phantom" holding call you're referring to, the Patriots have faced the Steelers several times in the playoffs over the past 12 years or so. Which playoff game was it?

I think you guys are severely overestimating the "brotherhood" of the NFL, by saying other NFL teams were sweeping it under the rug for the better part of the league, or nonsense like saying Jay Fiedler's words don't matter because he's spouting the company line. If these teams truly felt that spygate screwed them out of millions of dollars, then do you really think they would have stood for it? An example, in 2003, the Patriots beat the Titans and then hosted the Colts at Gillette. Now let's say spygate was the reason why they beat the Titans (it didn't appear to, seeing as how they beat the Titans by 8 in the regular season and only 3 in the playoffs, more on that in a second), take spygate and cheating out, and the Titans win, and instead they go to Indianapolis. So Indy is now hosting a playoff game and Tennessee is still in it. I don't know how much each team would take in money wise for hosting playoff games, but you're also talking about merchandise like the lame t-shirts that say "conference champion", and also Super Bowl apparel for one of those two teams that win. And perhaps one of those two teams beats the Panthers in the Super Bowl. Now they've got super bowl champion videos, clothing, mugs, etc. Heck, even if they lost, now the Panthers have those things instead. We're talking about millions and millions of dollars here. Trust me, you shouldn't undestimate what money means to people. I said that the Patriots beat the Titans by less the second time around than the first time in 2003, and you can go all through the decade seeing numbers like that. The Dolphins, in my opinion, have been the worst of the AFC East teams this decade, yet they've more or less have gone even with the Patriots this decade. I would think divisional opponents would be the best example. Of course the Patriots have dominated the Bills, but the Bills played scared every time they face New England. Other examples of this would be, say, the Eagles in 2003. The Patriots beat them 31-10. Go forward a year and a half later, and those magical stolen signals should have made Super Bowl 39 a blowout.....right? Steelers fans are the biggest whiners when it comes to spygate, but look at the details of the 2001 AFCCG. That was the first time Belichick played the Steelers as head coach in New England (and thus was cheating). That game was won by two special teams touchdowns. It was the first time the Patriots themselves had faced the Steelers since 1998, and Belichick himself had not faced the Steelers since 1996 I believe it was. They had to face teams they hadn't faced in years during this decade of success, and they pretty much beat everyone whether it was the first time playing them or not. The best examples you could use against it helping the Patriots was against the Rams in 2001 (Patriots lost the first meeting by 7) and the Steelers in 2004 (Patriots lost the first meeting by 14). But Antowain Smith fumbled at the 1 yard line in that 2001 game, and the Patriots went up on the Steelers 24-3 at halftime in the second meeting. I've seen people say that they cheat by "learning all the signals at halftime", and yet the Steelers scored 24 points in the second half in 2004 and the Rams outscored the Patriots 14-6 in the second half in the Super Bowl. Well, you could argue that they never lose the second time in a season against the same opponent. But the 2004 team lost to the Dolphins the second go around, and the Broncos and Colts in 2005 and 2006 in the playoffs, and I'm sure it happened a few times in the two crappy seasons they had since they started cheating, 2000 and 2002.